SpikeJampton Posted July 20, 2002 Share Posted July 20, 2002 From Sunday's Dallas Morning News "Klipschorns Rare African Mahogany $2300 obo (202) 262 2203". Anyone interested? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justin_tx_16 Posted July 20, 2002 Share Posted July 20, 2002 wow! is that a pair? i might know someone who would LOVE to pick those up. ------------------ -justin SoundWise Support A technical help site created by me and my fellow Klipschers promediatech@Klipsch.com /1-888-554-5665 - RA# 800-554-7724 ext 5 s> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpikeJampton Posted July 21, 2002 Author Share Posted July 21, 2002 Justin, Unless I'm mistaken about the area code, these speakers are in Washington, DC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justin_tx_16 Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 quote: Originally posted by SpikeJampton: Justin, Unless I'm mistaken about the area code, these speakers are in Washington, DC. wow, they must be desperate if they are posting in the Dallas news paper... here are the results of skimming some ads on my own KLIPSCH 4-8.5 towers, 1 C1 center, 1 SV-10 powered sub woofer. Reduced $750. 727-421-6662 Belle Klipsch 8-16 ohm 3-way loud speaker system. Crossover points are 400 + 6000 HZ. Similar to La Scala speaker systems. $1,000 352-583-2020 H/K AVR75 receiver, 4 yr warranty $300; Peavey speakers $150; Pioneer receiver $60; Klipsch Quintet speakers $60; 309-797-0069 Klipsch 12' powered sub, $450 478-4185 Klipsch, 2-way, pd $600, sell $200. 503-244-6261 Klipsch Cornwall spkrs, excllnt cndtion, make offer, 214-521-1701 Still though... would be interested in those K-Horns if they are in good condition... ------------------ -justin SoundWise Support A technical help site created by me and my fellow Klipschers promediatech@Klipsch.com /1-888-554-5665 - RA# 800-554-7724 ext 5 s> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justin_tx_16 Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 found another... quite interesting... KLIPSCH C-5 Center spkr $95. Chorus II 3-way 2-15' subs $1299. Nothing comes close to the sound of these speakers. Tara-Labs RSC prime biwire pair 2M $100 727-864-9324 C-5 for $95? ------------------ -justin SoundWise Support A technical help site created by me and my fellow Klipschers promediatech@Klipsch.com /1-888-554-5665 - RA# 800-554-7724 ext 5 s> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vavoline Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 I've spoken to the guy. He is in Dallas, but the number is a cell #, and you're right Spike, it is a DC area code. Apparantly, he's in the process of moving there. He is the second owner.I was giong to audition them on Monday, however, as my luck normally runs, I got home last night and found that my refrigerator had "crapped the bed". Since I just bought a new truck 2 weeks ago, finances won't allow both a new fridge and Khorns at this particular time. I emailed HDBRbuilder about these yesterday morning, as I had never heard of "African Mahogany". Basically, he confirmed there is no such wood. HDBRbuilder ...I'll save you some typing... Quote, HDBRbuilder "I hate to tell you this...but there is no such thing as rare african mahoghany...mahoghany is from south and Central America...and a few of the Caribbean islands. It has always been from the Americas...still is, with Honduran Mahoghany the most prevalent these days..and that is what Klipsch used...Honduran mahoghany veneers. I don't know what this seller has, but it ain't "rare african mahoghany"...could be lots of other african woods though...ebony, or zebrawood most likely...the owner obviously doesn't have a clue about the wood veneer on his speakers...the label will tell what the wood actually is..."z"= zebrawood. "e"= ebony, etc...there was a wood used for a short while that was very colorful and wild but it was from DYED logs from africa...and I personally thought it was outlandish...it may be that...but it is like either purple/black zebrawood or red zebvrawood...but AIN'T ZEBRAWOOD!! We called it "rambling rose"...in its red format...but it didn't sell worth a damn and was just too loud for most WAF factors...if you know what I mean. It may be that this owner has teak speakers and just doesn't know what they are, too!" Good luck if someone wants them. The guy said he may come off the $2300 a little. This message has been edited by Vavoline on 07-21-2002 at 08:05 AM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDBRbuilder Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 Yep, That's my story and I'm stickin to it...LOL! Teak is from Asia, true mahoghany is from south and central America...and a few Caribbean islands. There is a tendency for some woods to be called something they really aren't due to color or grain patterns or the workability of the wood itself. A good example is Luan...which is sometimes referred to as "Phillipine mahoghany"...because its grain and color lend itself to being substituted for true mahoghany...but Luan is really a very common wood there and pithy as hell...is commonly used like pine is here...as substrate for panelling and such. There have been times that ebony has been called african mahoghany, when it is actually closer kin to rosewood...being of the same general family of trees and having similar properties in color, grain texture, workability, and "oilyness" of the fiber(a good thing for oiled finishes, too!!). Rosewood, ebony, and lignum