Did PWK Intend For Klipsch Speakers To Be Equalized ?

[ka7niq]

I am not here to bash Klipsch Speakers, and the ones I have owned did some nice things, just never made me want to keep them.

I do not use tone controls, or equalizers.

I remember meeting Mark Levinson years ago.

I went to dinner with him, and the store owners that sold his Levinson Product.

We all had a few drinks after dinner, and I asked Mark, what, in his opinion, was the best speakers I could buy.

To my suprise, he told me he had Klipschorns at home, with the tweeters removed, and placed vertically on top the cabinet for better imaging.

He used a equalizer from hell on the, that later became known as the Cello Audio Pallette, after Sandy Berlin ripped him off, and stole Levinson from him.

Mark felt that properly equalized and modded Klipschorns represented just about the ultimate speakers.

Now, a Cello Audio Pallette costs BIG Money~

I have a Yamaha RX V1 that does have a 5 or 6 band digital Equalizer in it, and I am thinking about trying it on my Cornwall 2's.

I am new to equalization, any tips, comments ?

I have always beeen a no tone controls, much less equalizers type of audiophile.

In fact, NONE of my pre amps have tone controls.

Mark Levinson told me you want as much efficiency as you can get in a speaker, then you simply EQ it to souind like you want ?

BEC just basically told me the same thing, so how to you go about it ?

Do you measure, or just listen ?

Any tips, tricks, etc ?

What EQ bands effect speech when you listen to TV, watch movies ?

This EQ stuff is all new to me, and any tips, comments, will be appreciated.

[Romak]

Isn't that kind of a personal preference kinda thing? If it works for you.....go for it.[Y]

[neo33]

I'd think that PWK dislikes equalization.

[ka7niq]

I'd think that PWK dislikes equalization.

Well, hopefully, we will find OUT what PWK said about EQ in this thread ?

[greg928gts]

I'm also a "no EQ, no tone control" kind of audiophile. Heck, I'm even a "no preamp" audiophile!

My opinion on EQ or any other kind of active processing that is injected into the signal path, is that you will gain control and be able to tailor the signal, but you will also add some negative effects to the signal as well. The added complication of wiring and multiple components that the signal must pass through, often takes some of the purity out of it.

I like the control of an EQ, and after playing around with one for a while, I'll sit back and listen to the music and I enjoy the effects of the changes I've made. But then I'll take the EQ out and even though the desired contouring is gone, the whole presentation just seems more real. It's like the processing takes the "life" out of the music.

I will always try to keep my main system in my living room void of as much processing as possible.

Greg

[DTLongo]

It's a darn shame that Klipschorns lack "equalization" in the sense that the factory crossover is fixed with no way to adjust relative mid- and tweeter range levels for room and/or the listener's preference. I always thought ny '03 Khorns were too hot, the midrange overwhelmed the bass. But there was no way to adjust for that. Which is a shame since Klipschorn bass, really heard, is something to behold (sic). I've since upgraded the midrange + tweeter Xovers (ALK) and that helped significantly. But adjustable crossovers appear to have been a blind spot of the Klipsch Co. since PWK's days.

[ka7niq]

I'm also a "no EQ, no tone control" kind of audiophile. Heck, I'm even a "no preamp" audiophile!

My opinion on EQ or any other kind of active processing that is injected into the signal path, is that you will gain control and be able to tailor the signal, but you will also add some negative effects to the signal as well. The added complication of wiring and multiple components that the signal must pass through, often takes some of the purity out of it.

I like the control of an EQ, and after playing around with one for a while, I'll sit back and listen to the music and I enjoy the effects of the changes I've made. But then I'll take the EQ out and even though the desired contouring is gone, the whole presentation just seems more real. It's like the processing takes the "life" out of the music.

I will always try to keep my main system in my living room void of as much processing as possible.

Greg

I am told Digital EQ is free of the penaltys you get with analog EQ ?

[ka7niq]

Yes, mids and tweeters level controls are a good thing, IMHO.

If not, you are stuck with the speakers voicing

[Dennie]

I had the chance to pick up one of these shortly after I bought my La Scala's.

It is a Audio Control C101-lll Real Time Analyzer, Full Octave Eq.

Here is a good review, with good information----> CLICK HERE

I use it to cut the offending frequencies from the room and it has really made a difference. I don't adjust it to the music I'm currently listening to, I set it and forget it. Every now and then if something is moved around in the room, I will hook the mic. up and "re-analyze" the room.

Hope this helps,

Dennie

[greg928gts]

I'm also a "no EQ, no tone control" kind of audiophile. Heck, I'm even a "no preamp" audiophile!

