Dayton Audio plate amplifiers

[JiminSTL]

Am closing in on a decision, and need the collective advice of the Forum on several questions relative to a 4cu ft enclosed subwoofer with a Dayton Audio UM18-22 18" Ultimax DVC Subwoofer:

 

1.  The description of the speaker says 2 ohms per coil.  Will I be able to simply run the speaker cable from my Pioneer Elite SC-35 (140 watt) receiver to the sub, or must I do anything else/in addition?

2.  With that subwoofer, do I "need" the additional power of the Dayton Audio SPA 1000w, or will the 500w be perfectly adequate? (I do not listen at "ungodly" levels, and the sub will be positioned close to the actual listening locations, in a large cu ft area).

3.  What about polyfill?  How beneficial is it really to the listener?  Do most upper-end sub manufacturers line their boxes with it, or is it mostly a DIY type of add-on?

 

I will greatly appreciate the recommendations of the Forum members, as I would like to get this thing as right as possible on THE FIRST go round!

 

Thanks very much.

[Scrappydue]

Go pro amp! Way more adjustability. Get you an inuke 3000dsp from amazon for 279. Few extra things to buy to connect it but much better amp than any Dayton sub amp. You know I can help you out with setup and any I the questions too

Rca to sub amp then speaker wires from sub amp to sub box. It will have binding posts just like a regular speaker.

Polyfill is recommended as it will make the sub box seem larger to the woofer without making it actually bigger. My 4.0 cu ft boxes all have 4lbs each in them. Buy it at wal mart. Crazy cheap.

Edited September 17, 2014 by Scrappydue

[CECAA850]

Do NOT run speaker wire from your receiver to your sub driver's voice coil unless you really don't like your receiver and want a new one.  You can run speaker wire to the speaker level inputs on your subwoofer plate amp however.

 

I'd opt for the larger amp with that driver.

 

Polyfill is something you can try at any time.  Add or remove it after the sub is built depending on if you like what it does for the sound.

[JiminSTL]

Scrappy, just sent you an email (PM?).  Something odd, though.  I sent/posted it, and received a message that I could not start another topic until 9/17????

Edited September 17, 2014 by JiminSTL

[derrickdj1]

The Ultimax is a good driver.  I have them in sealed and vented boxes.  How may subs will you be running and how large is the room?  I second the suggestion on the I Nuke to run the amp.  The Dayton amp is not the best options.

[JiminSTL]

Cecaa and Derrick, I appreciate your comments to augment what Scrappy has said.  I have looked as best I can at the technical specs of the Dayton Audio UM-18 22 and the SI HT18.  

 

Should I be thinking of the dual 2 ohm or dual 4 ohm coils, given the equipment (KLF 30s, 20s, and KV-4 center, and Pioneer AVR) and space listed above?

 

I do not fully understand the specs to "compare", but there seemed to be a modest advantage for the DA.  It has received largely good reviews.  And, it does cost more.  And yet, many here have had very pleasing results with the SI HT18, and it costs less.  The "real" power that I need given my equipment and listening conditions is important in the sense that I want ample (so nothing has to strain), but I do not want to pay for power that would always/largely remain unused, either.

 

And, the "quality"--whatever that is--of the sub is important, as I want it to last a long time and perform superbly.  Ditto for the amplifier that I get.  I certainly prefer the price of the iNuke over the DA plate amplifier, IF it is the right choice.  

Edited September 17, 2014 by JiminSTL

[Turbox]

crown xti 1000 is my poison

[derrickdj1]

I have a dual cab sub and wired each driver to a 2 ohm load so that the combined load equaled 4 ohm.  The vented box driver is also wired for a 4 ohm load.  So, as long as the amp can handle 4 ohms you will be OK.

[JiminSTL]

The Ultimax is a good driver.  I have them in sealed and vented boxes.  How may subs will you be running and how large is the room?  I second the suggestion on the I Nuke to run the amp.  The Dayton amp is not the best options.

Derrick, 1 sub.  The room is 6,000+ cu ft.  The primary seating is <4ft from the sub location, the remaining sitting area is 11ft and less.

 

I know that the enthusiasts advise multiple subs.  The spatial, wifely, budgetary, and aesthetic limitations say that will never be.  So, I want something that will allow me to enjoy good action movies, feel the "oomph", and utilize my KLFs for my vocal and music enjoyment/applications.

[derrickdj1]

I would  use a vented cabinet for that size room.  Maybe order a marty flatpack to put the driver in.

 

My sealed box :  90.2, 93.7, 98.8, 104.2 at 10, 12.5, 16, and 20 Hz by windisp

Vented box:        ?    ,   ?    , 109.8, 113.7 at 10, 12.5,16, and 20 Hz by windisp.

 

The vented box is tuned to 16 Hz and no LPF so there is appreciable output at 12.5 and some at 10 Hz but, the number can't be obtained with windisp.  I have a 5300 cu ft space with 4 subs.  One sealed sub will not be enough.  Here is a pic of my Ultimax subs.  They are big, but, you need to move a lot of air in a big space, and big subs will do it..