vitae are all close kin, even though ebony is native to Africa and the other two are native to the southern hemisphere of the Americas. Lignum vitae is the hardest wood on earth and very oily...it is used even today as the final plain bearing/seal on ships where their screws' shafts exit the hull into the water...nothing works better!! Too bad it is so damned hard, because its color and grain are absolutely beautiful...much like dark rosewood or lighter ebony...if it didn't require machining, due to its hardness...it would make wonderful veneers!! True mahoghany is valued for its stability under temperature and humidity changes...that is why it has been used for trimwork on ships ever since the Americas were discovered...in the same way that eastern white pine was valued for masts for sailing vessels due to its light weight and ability to "give" under stresses, instead of break...just as live oak was most valued for warship hulls due to its resiliency giving a tendency to have cannon balls bounce off of it..a la "OLD IRONSIDES"...the U.S.S. Constitution!! NOTE...the British government actually sued the U.S. over the live oak hulls on the Constitution...and the fact it was armed with more guns than frigates normally had..giving it the fighting ability more akin to a ship of the line than just a frigate...while still having the swiftness and maneuverability of the smaller "frigate" class...IOW it could run circles around a British ship of the line and almost have as much firepower!!..but the Brits lost their case in international court!!! BTW...those first warships authorized by Congress and the genius of their design led the way for the U.S. to become the world leader in warship design for well over a century!! ...and also other ship design!! LOL! First rule of woodworking is to "know thy woods and their properties" Another interesting note: There is a density scale for woods...it was established in the late 1800's because of the need for alternative gunstock materials. Since American Black Walnut had already established itself in the firearms industry as the standard for rifle gunstocks, it was given the value of "1"...all other woods' average densities are based upon this ...being a decimal fraction or a multiple of what American Black Walnut's density is...IOW...more or less than "1.000"! ------------------ I can now receive private messages This message has been edited by HDBRbuilder on 07-21-2002 at 09:21 AM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parrot Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 Fascinating post as usual, HDBRbuilder. The most unusual thing you didn't mention about the wood Lignum Vitae is that it is so dense that it sinks in water. I've got a 5-inch sample here and it is neat to pick up, it's so heavy. I just checked on the internet: Lignum Vitae has a specific gravity of 1.37. Anything greater than 1.0 will sink in pure water. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fini Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 quote: Originally posted by paulparrot: Lignum Vitae has a specific gravity of 1.37. Anything greater than 1.0 will sink in pure water. Boy, I found that out the hard way! Once, when I was marooned on a deserted island, I made a raft out of lignum vitae...Or, was I deserted on a moron island... fini Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vavoline Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 Good one fini. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lynnm Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 fini Are you sure it was the wood that was dense? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDBRbuilder Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 Different types of woods and their historical uses have always interested me...it is strange to note that the ancient Egyptians made such strong and yet delicate furniture out of ebony which came out of central Africa...especially when you consider that they had only copper and bronze tools for working it, and sharkskin and honing stones for sandpaper in those days!! Simply amazing to me!! And when you consider that the African societies of the time likely didn't have much more than stone axes to cut down an ebony tree...you gotta hand it to em...it must have taken a long time chop down one of them hardwoods with a stone axe!!!! Geez!!! Can you imagine trying to get an ebony log all the way from where you cut it down to the Nile to get it to Lower Egypt?!?!? ------------------ I can now receive private messages Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fini Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 Well, when you don't have an audio system (or T.V.)* you've got more time to do things like drag ebony logs around, I guess. fini *Or bulletin boards... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Warren Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 What!!!!!African Mahogany IS MOST CERTAINLY a wood species, the species is Khaya ivorensis and comes from, of all places, Africa. It is a red mahogany with a fine grain. Now, does a Klipschorn come in this species is a different matter(?). I'll elaborate- It comes from the Gold, Ivory and Nigerian Coasts of West Africa. This message has been edited by John Warren on 07-21-2002 at 10:44 AM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justin_tx_16 Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 John is VERY right. Khaya ivorensis Acajou; African Mahogany Distribution This species occurs in Angola, Cameroon, Congo, Côte d'Ivoire, Gabon, Ghana, Liberia, Sierra Leone, Nigeria and Zaire. Habitat In Ghana, this species occurs in many habitat types but seems to thrive best in moist and wet undisturbed evergreen forest (Hawthorne, 1995a). Population Status and Trends It is found scattered across almost the whole of Congo and is occasionally quite abundant (N'sosso, in litt. 1995). African mahogany is common in Ghana (Hawthorne, 1995a). Regeneration Trees of Khaya ivorensis can have good seed production at the age of 30; it seems that abundant seed production only occurs every 3-4 years, although some seed is produced every year. The seeds are wind dispersed (Hawthorne, 1995a). The species does not respond well to disturbance (burning or logging), as there is very little regeneration in disturbed areas. However, it does require small to medium light gaps for subsequent growth (Hawthorne, 1995a). Threats It is over-exploited for its popular timber (WCMC, 1991). Utilisation The timber is used for panelling, furniture, interior fittings and high quality joinery. Trade In 1989 Ghana exported 10,463m3 of lumber of this species. In a questionnaire survey of UK traders carried out for the ITTO, source countries for this species were given as Cameroon, Ghana, Liberia and Zaire. Gabon also exports this species; in 1987, from Port Owendo 9,667m3 were exported (IUCN, 1990), in 1994, 5,303.158 m3 were exported and in 1995, 7,510.019 m3 were exported (DIAF, 1996). In 1994, Cameroon exported 12,000 cu m and Ghana exported 11,130 cu m (ITTO, 1995b). At the end of the 1980s, with the price increases for Brazilian Mahogany and Utile, Khaya has become popular again in the UK market (WCMC, 1991). Conservation Status IUCN Category and Criteria: VU (A1c,d) (African Regional Workshop, 1996) For Ghana, Hawthorne (1995a) has classified this a scarlet star species, which means it is common but under serious threat from heavy exploitation. Reduced exploitation and full protection are required. Under the new IUCN threat categories (1994) this species is considered Vulnerable (Hawthorne, 1995b). Conservation Measures K. ivorensis is protected by law in Côte d'Ivoire and log export has been banned from Ghana and Liberia. It has been considered a priority species for in situ conservation by the FAO (1984). Pest control for Hypsilla is required This message has been edited by justin_tx_16 on 07-21-2002 at 11:10 AM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDBRbuilder Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 John, Yes...and there is also a "Philippine mahoghany"...BUT neither of these trees are akin to the REAL mahogany out of central and south America...they were named so because of their coloration and grain properties...and even though they may carry the common name of "mahogany"...that name was first given to the trees from the Americas...and their close relations. To understand the differences you have to go to the families of the trees named such. Just as the tree from which "English walnuts" come is not the "English walnut tree," but, even though it IS within the hickory/walnut family of trees...it actually came from Persia and was IMPORTED to EUROPE...to become the "European walnut/English walnut tree". African mahogany was so-named due to its tendency to have grain patterns and coloration similar to mahogany from the Americas(except in its heartwood which is extremely hard and brittle and is renowned for its ribbon-grain patterns)...but it is much "pithier" and more fast-growing than the true mahoghanies...and actually more akin to the Luan ("Phillipine mahoghany") family...and its name actually spans over more than one species of tree...depending on where in Africa it is found. Klipsch never used any of this unless it was before I worked there...the mahogany they used was of the Honduran variety of South American mahogany...which are the true mahoghanies...the African common varieties being named such well over a century later. RE: my posting about "Philippine mahoghany"...Just because it shares a common name doesn't mean it is truly what it is called. Down in these parts, some woodworkers often call black locust wood "ironwood" (ever try to cut one down?). And although there are different names for it, such as "bois d'arc" and "Horse-apple tree", "Osage Orange" is what MOST woodworkers identify the hardest wood in North America as. "African Mahogany" is just one of the names used for that tree...you mention...but it is in fact not mahoghany at all...it just tends to on occassion have some of its coloration and grain properties...but most often is prized for its durability as an extremely hard wood(the heartwood which is just a small portion of its log, as opposed to the heartwood of a true mahoghany that is the same throughout...just DENSER at the heart) and even more-so for its heartwood ribbon graining that is the most sought after...something you will not see in the same dark color in the TRUE mahoghanies...we always call "African Mahoghany" by the term Khaya around these parts...the same as we call "Philippine Mahoghany" Luan. As a matter of fact, what is often called zebrawood by some folks (who don't know the difference, but who assume that the grain pattern MUST be zebrawood)is in fact the ribbon-grained so-called "African mahoghany" heartwood or one of its kin. So-called "African mahoghany" is also kin to so-called "Phillipine mahoghany"(Luan) and to other African species