Projector vs. Plasma

[kde]

I'm not sure why buying a TV has become this difficult of a decision.

For the main TV of the house -- any recommendations on the purchase of a projector (hang from celing) vs mounting a plasma on the wall? I guess the projector will provide a larger picture, but not as clear. Also, concerns on a plasma's life span vs replacing the bulbs all the time with a projector.

What happens if a ceiling fan is near the projector on a ceiling? With a projector, would I need a white wall or a mounted white screen, or could I portray the image on a tan wall?

Light in the room is not a problem...

[picky]

I'm not trying to be mean here but, .......

If you are willing to spend all that money to buy a projector only to project the image an tan wall....you might as well buy a regular 21" TV set for the coffee table an call it a day. Yes, you will need to buy a screen or make one by painting your wall with Screen Goo. That's assuming the whole reason for buying the projector in the first place is to enjoy a high-quality image projected at it's greatest potential.

Two things:

1 - Ceiling fans and projectors (in close proximity) don't mix, unless you plan to vacuum the dust out of the projector's ventilation ports on a weekly basis. -That is just my opinion. I am certain some users out there have had success with this. Still: I'd vacuum often. Why take the chance with a $400 bulb?

2 - If you can't control the ambient light in your viewing room during the day, buy the plasma. It will be brighter than the projected image from most front projectors. LCD projectors tend to be brighter than DLP. Picture quality differences between the two (LCD Vs DLP) is a matter of personal opinion. I tend to prefer DLP images, but they usually require a darkened room. As you mention: the light in your room isn't an issue so this is pretty much a moot point.

As far as bulbs: a Plasma will out-last a front projector bulb by many, many years, but the plasma costs many times more than the average projector to begin with.

As for clarity between plasma and projection: I beg to differ. They are both excellent, but I prefer a projected image because I think it is not only sharper, but the higher contrast ratio makes it look more cinemagraphic than plasma. -Again, my own opinion.

Bottom line: Please consider this: No matter which of these items you ultimately decide on, if you plan to use it as your main television as you said, that tells me you will probably be viewing a lot of regular TV network programming. That means non DVD-quality and not High Definition. Be forewarned: Any of these sets will make regular television look like Hell! They are so good that they tend to exploit all of the faults and aberrations in regular broadcast network television and I have seen many people become heart-broken having spent thousands of dollars for these devices expecting the ultimate picture; only to find out that they can't stand the way regular TV looks on them. And, it's all because no body told them this up front.

[ARPRINCE]

I'm not trying to be mean here but, .......

Be forewarned: Any of these sets will make regular television look like Hell!

They are so good that they tend to exploit all of the faults and

aberrations in regular broadcast network television and I have seen

many people become heart-broken having spend thousands of dollars for

these devices expecting the ultimate picture; only to find out that

they can't stand the way regular TV looks on them. It's it's all

because no body told them this up front..

RIGHT ON THE MONEY! So go get cable or satellite with an HD channel. You'll be missing a lot if you don't- a WHOLE LOT!!!

[Petrol]

Dang great post Picky... left me speachless

[Cal Blacksmith]

Not much to add to Pickys post but that I prefer a LCD to DLP, IMHO

just a much better picture. Plasma screens tend to want to burn in so

if games are to be use on it, be warned. Also, they may last much

longer than a bulb but they loose brightness fairly quickly and they

are much more expensive to replace than a bulb.

For our day to day TV viewing, we just have a 32" crt. It may not be as

sexy as a plasma but it is proven technology, lasts a LONG LONG time

and is much lower cost than screens in the same size range.

[picky]

Below is the most extensive information I have seen to date regarding plasma screens.

This link is sponsored by Pioneer Electronics and busts a lot of the myths assoicated with plasma screens.

Granted, it's 16 pages, but excellent reading:

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/pio/pe/images/portal/cit_3424/273087528Pioneer%20DTV%20White%20Paper%20-%20FINAL.pdf

Some Highlights: (quotes from their document)

"First, while image retention can occur in modern plasmas, the effect is temporary.

After the 48-hour torture test, all three of the plasma TVs that were tested showed clearly visible images from the game menu, whereas none of the LCD or MD rearprojection-

based sets showed any image retention. However, after regular video material (a DVD movie set to continuously loop) was played through the sets for 24

hours, the image completely disappeared from all three plasmas, leaving no trace. Unlike early generation plasmas, where those type of images would not go away and

could actually "burn" onto the screen, modern plasma TVs enjoy a combination of more robust screen materials and subtle image-shifting technologies that have

rendered this former issue moot."

Also:

"Today's plasma screens endure 20 years of viewing (8 hours per day) before reaching half of their original brightness."

