The Biggest Klipsch Rumor

[WMcD]

Okay, it is no rumor.

Phones don't have dials and cars don't have fins anymore. Horrors.

The K-Horn lives on as the best gosh darn speaker ever . At least that hasn't changed. Something is right in the world.

Smile.

Gil

[TBrennan]

RT----It's not a rumor it's a fact. The Klipsch company today is making run of the mill product; nothing special. Ole PWK did make something special, the Hoosiers don't.

Klipsch used to play with the best horn speakers of the time--- Altec VOTs, JBL Hartsfield and L-300, EV Patrician, Jensen Imperial and so on. But the current Klipsch product cannot compete with best horns today like Edgars, TADs and CARs nor with older Klipsches or the other horns mentioned. Serious hornies have very little interest (dare I say none) in the RFs.

[mark1101]

lynn,

Good facts and opinions. In fact I agree with most of what you say here. Klipsch markets to each relevant segment very effectively and definitely edges the competition in most or all of the segments in performance for about the same prices as the competition.

However, when you touch the product it is so damn cost reduced. It just doesn't feel like quality to me (yeah those others feel cheap too). I'm just not interested in anything that cost reduced. When you think about how they get it to perform, I guess it is quite a feat though.

Yeah, they would have died if they kept on with just the Heritage line, I agree no doubt That's why I say they took an about face. I think from day 1, even the Heritage series was a niche product. It didn't just become one because times changed. It was an exclusive product right out of the gate. It was expensive back in the day and wasn't a mass marketed product like synergy. Klipsch was known for high end niche audio speakers. Today they are known differently. That's the about face I speak of.

Fred simply had more of a business mind than Paul it would seem.

So when you get down to it, it just makes me a little pissed off that a pair of Khorns are $6500.00 (I could see $3000.00), and LaScalas are around $3900.00. It's almost like they don't want you to force them to actually make a pair.

[silvertip]

Somebody should give lynnm a valium.

I hear that hyper-active, easily excitable old goats are prone to sudden strokes and heart attacks...

Better yet, how about a valium AND a track or two of Diana Krall???

[lynnm]

BS ALERT!

BS METER PEGGED AND MELTED !

" RT----It's not a rumor it's a fact. The Klipsch company today is making run of the mill product; nothing special. Ole PWK did make something special, the Hoosiers don't. "

That is like saying that since Henry Ford Invented the automobile ( He didn't by a very long shot BTW ) and every automotive innovation introduced by Ford since then is by definition crap!

There were/are many great horn loaded speakers produced and some currently available units may well be superior to the Khorn ( They must be damned good if they are superior however ).

It should also be remembered that PWK never envisioned the Klipschorn as a speaker for the masses - He fully understood that the kHORN was too expensive for most and therefore having produced a signature product went on to design and produce less expensive speakers that could approximate the Khorn sound.

EV produced some great speakers based on PWK design. James B Lansing ( JBL ) and Klipsch were designing horn loaded speakers at about the same time and shared in the same milieu and therefore it gets a little hard to say which was the true originator of any given idea - especially since both had been exposed to the pioneering work of Western Electric Labs which produced some phenomenal loudspeakers and amplifiers in its day.

Those " Hoosiers " are currently making and marketing the entire Heritage series ( sans the Cornwall ) and the RF series and the Synergy series and the Promedia line. Given that the Klipsch is a benchmark in all of those categories one must assume that at worst.... Klipsch "crap"... is the standard against most of the product in any of those categories is being measured against.

If the Heritage series were the beginning and end of the REAL Klipsch line then perhaps the complaints above might have some validity but the reality is that Klipsch company under the engineering guidance of PWK continued to develop quality speakers to sell to every niche from mid-Fi upwards. It does not suprise me that in

every case Klipsch strove to be "Best in Class" and for the most part has done so.

Is it suprising that the ProMedia 2.1 and/or 5.1 for example gets a mention in every computer speaker review you see these days - even when the reviewer states a preference for another maker's product ?

[lynnm]

Attempt to be a noxious substance noted

You win !

( Old fart disapears into the distance snivelling and whining and muttering ----Yes but I actually have a pair of Khorns ) !

[TBrennan]

Lynn----Actually Jim Lansing was designing speakers commercially long before PWK was and unlike PWK he actually designed and built drivers.