My opinion on EQ or any other kind of active processing that is injected into the signal path, is that you will gain control and be able to tailor the signal, but you will also add some negative effects to the signal as well. The added complication of wiring and multiple components that the signal must pass through, often takes some of the purity out of it.

I like the control of an EQ, and after playing around with one for a while, I'll sit back and listen to the music and I enjoy the effects of the changes I've made. But then I'll take the EQ out and even though the desired contouring is gone, the whole presentation just seems more real. It's like the processing takes the "life" out of the music.

I will always try to keep my main system in my living room void of as much processing as possible.

Greg

I am told Digital EQ is free of the penaltys you get with analog EQ ?

I've heard that said too. I don't agree. However, there is certainly a wide range in the quality of components out there.

Greg

[wuzzzer]

ka7niq,

Does your computer or internet browser automatically hit return after each sentence typed or are you doing that? []

[ka7niq]

Think it is the browser. here we go. I keep typing sentences. Not hitting return. Lets see what happens. This forum is different.

I just hit return here, no preview function, lets post to see what hapens ?

[ka7niq]

ka7niq,

Does your computer or internet browser automatically hit return after each sentence typed or are you doing that?

I do that. Lets see what happens if I dont ? Short sentences. Will forum make them look right w/o hitting return ?

[DrWho]

PWK put EQ in his horns and in his passive xovers, and the EQ's got more advanced over the years. I think it very safe to say that PWK was a fan of EQ.

[wuzzzer]

Interesting. I just thought maybe you were hitting enter after each sentence. I'm bored and I notice weird things.

[neo33]

Can you provide reference materials that indicate PWK used EQ?

PWK put EQ in his horns and in his passive xovers, and the EQ's got more advanced over the years. I think it very safe to say that PWK was a fan of EQ.

[o0O Bill O0o]

Yes, he did intend his speaker to be equilalzed.

Turning this in to a "EQ" Thread. To state you are a "no EQ Guy" with the knowledge that the entire music industry uses EQs it a use at your own risk choice..

There is the RIAA, X-Curve, Academy Curve, etc.. Google it. Equalization is a common and needed tool in all types of audio reproduction.

The most popular curve is the "Smile" curve. Google it. but take the human audio spectrum and draw a curve from high on the 20Hz side dip to the middle band and then curve back up to 20KHz. Thus the "Smile" Some speakers have it built in and that is why they may say no eq needed.

You think those pre 1980's recordings were FLAT? heck no. With time and technology, recording artist are producing more flatter music, but they are also killing dynamic range ( but that is a whole topic for another thread--oh and google it)

My understanding- for today's playback you want to make your system "pink noise" flat at the listening position. That include use of Acoustic eq or Room treatment AND electronic EQ. So when you play your music back the only way the audio spectrum is changed is thru the music that you're playing. in other words the music dictates the eq and experience. Just like the professionals in the sound booth intended ( and how they heard it).

Now, most enthusiast have to compete with Auto, Living space, spouse, kids, pets, and other factors in order to achieve playback, do you really think EQ is the issue? The reality is most are listening to compressed music in cars ( who sounds systems are less than ideal ) and a small percentage really know what there are doing. Think about it, it was possible to gather all the Klipsch users in one spot and compare to the rest of the populus, then take away the ones who don't know about proper set-up and playback, and see what you get...

[Edgar]

I am told Digital EQ is free of the penaltys you get with analog EQ ?

At the fundamental level, filtering is filtering, and "analog" or "digital" is merely a detail of implementation.

However, it's a LOT easier to make a good digital filter than a good analog filter. Think about it; 24-bit arithmetic is roughly comparable to components having 0.00001% tolerance.

Greg

[George Roland]

Very interesting thread! I have no way of knowing for certain, but the fact that PWK put no user-adjustable controls on his speakers suggests that he thought it was his job to get the speaker correct and the user's job to get appropriate electronics and adjust speaker placement and the room for best results.

I am interested to hear that Mark Levinson had Klipschorns! What was the year when your meeting took place?

As a Quad fancier, I have heard of an HQD system Mark Levinson put together using a stacked pair of Quad 57s, with an additional tweeter and a pair of 18" subs.

[deafbykhorns]

I would have loved to hear that Quad system. My friend has a pair of 57's and I would consider it a reference speaker requiring little EQ or none. Back to the EQ, don't the sound engineers remix and EQ the original recording based on their enterpretation? Your ears may be different and require you to increase the bass or reduce the mids, hence the requirement for an EQ. I had one in my system for over 20 years until ALK came up with the multi-tap auto transformer in his crossovers. [Y]