What Loudspeakers have the lowest depreciation? Klipschorns?

[o0O Bill O0o]

I was doing a bunch of research about vehicles and those who purchase vehicles for investments. Then I got to thinking which speakers out there have the lowest depreciation? Consider today a good set of 1970's Klipschorns used will sell at ~$2000. Then goes up for special editions. Consider new Klipschorns and what they will be worth in 20 years. I've seen B&W 800 Series hold on to their value. still after 20 years they depreciated very much.

[dtel]

Good question but very hard to answer because it depends on too many things that can change. Like the economy and if new ones are being made and if there are improvements and the cost.

[artarama]

I think you could make a case for the speakers of your choice just like any vintage car.

eg: take the new selling price of a pair of Khorns in 1970 and subtract the current average selling price ($2,000). That's your depreciation. (probably not appreciation, like a lot of cars, if you buy used could be a different story).

Now if you take the amount you paid in 1970 and did a time value of money calculation, projecting forward to 2011 and then subtracted the $2K you would see the real $ cost ("Opportunity" cost??)

But then who can put a value on 40 years of sonic bliss. I would say at almost any price those Khorns are a real bargin!

[russ69]

Well, my brother is about to buy a set of Infinity RS-1Bs, they were under 6000 and he's paying 5000 for a mint 20 some year old pair. You might also look at a JBL Paragon they are selling for 6 or 10 times their original price. The real answer is that a 10 dollar pair of crap speakers would save you the most money. hi-fi is not about appreciation of value, it's way closer to total depreciation.

[merkin]

I f you don't ever sell them they can't depreciate

[JBryan]

If you're talking vintage, looking back is easy... for example, most 60's era Klipsch speakers have doubled or tripled in value while JBL's and Altecs have tripled or quadrupled on average, mostly because they were pretty expensive to begin with at the time. But for the best return for a brand name may go to the classic Tannoys. I was just looking it up and a pair of Windsor cabinets with the 'Gold' 15" concentric drivers - originally $800/pr. now sell in the neighborhood of $3K-7K, depending on condition. Most folks just sell the drivers and xovers and toss or burn the cabinets..yikes!

I you're considering buying new and want to forecast into the future, its not so easy because any current model/brand will depreciate immediately and may or may not gather a following down the road. If you're just looking at Khorns, recent limited runs like the 60th anniversary edition may not bring much more of a premium over the standard model now but because of its low production numbers, may become quite the collectible down the road. Over the long run, the stock market has always beaten the collectibles market but with audio, at least you can enjoy your investment while you wait for a return. Have fun.

[Chris A]

I was doing a bunch of research about vehicles and those who purchase vehicles for investments. Then I got to thinking which speakers out there have the lowest depreciation?

Interestingly, if you consider the depreciation of "preowned" speakers, i.e., buying used and selling used (...I note that few people here are buying anything new except maybe HT speakers...), then the equation changes. The real question is what are you willing to invest, absolute dollar wise, in your used-speaker recycling project. I'd say that some Klipsch Heritage is presently a good market, especially Belles. La Scalas look a bit clunky and have low WAF. Khorns are just so imposing, but are sellable because they are placed into corners.

What type of buyers are presently buying these used speakers? Aging baby-boomers...a market that will begin to shift when they can no longer enjoy 2-channel or enhanced HTs due to of loss of income (especially if Social Security goes belly up).

I'd bet on buying the best-sounding speakers that are "pretty" and not too big over the next 15+ years or so. Fully depreciated Belles and MAYBE some pretty La Scalas would probably be on that list. Tannoy and B&W? You bet--especially in Europe. Altec? Not so much--they aren't as refined for home use, generally. JBL? l I think that few people have actually heard Hartsfields and they may be very disappointed when they do--but they look pretty. However, Everest IIs will likely hold their value well. Bose? Probably not. They just don't sound very good after living with them a while. But they're small, typically.

But who is paying really big bucks for speakers from companies that died--like Bozak and Frazier? Used dipole and line speakers, like Martin-Logan, McIntosh (line-array models), and Magnepan generally haven't held their value. Maybe component life is the issue.

We live in an ever increasing information-driven society whose main proponents are today's young people, and they typically feed off of web-based and iPhone-based rumor. So the speakers have got to sound really outstanding, IMHO. I believe that today's young people generally will not live in houses as large as baby boomers have now: more reasonable are home sizes like those found in Europe today. Really big speakers aren't going to fare as well under that scenario.

Chris

[juniper8]

Cask 05 How does Jean Hiraga get 20,000 a pair for unrefined Altec speakers?

[Chris A]

My comments are generally about used speakers under about $2000 resale value and small enough to fit into a smaller home. I'm also thinking about how the market will progress over the next decade or two - not today's prices.

Altec really screwed up in the 80's-->ff. Their VOTT series are "pretty rough", generally speaking. I'm also thinking that EV Patricians will become less attractive over time. Khorns are better sounding speakers, IMHO, and are actually smaller. They are much more available, hence the lower prices for Khorns. But you really can't go wrong on them in terms of their sound.

I'm betting that the "feeding frenzy" on JBL Hartsfields and Paragons (...a beast in size...) will subside over time.

One notable brand to watch: Quad speakers--prices are increasing.

My $0.02 only. []

Chris

[Zen Traveler]

I will make the case for either the RF-7 or RB-75...The former I purchased 9 years ago and feel like I could make close to my money back and the latter I am sure I could sell for at least as much as I paid and feel they are worth more given there is nothing in Klipsch current Lineup that compares.

[russ69]

Chris,

I think you have summed it up pretty well. Although I don't think the Paragon will ever go down in value. The people that have the money to spend on that decorator item will have houses big enough to put them in. Demand is high and I think they will hold up.

Khorns on the other hand are fairly common and hard to place so prices will stay reasonable. Good summary.

[Guest " "]

What used gear sells for today is simply supply and demand. Right now, it's a buyers market. Prices are, have, and will continue to fall. Fundamentally, the basic guiding principle is if you want to buy low, shop craigslist, local papers, etc. If you want to sell hi, sell it here or audigon. If you want a crap shoot, sell it on ebay.

[Ironsave]

I would guess that whatever speakers that were really good sounding/ quality AND rare will depreciate the least.

Look at the EV Patricians or Centurions...... Pretty hard to find in mint shape; and when you can; they will likely not be cheap.

(This does not include "the little old lady who has no clue what they are" scenario)....

My .02.....

[thebes]

Then there's the whole weirdness factor to speaker buying. For example these Jensen (yes that's our good friend Audiovox Jensen), drivers just went for over $11K! Rumor is they came out of a Pinto.

Those JBL consoles previously mentioned are just flat out cool. I suspect, however, they are sold more as furniture/collectible/style than sound.