such as Sapele, Makore, and Anegre...all of which produce sawdust that is extremely irritating to the sinuses and other mucous membranes. But, although these trees are called such or approach American varieties of Mahoghany in coloration and grain patterns they are NOT true mahoghanies. Don't get me wrong here...Africa DOES have SOME trees that actually ARE kin to American varieties of trees...such as African rosewood and Ebony being kin to South American rosewood and lignum vitae...being from the same families of trees!! Basically what I am trying to say is that true mahoghanies are the American varieties...the most common variety seen around today being called "Honduran"(mostly because Honduran is still plentiful and is generally harvested from "politically correct" renewed forests)...although there are other varieties of "big-leafed" South and Central American mahoghanies...the others around the world were so-named for their lumber color and grain patterns, but they are not kin to the true mahoghanies...no more than a member of the Hickory family(black walnut, butternut, pecan, mockernut hickory, shagbark hickory, etc)is kin to the oak family(white oak, red oak, water oak, Chinquipin , American chestnut, etc)does this make sense? Do you remember when everybody was calling Luan "Phillipine Mahoghany"?...I certainly do!! Why? So they could CHARGE MORE FOR IT!!! and for many years woodworkers "bought into it"...paying through the nose for Luan-veneered plywood for cabinets, but still grinning ear to ear because it was so much cheaper than "Honduran mahoghany"...until they finally realized they were being duped by the lumber companies!! into paying a higher price for something than it was actually worth!! Now you don't see it used for much more than inner plys on panelling and outer veneer on inexpensive hollow-core doors, do you? Sooner or later the woodworkers will "wise-up" to the "African mahoghany" scam, too!! The only truly valuable part of that tree's log is its minimal heartwood for its fine figuring and density!! It is a shame that folks are paying such a high price for the rest of the log!!...especially when half the time they are actually getting Sapele or Anegre instead!! When I was working in the foundry pattern shop...I had to send back lots of that African and Philippine crap that the lumber companies tried to substitute for REAL mahoghany....it AIN'T Mahoghany!!...and you can't use it for patterns or rigging in a foundry...has to be REAL AMERICAN VARIETY mahoghany or hard maple or it warps and splits all to hell when the pressure and heat is applied to it!!!...not to mention its eroding away in no time at all from the sand from the casting molds!!! (yes..."African mahoghany" was one of them that got sent back, too!!) Been there, done that!! There is really no substitute for real American varieties of Mahoghany...they are the most resistant of all fine woods in their price range to temperature and humidity changes affecting their stability, they have great workability and grain patterns, and they finish well...besides, you can actually BREATHE after sawing them up...instead of being miserable from sinus irritations!!! Except for its minimal pretty heartwood from the log, "African mahoghany" can't hold a candle to REAL mahoghany!!...no more than "Phillipine mahoghany" can!!! Both are cheap substitutes for the real thing in nothing more than their color and grain textures!!! And there is nothing "RARE" about either of them!!! ------------------ I can now receive private messages This message has been edited by HDBRbuilder on 07-21-2002 at 01:11 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Warren Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 The point is that African Mahogany is a real wood and is cataloged as belonging to the Mahogany tree family. It is NOT of the same genus as either South American or West Indies (both are Swietenia genus) Mahogany. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShapeShifter Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 Spike, If their veneer looks like the example below, I say get them if you can. I wouldn't care if the wood was grown by Tom Devil, Lucifer or... Well you get my point! http://www.grainofthought.com/deskwall.html ------------------ KLIPSCH IS MUSICf> My Systems f>s>c> This message has been edited by ShapeShifter on 07-21-2002 at 10:25 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpikeJampton Posted July 21, 2002 Author Share Posted July 21, 2002 Wes, A month ago I would have been off to see these Khorns like a shot but since then I've acquired a pair and smuggling another pair into the house without my better half noticing might be a bit of a problem! I'm just sorry that Vavoline had to drop out. It's not often that a pair of Khorns pops up in Dallas. I'd be curious to know, though, whether they are really veneered in some kind of mahogany or whether they are just birch finished to look like mahogany (if that's possible). Justin, now that we've established that these Khorns are in Dallas, perhaps your friend has a chance of getting them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShapeShifter Posted July 21, 2002 Share Posted July 21, 2002 Spike, Know exactly what you mean. Had I not gotten a Walnut pair a few weeks ago, I would be inquiring too. Affordable one's rarely surface in Southeastern Michigan. ------------------ KLIPSCH IS MUSICf> My Systems f>s>c> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.