[Bimmeup]

Kde,

Are you choosing between a plasma or projector because you don't want a tv sticking out from the wall? Just curious because it seems that the newest rear-projection tv's have all the quality etc. etc. of plasmas but are a lot cheaper size for size. They have also made them a lot thinner as well so if you have the option, you could build in a spot for a rear-projection! As Picky said though, you will see how crappy regular tv looks on a HD display. But that being said, I bought a Sony 55" rear-projection lcd HDTV about 3 months ago (my first HD tv) and yes, regular tv looked crappy. But it seems that I've gotten used to it now so it doesn't really bug me anymore. Besides, the HD channels that I'm getting through DirectTV are worth it. Discovery HD has some great programming too. DVD's look great as well! I know that the newest Sony Grand Wega SXRD lcd rear-projection tv's have got a ton of praise in recent articles because of the resolution. Each silicon chip for the RGB is 2 million pixels of resolution!!!

As far as the LCD & DLP debate goes, it's pretty much a personal preference on which one you like and which one's annoyances you can deal with. My dad has a 60" Samsung rear-projection DLP and the picture in HD is great and smooth but lacks color clarity in my view whereas on my Sony 55" LCD, the picture seems a little crisper and more colorful. But again, it's all a personal preference because some people like the crisper look and color but others like more of a smooth picture that the DLP offers. You just have to compare.

Hope this helps,

Bimmeup

Matt

[Cal Blacksmith]

Pickey, it is nice to know that major advances have been made in

quality and life of plasma TVs. Our TV is on for about 18 hours a day

so the life would be more like 10 years, still not too bad, though a

tube will be just as good at 20 years as it was the day it was made vs

plasma that will be worn out by then (1/2 life at 10 years as per our

useage)

[picky]

Pickey, it is nice to know that major advances have been made in quality and life of plasma TVs. Our TV is on for about 18 hours a day so the life would be more like 10 years, still not too bad, though a tube will be just as good at 20 years as it was the day it was made vs plasma that will be worn out by then (1/2 life at 10 years as per our useage)

Right, Cal: Worn out ...or....obsolete!!! []

Are you gettin' a Hi-Def coverter box for that CRT in a couple of years? []

[Cal Blacksmith]

That should be taken care of by the Sat. box. Sat reception is all

digital now anyway, though there is not much hi def content. There are

too many customers with Dish to not make some kind of provision for

older TVs[]

Not to mention it will make a great box to use in the shop with DVDs,

Tapes and the like. We faced the dilemma of what to do when our last set

went belly up after 15 years, we decided that we could afford to spend

$400 for a 32" tube set (4 years ago) knowing that Hi Def was coming.

Correct me if I am wrong but isn't the big deal not that HI Def was

coming but rather than all signals will be digital instead of analog?

If that is the case, our set top box for Dish has that covered right

now anyway.

[kde]

All good points...

What happens when I add a HDTV plasma to our regular Directv service? Will we have to spend another $600 on a Directv HDTV signal? Will a HDTV with a "built in" tuner work with Directv?

Regarding the other responses... we need a thin screen to fit the entertainment center and the position of my center channel (THX Ultra II). I was leaning towards the plasma, but was always curios of the projector. Would be nice to have both -- for football games...

[Jeff Matthews]

Nix the projector idea. Doesn't work good unless room is dark. Plasma concerns are warranted as expressed by others in this thread. My understanding is LCD and DLP have these little not-too-expensive modules that you can replace if the brightness weakens too much due to age. I have a Samsung 65" DLP. It's great, but be forewarned that local broadcasts look grainy and pixel-like - just like was said by others.

[SCOOTERDOG]

Well Picky,

You know my point of view, Nothing better than a 10' screen to make your jaw drop.

[TommyC]

I'm not trying to be mean here but, .......

Bottom line: Please consider this: No matter which of these items you ultimately decide on, if you plan to use it as your main television as you said, that tells me you will probably be viewing a lot of regular TV network programming. That means non DVD-quality and not High Definition. Be forewarned: Any of these sets will make regular television look like Hell! They are so good that they tend to exploit all of the faults and aberrations in regular broadcast network television and I have seen many people become heart-broken having spent thousands of dollars for these devices expecting the ultimate picture; only to find out that they can't stand the way regular TV looks on them. And, it's all because no body told them this up front.

I was not-so-politely asked to leave the Ultimate Electronics store in Plano for pointing this out to a young couple thinking about spending six grand on a TV after admitting it was mostly just for watching network broadcast TV. The sales droid told them to ignore me because I was just showing my lack of knowledge.

[picky]

I'm not trying to be mean here but, .......

Bottom line: Please consider this: No matter which of these items you ultimately decide on, if you plan to use it as your main television as you said, that tells me you will probably be viewing a lot of regular TV network programming. That means non DVD-quality and not High Definition. Be forewarned: Any of these sets will make regular television look like Hell! They are so good that they tend to exploit all of the faults and aberrations in regular broadcast network television and I have seen many people become heart-broken having spent thousands of dollars for these devices expecting the ultimate picture; only to find out that they can't stand the way regular TV looks on them. And, it's all because no body told them this up front.