Face it Lynn, the Klipsch company isn't very interested in selling their best speakers, they want to sell decent stuff to a big market, not great stuff to a small one. Fine, that's their business. But top quality it isn't. Christ man, they won't even bring the best speaker the company designed to market. And we saw the excellent Epics and the, oh what were those last big 3-ways called, replaced by the inferior RFs.

Recently I was in the market for small speakers. I'd sold my house and my large Altec-JBL Pro system and needed small speakers. I listened to many small speakers and was not impressed with either the sound or the build quality of the new small Klipsches. I ended up with KRKs which are better built and sounding than the comparable Klipsches. And cheaper too. I gave Klipsch a chance, they flubbed it. But there's still a very good chance I'll end up with new Heresey IIs, they're most excellent small speakers and will work well for me but note they're an older Klipsch design.

[lynnm]

TB

If you found better value than Klipsch you obviously looked hard and were well rewarded.

Congratulations !

[kev313]

I agree with those who argue that Klipsch is doing what is necessary to survive in today's marketplace. Simply put, this company could not put out even the limited heritage volume that they if they did not have best buy income to subsidize the production of speakers that have lower sales volume.

Also, as I have said in the past, the promedias are really effective as introductory Klipsch speakers. The marijuana-Klipsch...the Klipsch that leads you down the road to the heavy stuff. I had never heard of Klipsch 2 years ago. I bought the 5.1's after reading a review at ign.com (I was 26 at the time, ok!). Now I have Cornwalls and Fortes and would love to move to Khorns when I have the room.

Let's be honest, the Promedia series are really good PC speakers. They really do beat other available pc speakers. They turn people onto the sound and the brand. They introduced me to the concept of a better or higher end sound. This is very important to people my age and (especially) younger who did not grow up in a hi-fi era or an era where anyone gave a crap or knew enough to give a crap about music (sound) QUALITY. I listened to tapes and cds when I was younger. I had no idea that vinyl sounded better. Accordingly, I assumed that if I had the coolest looking bass box from best buy that I had the best of show in audio. I suspect that this scenario has not improved with the popularity of Bose and mp3.

Would I use the Promedia for 2 channel or ht? Uh, no. That's not what they are for so it's not fair to evaluate them that way.

THAT SAID, it IS unfortunate that Klipsch does not seem to be outting much effort into developing a better distibution model for their existing Heritage products. Especially when it means that a potentially great speaker like the Jubilee will die on the drawing board.

[JohnA]

I have a brother-in-law that was for the most part an only child. He says we Albrights agree louder and longer than anybody! That's where this discussion is.

Having seen and heard the 2003 K-horn, Belle and La Scala, the quality of the Heritage Line is as good as ever and the sound of the K-horn is probably the best it's ever been (I'd like to spend several hours in a quiet room to be sure. :-) ).

However, the Heritage line has become a tough sell at its price and with the climate in the audio*pile* industry (too cheap for the real audiofool and too much for most successful boomers). In order to survive, Klipsch, Inc. added to the product line and has created products that meet the styling desires of the current consumer. It appears they have been fabulously successful at it. That lets the company cruise comfortably and still offer the Heritage Line while, probably, making little profit from it.

Most of what rtrott says is true except for,

"The rumor at that point developed and spread over time that the Klipsch product no longer retained the dedication to quality and sonic refinement that Paul Klipsch was dedicated to. In other words, they started cutting corners and putting out more of a product for the masses (read: Bose)."

Since meeting several of Klipsch' R&D engineers, I know that is not true. Klipsch now strives to produce the best product in the class for which it is developed. I find the RW-12, RSW-15 and RF-3s to be both amazing and satisfying. They are not necessarily intended to compete with B&Ws, but they are good sounding, useful speakers I can recommend to my friends that are not interested in $8000 K-horns, or $6000 Belles (or $10,000 B&Ws).

Klipsch IS selling some less expensive speakers. Good. It means I can get parts and someday I can have a pair of new K-horns. If they weren't I'd be scrounging parts for speakers like everybody does for their Altecs.

