greg928gts Posted September 9, 2003 Share Posted September 9, 2003 Quicksilver Mono Amps with Phillips/Sylvania 8417 tubes. These have chrome chassis' which I love. The seller said that he spoke with Mike Sanders and he said that they never built any in chrome, so I assume that a previous owner had them chromed. I'm pretty excited about trying these out on my Khorns. After bouncing back and forth between the awesome power of the MC2205 and the incredible open, detailed sound of the SET, I'm thinking these mono's may land squarely in the middle. Hopefully they won't sound middle of the road! I'd enjoy hearing comments or insight into what I can expect from these. Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Landau Posted September 9, 2003 Share Posted September 9, 2003 I hope that you'll enjoy them. I will be auditioning a pair in the near future, too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Disc Posted September 9, 2003 Share Posted September 9, 2003 Greg, You have a stash of 8417 tubes or know a source? - tb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg928gts Posted September 9, 2003 Author Share Posted September 9, 2003 No, I looked through all my tubes and couldn't find any 8417's. I'm prepared to make the modification to EL34's if necessary. I felt the price was right on these amps and I've heard good things about them. Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Landau Posted September 9, 2003 Share Posted September 9, 2003 Quicksilver's Mike Sanders can modify them to take EL34's for a very reasonable cost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg928gts Posted September 9, 2003 Author Share Posted September 9, 2003 Yes, I was just looking at the website. $250 plus tubes and shipping for the pair. Are there no 8417's out there? Ebay? Which sounds better, 8417 or EL34? Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Disc Posted September 9, 2003 Share Posted September 9, 2003 Greg, I think they are pretty hard to find. Other 8417 owners like yourself buying them up. Hopefully the one your getting has some life left and you can see if you like them. Might be able to snag them from time to time on ebay. They are a pretty rare tube now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted September 9, 2003 Share Posted September 9, 2003 Greg -- you need to talk to the seller and see how many hours he put on those tubes. You should also ask about potential sources for 8417's. See what happens when you buy without asking our permission first. Some claim these are some of the best sounding push-pull amps ever made. If they are anything like I experienced with the M-60's -- expect complete nirvana. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prodj101 Posted September 9, 2003 Share Posted September 9, 2003 antique electronics (www.tubesandmore.com I think) sells them but they cost something outrageous like 200 dollars (and I think that price is each). I almost got these not too long ago but someone bought them up before I had a chance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Landau Posted September 9, 2003 Share Posted September 9, 2003 Matched quads of N.O.S Philips/Sylvania 8417 usually goes for $200 and can last many years. If they last for 5000 hours (and they usually do), that's 40 cents/hour for pure tube enjoyment - which is very reasonable. They can also be found for much less. Here's a link for more Quicksilver modifications http://www.triodeel.com/8417.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg928gts Posted September 9, 2003 Author Share Posted September 9, 2003 Darnit, I knew I should have consulted with the Dean Machine before buying these! $200 for a quad set sounds reasonable to me. But I still wonder if the EL34's modification might not be a better sounding amp anyway? The seller said he put 30 hours on them himself, but I don't know about the previous owners. I really don't care anyway, I'm going to enjoy them for as long as they stay lit, or until I move on to something else, or I modify them, or I find 8417's, etc... It's all in the journey. Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klipschfoot Posted September 9, 2003 Share Posted September 9, 2003 Shouldn't you research how EL-84 modded Quicksilvers sound compared to other EL-84 amps before you jump? You know the joke about the two happiest days of a boat owner (the day he buys a boat and the day he sells it). There are a lot of NEW! EL-84 amps out there that could be a better investment. Just a thought. (sorry, I meant EL-34. Hey, it was 1:15 Eastern when I wrote that. 34, 84, 24, whatever. My apologies.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg928gts Posted September 9, 2003 Author Share Posted September 9, 2003 Nah! These look really cool and the price is very reasonable. I'm quite sure I can get my money back out of them if I'm not happy. It's a EL34 upgrade, not EL84. Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted September 9, 2003 Share Posted September 9, 2003 EL-34's, not EL-84's. A couple of things you really should do: If they were my amps, I would carefully pack all of the tubes and send them to Craig for testing. You really need to know the strength of the tubes. I would hold off on any mods until you absolutely cannot find anymore 8417's. I have read quite a bit about these amps, as well as talked to Mike Sanders about them. I can assure you, he still has a very soft spot in his heart for them. I do agree with Klipschfoot -- if you are going to mod them, then why not shop for an amp already built around the EL-34. Put a wanted ad on Audiogon. I would put it in the 'for sale' section for tubes where it will get the most exposure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg928gts Posted September 9, 2003 Author Share Posted September 9, 2003 I'm not planning on modifying them, just wondered if it might end up sounding even better. I've already seen 8417's for sale just with a little bit of searching tonight (no price, I sent an email), I doubt it will be a problem to pick up a set. I can test the tubes right here. No need to bother Craig, he's got enough to do. If I'm going to send anything to Craig, it's going to be my 299C. Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted September 10, 2003 Share Posted September 10, 2003 There has been MUCH said in here and in the Audio Asylum about these amps and the 8417 tubes they revolve around. IF you DO get them, I would figure in at least 2 sets of 8417 tubes for the time you have them. These amps are getting hard to sell as many are aware of the lack of reasonable supply for the 8417. I think these amps would probably be more pleasing in original mode but the mod price is reasonable. I have heard many Quicksilver amps and they do all seem to have a similar family sound, although it's a good one. It wont be like a SET amp but it will provide plenty of smiles. His amps might not jump out at you but most of them sound musical. I would really recommend anyone new to tubes to run a major purchase by someone before jumping into the mix. Also, do searches in the archives of Tube Asylum, here, and the other forums/Google to see some comments. After awhile, you can weed out who knows what they are talking about and with more experience, realize that many dont! heh... It's helpful to get the various opinions, some more informed than others. btw, the Quicksilver Horn Monos come on Audiogon for a very reasonable rate. I would imagine this would make a few happy (the only things I dont like about them are no tube rectification and the rather high 20dB of negative feedback). Mike is not a big proponent of tube rectification, which I really prefer, but these amps are a sound purchase too. Some of the high power Quicksilver stuff would not be my first choice on horn speakers(due to noise) depending on music taste. The Horn Monos were designed to have low distortion at the below 1w level. A better SET amp would float your boat in a big way as well. Good PP and SET is a nice option to have. kh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg928gts Posted September 10, 2003 Author Share Posted September 10, 2003 Part of my thinking with this purchase is to experiment with bi-amping the Khorns. I've been getting information together on a good way to do this passively, or quasi-passively in anticipation of having time to play with it. Right now, I'm thinking SET on the horns with a modification to the SET amp that cuts out bass frequencies right at the input, and a pair of PP monoblocs on the bass bins with a simple, home-built, low-pass active crossover. I'm interested in trying out a lot of different things though. I think I may have Craig do up the 299C as an experiment. I also have a Dynaco ST-70 that I can try. I'll have more time this winter to get serious about the stereo system again. I've still got my Khorns to refinish in rosewood veneer, and I've got the Cornwalls to refinish too, among other projects. A couple of you guys act as though I've made a mistake to buy these Quicksilvers. Maybe you don't understand that for me, this is exciting to try out different things. If 8417's are as rare as you say they are, then I can't think of a better time to buy a pair of these to be one of the last to use up a set. It's sort of like when I bought my 928, part of my motivation at the time, was that they stopped making the 928 in 1994. So if I wanted to be one of the last to use up a 928 and get one with reasonable miles, the time was then. Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Landau Posted September 10, 2003 Share Posted September 10, 2003 Buying the Quicksilvers is not a mistake and the 8417 tubes are not that rare. There is no current production of them but they can be found quite easily. The amp also have tube rectifiers, which is a big plus as oposed to the latest Quicksilver who doesn't. A bigger mistake would be to put money on a very mediocre sounding Scott 299 and even if ole Craig is a magician, It will never reach a high end qulity (nice sounding maybe). I suggest putting the money elsewhere (i.e. on a nice preamp) or restoring the Dynaco. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artto Posted September 10, 2003 Share Posted September 10, 2003 I have some 8417 email me if you're interested. For what it's worth, I probably have one of the largest stock of used & NOS of 8045G & 6240G (not for sale). Should be interesting how the Quicksilver 8417 stacks up against your SET. A long time ago I thought SET was the answer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg928gts Posted September 10, 2003 Author Share Posted September 10, 2003 I'm convinced there is not just one "answer". I'm having a blast trying all kinds of different things. I can see having several different amplifier and preamp options all available to switch in and out of the system. I don't want to limit myself to a choice of rebuilding a 299C or a nice preamp, I want both and more! That's why I buy and sell so much of this stuff, it enables me to afford a lot of different things. The SET is very, very nice. I think I'll always have one or a monobloc pair at some point, but I do need more power for most of my music listening, and I especially will need more power when I build the next listening room. I was playing with some different setups the other day, switching between the SET and the McIntosh MC2205, and the Khorns and the Cornwalls. Lotsa fun! Just delivered the KLF30's today, the buyer was very pleased when he got them hooked up. I paid $700 as part of a package deal and sold them for $1050 plus $150 for delivery (3 hours away). Let's see . . . . that's just about enough profit for a very nice 299 rebuild! Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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