Edited September 18, 2014 by derrickdj1

[JiminSTL]

I say 6,000+ cu feet, but it really consists of a large L-shaped great room (the eqpt at the base of the L, so viewing/listening is in the vertical portion of the L), with a dining area adjoining/continuing the L.  15' vaulted ceiling.

[CECAA850]

Should I be thinking of the dual 2 ohm or dual 4 ohm coils

 

You need to look at the driver and amp as a whole.  A dual 2 Ohm driver can be wired for 1 Ohm or 4 Ohms.  If your amp can has a 4 Ohm rating (most plate amps and pro amps do) get that configuration.  Normally only higher end car amps can handle 1 Ohm loads.  The dual 4 Ohm style can be wired for a final amp load of 2 or 8 Ohms.  Most plate amps and bridged pro amps won't do 2 Ohms.  There again, look at your amp and figure out what driver you need.

[derrickdj1]

That is still a big room with a high ceiling.  Have you considered vented subs?  Is WAF a problem? Do you want thunder bass that you can feel?  Music is not a problem in most cases.  The Ultimax is 1000 RMS /2000 peak so a 500 watt amp will not do the driver much good.

Edited September 18, 2014 by derrickdj1

[JiminSTL]

That is still a big room with a high ceiling.  Have you considered vented subs?  Is WAF a problem? Do you want thunder bass that you can feel?  Music is not a problem in most cases.  The Ultimax is 1000 RMS /2000 peak so a 500 watt amp will not do the driver much good.

Yes, Derrick:

1)  There really is only 1 place where a sub might realistically be located

2)  The max size is 4cu ft sealed (approx. 23" or 24" cube)

3)  WAF??? Ha ha, yes

4)  Bass that I can feel (as I have described it, I want to feel and hear Godzilla stomping around, and the wonderful sound of high-explosive justice giving bad guys what they deserve).  I want my KLFs (LR and surrounds{mid-30s Hz}, and KV-4 center) to handle most of the voice and music--I really enjoy their sound/music presentation, and want to maximize the part of the spectrum they provide

5)  In combo w/ #4 above, if possible, I would like to have the sub take over at 60Hz, or even 50 if possible.

 

Scrappy recommended the SI18, but said that I should compare the specs against the Ultimax.  Seems like the Ultimax may have the edge, relative to what I want to experience, but it also costs more.  And I know that a number of people in the Forum swear by the SI18 (actually, the HT18, I think).

 

If I go with the iNuke 3000, is there much else (equipment) that I would need to purchase to get the sub functioning properly?

[JiminSTL]

Additional explanation of my objectives--here is what I wrote Scrappy this morning:

 

My objectives:  To experience real “oomph” in home theater viewing/listening, without having to turn the volume up to highs that would produce undesired wifely responses to me!  Specifically, I would like to hear/feel Godzilla stomping around, and the so-sweet sound and feel of high explosive justice being meted out to deserving bad guys!  I am of “a certain age”, so I am not looking to impress neighbors, or 18 year-old adolescents, likely to be deaf long before they reach my age.  I am not looking for bragging rights on any AV forum.

 

I want sensation that adds to enjoyment, not that has guests (or my wife) looking around and wondering WHY I must listen so loud!

[CECAA850]

I want sensation that adds to enjoyment, not that has guests (or my wife) looking around and wondering WHY I must listen so loud!

 

I read this as that you want a powerful LFE channel while not turning the volume up too high.  2 issues here.  To achieve this you'll have to calibrate the sub really hot and in most instances it just won't sound right.  The second issue is that bass waves travel through things whereas mids and treble don't.  Even if you shut the door, everyone is going to feel what's going on.

[JiminSTL]

Hmmmm.  Am I reading between the lines that this situation is: 1) difficult/almost impossible to fix given the eqpt specified, and 2) that the correct (or only real) solution is multiple subs?

[Scrappydue]

I know exactly what you need after reading the lasts few posts!! You need a few transducers and an inuke 1000dsp to run them. They take up zero floor space, have tons of waf (HIDDEN) and they won't be boomy or anything. They will give you all the feel you can handle without pissing anyone else off!

[derrickdj1]

Excellent suggestion on the transducers.  The Ultimax and SI driver are very similar in a sealed box.  If you do build a sub, go for a 4.5 cu ft box.  You will get a slightly better performance profile and really not take up any additional floor space.  By the way, I watch the new Godzilla last night.  This one is a bass lover's panacea.  The stomps, roars, wings beating in the wind and you can tell I liked it, lol.  This movie was made for subs.

[johnnydrama]

I know others are recommending a different direction from a plate amplifier, but I have a Yung 500W with 6dB Boost @ 25 hZ I would sell you for $100. I've had it mounted to the cabinet for about 9 months, but have probably only used it for 8-10 movies when my wife is not home, she hates subwoofers....with a passion. Just an idea if you were interested. Would work well in a sealed box. I have it paired with the Ultimax 12 driver currently.