kenratboy Posted February 10, 2005 Share Posted February 10, 2005 Here: *** The L1 Cylindrical Radiator loudspeaker is the core of this system. Its unusual pole-shaped design projects sound evenly across the stage and into the audience. Since the sound from these speakers diminishes so gradually, volume levels stay much more consistent for musicians and audience members. And its wide dispersion patternnearly 180 degreesmeans everyone on stage and in the house experiences full, clear sound without unwanted distortion. *** Wow...What a amazing world we live in. Sound waves are constant from their creation to dozens of meters away. The only person I can see taking this seriously is the rich trust-fund lady that plays some wierd instrument at Barns & Noble on Saturday nights for fun. Awful Bose link: http://www.bose.com/controller;jsessionid=CM01mx9hQMRy2nxgWlSWrRljh0Zntsfy7WJKCLlt1vgjGgvQr5NF!1874484068!-1282093452?event=VIEW_STATIC_PAGE_EVENT&url=/musicians/index.jsp&linksource=centernav_img_musicians&pageName=/index_2.jsp If it doesn't work, just go to www.bose.com and click on the 'musicians' link - ONLY product they offer! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tpg Posted February 11, 2005 Share Posted February 11, 2005 Our local music store has one of these setups in there along with a lot of new Peavey monitors, subs and such. I've never heard the Bose setup. Don't really care to... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edwinr Posted February 11, 2005 Share Posted February 11, 2005 ---------------- On 2/10/2005 11:31:23 PM kenratboy wrote: Wow...What a amazing world we live in. Sound waves are constant from their creation to dozens of meters away. ---------------- kenratboy, your post had the wrong heading. It should have read; "Bose cheats..." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colterphoto1 Posted February 11, 2005 Share Posted February 11, 2005 Nice post Ken, but I really don't want to see more Bose. Ive got some gawdawful Bose ads appearing as pop-ups with the USearch thingy. Keeps interrupting my important Klispch surfing. Yeah, who writes this ad copy and what serious music lover would fall for that drivel? I mean come on, everyone knows that air has density and sound falls off with distance...wait maybe thats it! This new BOse creation sucks all the atmosphere out of the auditorium so all the stiffs are treated to the same volume of whatever sound makes it throught the vacuum. Bose, what a joke Michael Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psg Posted February 11, 2005 Share Posted February 11, 2005 Without reading any of the links, it sounds like a line source of sound (the cylinder) instead of a point source. The source diminishes as 1/distance instead of 1/distance^2 for such a scheme. Note they say it diminishes "so gradually", not that it doesn't diminish. I can't believe I'm defending Bose... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m00n Posted February 11, 2005 Share Posted February 11, 2005 ---------------- On 2/11/2005 8:56:22 AM psg wrote: I can't believe I'm defending Bose... ---------------- Na.. It's all good. I'll be the first to admit, bose sound good. At least when ever I've heard them. I wouldn't take them over my Klipsch, but they do sound good for their size. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenratboy Posted February 11, 2005 Author Share Posted February 11, 2005 ---------------- On 2/11/2005 8:56:22 AM psg wrote: Without reading any of the links, it sounds like a line source of sound (the cylinder) instead of a point source. The source diminishes as 1/distance instead of 1/distance^2 for such a scheme. Note they say it diminishes "so gradually", not that it doesn't diminish. I can't believe I'm defending Bose... ---------------- No, no, thats fine. This is a debate about physics. Here is what I am saying: If you but a Bose and JBL, Klipsch, EV, Peavey, Carvin, etc. speaker on a stage, and played a 90 dB. signal (measured at the same distance) thru each one - will the sound not deteriorate at the same speed? I don't see how a speaker could 'lose SPL' faster than another. The speed of sound is the speed of sound, and if the sound starts off at the same volume, it will taper off at the same volume, correct? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfogg Posted February 11, 2005 Share Posted February 11, 2005 "The speed of sound is the speed of sound, and if the sound starts off at the same volume, it will taper off at the same volume, correct?" The speed of sound has nothing to do with it. A line source does have its SPL drop off slower then a point source audio radiator. Look up inverse square law and most any good definition should include a note about this applying to point sources. It is absolutely possible that say 1 meter away both sources are playing at 90dB but 2 meters away one is playing at 87ish dB while the other is measured at 83ish dB. Line sources are more focused so they don't disperse their sound over as much an area for the same distance as a point source would. Therefor they keep more of their energy in a smaller area when you move further away from the source. More energy means more SPL. This is one reason why it can be tough to match say a ribbon tweeter to a cone woofer. The ribbon tweeter will act as a line source for some/all of its range while the woofer is a point source. It makes it hard to balance the output between two drivers since each units SPL falls off at different rates as you move away from the speaker. Shawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenratboy Posted February 11, 2005 Author Share Posted February 11, 2005 OK! I always 'thought' that horns projected sound better, but was not sure is that was really the case other than just controlling the sound waves better than a dome, cone, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colterphoto1 Posted February 11, 2005 Share Posted February 11, 2005 I think I understand, but the flip side would be