I was not-so-politely asked to leave the Ultimate Electronics store in Plano for pointing this out to a young couple thinking about spending six grand on a TV after admitting it was mostly just for watching network broadcast TV. The sales droid told them to ignore me because I was just showing my lack of knowledge.

TommyC: Why am I not surprised? That really blows. It's always about the almighty dollar, isn't it? Sorry the hear that Tom. What a raw deal. Thanks for sharing. I guess that store isn't worrying about REPEAT customers. They'll be Chapter 11 in 5 years or less. It seems that few companies give a damn about their employees or customers these days. Klipsch is the exception!

CAL: You may be alright with that decoder box. I dunno for certain.

kde: To my knowledge, because I have never had a dish, the dish companies seem to have existing customer upgrade offers all of the time. Our son is a dish customer. They just upgraded him a couple of months ago to HDTV service on 3 sets and gave him 3 boxes (for 3 separate TVs) each with a built-in PVR (hard drive recorder). I think he said he paid next to nothing for the upgrade. He simply pays more per month now for the HD serivce. When you are ready to upgrade, I suggest you check with your provider for specail deals. Cable users can usually get deals too. My wife and I check with Comcast every 2 months and it saves us a lot of money.

[kde]

I just sent directv a note asking for upgrade options. From conversations with friends, I think that I will need to switch my "round" dish to an "oval" dish that is capable of receiving hdtv and 5.1 content, along with getting a new tivo and receiver unit.

we'll see...

[earthaziel]

Hey, first wanted to say thanks to everyone who has posted on

here. I work for Best Buy in Grand Rapids, MI and now I (as well

as fellow forum poster Brayton) are THE audio guys to talk to in any of

the Best Buy stores in GR :-) Mostly thanks to what you all have

been writing about. Second

kde: You were wondering about how Directv looks on an HDTV even

if you weren't running Hidef. It actually looks pretty good,

because Directv is still a digital signal, even if you aren't running

hidef. We have a 55" sony LCD projection running with Directv in

our projo room. Even when it isn't bringing in HD broadcasts it still

looks very nice. Your local channels over Directv will most

likely be a different monster altogether. Most of the time local

channels over the dish don't look all that nice simply because of the

quality of the signal being sent to Directv from the local channels,

BUT if you are going to run HD local channels using an off-air antennae

plugged into a hi-def directv box then that would solve bad local

picture quality. Next you were wondering about plasma versus a

projector. I at one point owned a projector and it was

great. I mean get something with a really high lumens and it is

viewable even if there is a bit of ambient light. Personally

though if it is AT ALL possible to fit a tv with about a 16 or 17 inch

depth go for the SXRD Song projection. I would take that over any

plasmas at the same price range. It is a beautiful set and I have

to hold myself back from humping the tv every time I look at it.

The 1080P it can display (even though it doesn't accept a 1080P source)

is fricking gorgeous. Not to mention the 400 dollar price drop

the tv just had. Really plasma versus projection comes down to

eaze versus size. The projector you have to be more cautious

about the room, but you also don't get as big of a screen with a

plasma. Hope that helped a bit.

[kde]

good points - thanks

[TheSoundBroker]

Here is what I tell my clients...

Think about your watching habits. If you lean towards watching movies

and sports, go the extra mile and get yourself a front projector. There

simply is no substitute for size when it comes to watching a movie.

Think about how many serious theaters you've seen in the

magazines/online/etc that had a plasma set.

If your habits tend towards watching more TV (news, etc) then a Plasma

or LCD flat panel will work fine for you. Picture quality wise,

projection is better with a good source but will showcase more flaws in

a poor one. Not because of the nature of projection, but because of the

size. A 110" plasma set would show up just as many flaws.

And yes...as mentioned so eloquently before, you will need a screen.

Price wise, it ends up being a toss up or in favor of the projector

when you factor in a *good* screen. The screen is one area you can't

cheese out on...it is a necessity...but once invested in and properly

taken care of will outlast you. You may go thru a few projectors over

the next many decades as upgradeitis hits...but your screen will be

there if you invest in a good one. Think acoustic screen (Screen

Research is my recommendation) even if you don't put the speakers

behind for now since at some point you may upgrade to a dedicated

theater.

[merkin]

A screen doesn't have to be that expensive. I built a 92" diagonal for around $140 total. I built the frame using inexpensive 1 by 4 pine and some metal braces. I bought the screen material ( in my case a 0.8 gain dalite) for 120 bucks. About 3 hours work in figuring and putting together. Looks great and I can change out the screen material any time for another 120 depending on my needs or upgrade. Picture quality is fantastic. ( The HD stuff looks as good as a plasma to me) The new projectors with more lumins are really coming down in price and they work very well in some ambient light. I can't have my ceiling spots on right in front of the screen but lights in rest of the room are fine. I have a 46" DLP samsueg upstairs for watching the news and such but rest of the time I find myself going down stairs to watch the games and movies. Lamp life is a consideration but you have that on rear projection DLP's also. I still vote for a projector and get a small crt for the news.