[jt1stcav]

I say BRAVO, Klipsch! You're doing what you need to do to stay competitive in today's market, even if it means outsourcing manufacturing for the ProMedias and other Klipsch products (which I'm NOT a fan of, by the way). But they haven't done away with the Heritage Series after all these years, so that says an awful lot for the company. And they're heavily into the commercial market as well with their horns for theatres, clubs, and auditoriums, etc. Klipsch's heritage is still firmly planted in the past while advancing well into the 21st Century with its latest loudspeakers. They may no longer be made of plywood or use metal horns, but for the money, the consumer is still getting one hellova great sounding bargain with the Synergy Series at the local Best Buy superstore!

Just my chump change...

[Deang]

Some comments in this thread make me angry. The freaking RB-5 buried my Magnapans, and I have to read these ridiculous slams on Reference. Face it, most people either don't like the sound of full blown horns, don't have the room for them, or can't afford them. At any rate, find some speakers out there, at the relative price points -- that sound better? It can't be done.

[NOSValves]

I could careless what people say about Klispch to me they are a top rate company in a world where that is a hard thing to find. They stand behind what they sell good or bad. My PC speakers took a dump after 2 years. Called up Klispch and they were completely kind sent me a Shipping label to return them and sent me the new latest models. It didn't cost me a red cent!! How many companies will do that in this day and age? I also think the RF series is an incredible value heck I even think the SF series out classes many above its price point. Klispch has to offer what sells or they will not be here at all for long. Another valid point is how many companies stock drivers and repair components for speakers they mad 30 years ago? Ah just about none. There is no speaker company as concerned about there customers satisfaction more than Klispch.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />

[gerbache]

Here's another example of someone who discovered Klipsch through the Promedia line. Three years ago, I bought the 4.1 model of Promedias to go with a computer I was assembling in preparation for college, and ended up finding this forum. I hadn't even heard any of the other Klipsch speakers, but based on how much I liked the sound of the Promedias and the fact that people online here referred to the Heritage line as some of the best sounding speakers ever, I bought a set of Heresies, and will probably be listening to Klipsches for the rest of my time as a stereo nut (I hate to use the term audiophile...bad connotation in my book).

Were it not for the Promedias, I haven't the slightest what I would be listening to today, although I have to wager that it wouldn't be Klipsch, or probably even in the same league as my current setup. Eventually, I'm sure I'd have found a decent set of speakers, considering how much music I listen to, but those cheap, outsourced speakers are the very ones that have led me to the company, so they must have done something right!

[TBrennan]

Dean----The Maggies are cheesey Rube Goldberg devices made of saran-wrap, fibre-board and refrigerator bar magnets; it's no wonder your RFs are better, shiny copper-colored "fishing lure" cones and all.

[Soundthought]

Ha Ha

Man Tom, if that's how you feel about Maggies, I wonder what you think of BES Bergatoni geo-stats?

BTW. My favorite spoon was the color of RF cones.

Used to slam some big pike with it....back in the day.

Rain or shine, morning or night it never failed.

At least until a nasty 4ft dogfish bit through my 20Lbs steel leader and made off with it.

Sniff....

I miss that lure.

[TBrennan]

REality---Yeah, I remember those Bertagni speakers, I should look for some on ebay. :-)

Whaddaya use for walleye?

[KeesGuy]

Tom writes:

The Maggies are cheesey Rube Goldberg devices made of saran-wrap, fibre-board and refrigerator bar magnets.

Hmmmm... Cheezey? - never tasted the ones I had but pretty sure my dog would have eaten them if they were indeed cheezey. Rube Goldberg? Well- let's see. The diaphragm moves by a current moving through wires that react to a magnetic field. Hey, that's the way Klipsch work as well! Saran Wrap? Actually mylar...oh I'm sorry- wrong again. Fibre-board? - MDF is basically the standard material used in speaker cabinet design today - including Klipsch. Refrigerator bar magnets? Ding, ding, ding! Tom gets one!!!

Perhaps you were just being sarcastic and I missed it???

Hee, Hee - Jim.

[neo33]

I am still amaze at the sound of the Fortes after 17 years. I have been listening to them non-stop for the last three days.

[TBrennan]

Jim---Sorry I confused saran-wrap with clear mylar, it's so easy to do you see.

Yes MDF is standard for speaker ENCLOSURES. But the side baffles of my Maggies were thin fibreboard, not MDF. And by thin I mean 3/32", wobbly.

In any case after several years the shoddy devices stopped working when the wires glued to the plastic broke. They didn't even last 10 years. Junk. I should have cut the mylar up for kazoo diaphragms.