that because it is radiating omnidirectionally, that it would necessarily be much less efficient in a standard test compared to similar components arranged as a line source, yes? That would explain why it's a Blo$e. Just hook up the 5 gazillion watt amp here fellas! Michael Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfogg Posted February 11, 2005 Share Posted February 11, 2005 " but the flip side would be that because it is radiating omnidirectionally, that it would necessarily be much less efficient in a standard test compared to similar components arranged as a line source, yes?" There are actually very few line source loudspeakers. Most of them are the big planars and such and they aren't line sources over their whole bandwidth. The vast majority of speakers act like point sources even if they don't radiate omni-directionally. An efficiency test of a line source vs. a point souce would sort of be misleading. At 1m the line source could look less efficient but say at 4 meters it could appear to be more efficient. Shawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-MAN Posted February 11, 2005 Share Posted February 11, 2005 The way that a soundwave is propagated is determinate of how far it can travel and produce and SPL at the respective distance. It depends on the particular application. That's why horns come in different dispersion patterns and characteristics that can be used for home Hi-fi (short-throw) and PA applications in very large spaces (long-throw), for instance. They are also called "lenses" for that reason as they tend or can be used to "focus" the soundwaves and project them to the desired point(s). Granted, the distance travelled does have its effect on the overall SPL that is achievable at the desired position. DM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
007 Posted February 13, 2005 Share Posted February 13, 2005 ---------------- On 2/11/2005 11:02:07 AM m00n wrote: ---------------- On 2/11/2005 8:56:22 AM psg wrote: I can't believe I'm defending Bose... ---------------- Na.. It's all good. I'll be the first to admit, bose sound good. At least when ever I've heard them. I wouldn't take them over my Klipsch, but they do sound good for their size. ---------------- My RSX's are far better than bose sats and they do it for less money ( have A/B'ed both, it was more of a joke because it was obvious) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coytee Posted February 13, 2005 Share Posted February 13, 2005 Listen all you technical guys, it's all in the pictures. Look at the "speaker directinoality". It seems to infer the conventional speakers are loud up close (see the red) and (to use their terminology) "falls off rapidly the further away the wave travels" I interpret that to mean it's pretty quiet futher away, and they depict that by making it BLUE. Now, look at the picture of their bose speaker, it's ALL BLUE from near to far. Simply tells me that theirs will play as diminished at a distance as the conventional speaker, BUT you also get the added benefit that it will play diminished UP CLOSE too. How can I be wrong, I'm using the pics they provided. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spkrdctr Posted February 14, 2005 Share Posted February 14, 2005 I'm not buying it. If you measure a line source and a point source at one meter, and they read the same spl, then measure them at 5 meters and the line source has a higher spl than the point source? Sounds fishy....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfogg Posted February 14, 2005 Share Posted February 14, 2005 "I'm not buying it. If you measure a line source and a point source at one meter, and they read the same spl, then measure them at 5 meters and the line source has a higher spl than the point source?" Yes, that is exactly what will happen. Because a line source is beaming the sound so it doesn't disperse as much over distance as a point source. If the sound from the line source isn't covering as wide of an area as the point source at the same distance away that means it has more energy in an equivalent area to the point source. That means it has a higher SPL. "Sounds fishy....... " That doesn't mean it isn't true. See: http://www.trueaudio.com/st_lines.htm or it is also mentioned here... http://www.zainea.com/liviu/yates.pdf Shawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griffinator Posted February 14, 2005 Share Posted February 14, 2005 Actually, guys, I've heard a lot of positive responses from the musicians that use these things. For a 200 seat club, they're plenty loud, and the setup is a snap. Each band member brings their own cylinder and sub, and as long as they're not "more me" types, they get along pretty good with the "in-air" mix... I told Lee Flier (the first chick to get hold of a set) to talk to me in a couple years after they've been exposed to the elements for a while, and tell me how they're holding up... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spkrdctr Posted February 15, 2005 Share Posted February 15, 2005 Shawn, Thanks for the links. I'm doing more research now...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jabez Scratch Posted February 15, 2005 Share Posted February 15, 2005 ---------------- On 2/11/2005 11:34:33 AM kenratboy wrote: No, no, thats fine. This is a debate about physics. Here is what I am saying: If you but a Bose and JBL, Klipsch, EV, Peavey, Carvin, etc. speaker on a stage, and played a 90 dB. signal (measured at the same distance) thru each one - will the sound not deteriorate at the same speed? I don't see how a speaker could 'lose SPL' faster than another. The speed of sound is the speed of sound, and if the sound starts off at the same volume, it will taper off at the same volume, correct? ---------------- You're right -- I am no phycists, but even I know that this thing won't work in the manner Bose is claiming it will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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