Daddy Dee Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 OK, I'm not the sharpest knife in the drawer, but I am curious about the English translation of these German cities. Have you noticed that "Berlin" is the same in German and English? However, "Munich" in English is "Munchen" in German. Any help appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryC Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 From Wiki: The origin of the name Berlin is unknown, but it may have its roots in the language of West Slavic inhabitants of the area of today's Berlin, and be related to the Old Polabian stem berl-/birl- ("swamp").[21]Folk etymology connects it to the German Bär, a bear, and a bear appears in the coat of arms of the city. Its native name, München, is derived from the Old High German Munichen, meaning "by the monks' place". The city's name derives from the monks of the Benedictine order who founded the city; hence the monk depicted on the city's coat of arms. Black and gold—the colours of the Holy Roman Empire—have been the city's official colours since the time of Ludwig the Bavarian. Dee, I know you can Google with the best of us, but, in addition to the above, I thought the comment below from Yahoo Answers is interesting. We don't see place names change like that in the U.S., but then we don't have a thousand-plus-year history of conquests and re-conquests, dialect and out-and-out language changes, etc. You probably know how great the differences are between early English or Middle German and current versions. I sure can't understand Chaucer in the original! From Yahoo Answers (which doesn't seem to fully answer your question IMO): Why is muenchen called munich in english? i was just wondering why americans call the city "munich" and germans call it "muenchen." i'm not an idiot, i know that germany auf deutsch ist deutschland, but i just was simply wondering why we still call berlin berlin, paris paris, and tokyo tokyo, etc. and yes, we don't say fenster in english instead of window, but in germany (unless, of course, the german 2 textbook is wrong) they still call new york new york. Best Answer - Chosen by Asker Many German place names have Latin roots, which were at some time in history (when we had got rid of the Romans) Germanized, but in other countries kept their Roman form in the beginning and were then Anglicised or Frenchised or whatever. The most prominent examples are maybe München and Köln, which became Munich and Cologne -- in my opinion for the sole reason that American typewriters don't have a ü or ö, and Anglosaxons can't pronounce a ü or ö sound. That's the way people adapt place names to their language. Take the Polish capital, for instance: Its name is Warszawa, the Germans say Warschau, and in English you say Warsaw. [Origin of "Berlin" is uncertain.]Your textbook is not necessarily wrong, but there was a time when Germans called "New York" "Neu-York". The Dutch, I believe, would have liked to keep calling it "Nieeuw Amsterdam" (I'm not sure about my Dutch spelling). Only the cities with names that can be easily pronounced kept their names through times, but even those vary: Roma (Italian) - Rom (German) - Rome (English). Praha (Czech) - Prag (German) - Prague (English). Moskwa (Russian) - Moskau (German) - Moscow (English). And so forth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quiet_Hollow Posted February 9, 2012 Share Posted February 9, 2012 No practical advice to offer regarding the tranlations, but I can relate. [{] A colleague of mine that lives over there was kind enough to send me a gift in the form of a world map published with all the EU political names, out of witnessing my frustration with this exact issue. I kept pestering him during my visit, "Well if it's Deutschland, why the heck am I the only egg-head calling it Germany?" [*-)] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Groomlakearea51 Posted February 9, 2012 Share Posted February 9, 2012 Old style "anglicization", etc. Same thing with english version of many Indian cities; what we used to call Bombay has now reverted (in common useage) to Mumbai. Anglicised european names (which came into common useage in the late 1500's in England) dates back to emmisaries from the courts, and cartographers who produced maps for those various courts. It was a very common practice, and until quite recently In the case of "Koln" (with the umlaut dots over o), the name Cologne was simply how the English pronounced Koln. Has to do with the correct pronunciation and what a non-german speaker hears and attempts to duplicate. Thus... The origins of these "quirks" was so explained to me when I was in a Brit school back in the day... This during the lecture on the poor use of the King's English by us "colonials" who cannot spell "colour" correctly (LOL!!!).. [H] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted February 9, 2012 Share Posted February 9, 2012 Marshall mentioned the Latin origin of Cologne, but I thought I'd add it's actual original name was Colonia Aggripinensium after the Roman general who founded it as a fortification. I've always been an aficionado of Roman roots and one of my favorite theories (almost limited to me from what I can tell) is that Camelot as a seat of a just and noble warrior ruler of a free people is from the Latin Camulodunum, now Colchester. Of course, "chester" is decended from the Latin "castrum" or fortification and many British cities bear this in their names. Camulodunum is claimed to be the oldest town in Britain as recorded by the Romans, existing as a Celtic settlement before the Roman conquest, when it became the first Roman town. There is archaeological evidence of settlement 3,000 years ago. Its Celtic name was "Camulodunon", meaning "the Fortress of Camulos" (Camulos being a British god equated with the Roman Mars). This name was modified to the Roman spelling of "Camulodunum". It was the first Roman adminstrative center in Britain which underscores its previous incarnation as the capital of free British before the Roman occupation. It was the capital of the Trinoventes, one of the great tribes of Britain, and the Romans added insult to injury by forcing them to build a temple to Claudius there. Itit was destroyed and the Romans massacred by Boudica and an army of Trinoventes and Iceni. Boudicca's valiant revolt and attempt to re-establish "Camelot" and British freedom ended in the Battle of Watling Street not too far away. Arthurian mythology draws on many sources and mixes them together freely, but the history of Camulodunum and it's phonetic similarity to "Camelot" (for which I know of no other British place names at all similar) makes me believe that is where that part of the legend originated. Sorry for the morning musing... Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Groomlakearea51 Posted February 9, 2012 Share Posted February 9, 2012 Emperor: The coffee is strong in this one.... Vader: So it would seem..... [] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Groomlakearea51 Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 Rick, I zapped him.... LOL!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 Rick, I zapped him.... LOL!!! [Y] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Groomlakearea51 Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 [Y] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 Those dancing girls are one of the best things I've ever seen, I'm very easy to please... [] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boxx Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 Why are men named Charles called Chuck? Why are men named Richard called Dick? Why are men named Lawrence called Larry? Something to ponder while watching the dancing girls.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timmikid Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Your textbook is not necessarily wrong, but there was a time when Germans called "New York" "Neu-York". The Dutch, I believe, would have liked to keep calling it "Nieeuw Amsterdam" (I'm not sure about my Dutch spelling). The correct spelling is "Nieuw", pronounced almost as new. Most Dutch don't mind the name New York. What's most important is that the city has more Amsterdam genes than York genes. When I get in trouble, I must remember to say to the officer: "Hey man, we gave you the donut!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timmikid Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 That's bad spacing, etc! The result of using MacBook Pro... ;( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Groomlakearea51 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Darn! I thought they had more Levi's genes... [] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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