oldbuckster Posted October 14, 2006 Share Posted October 14, 2006 Our German Brothters seem to have some WICKED EQUIPMENT over there, he talked about more gear in one posting than mentioned in 58 pages of this thread....funny how that works .................I wonder if they have ever heard a SET amp.......doesn't seem he mentions them............. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BARRA BAZZ: The Genesis Part 1 Posted October 14, 2006 Share Posted October 14, 2006 The Heavy Metal / SS Invasion has landed. This really ought to shake things up around here. Way too cool !!!! Never had the opportunity to have a local klipsch dealer that was into heavy metal and rock. My dealers seem to rather sip some champagne and listen to some classical(no offense meant to some of the other members who enjoy classical just not my cup of tea). And when ever I would come in and listen to some new gear with my music I would always get those "you cant be serious" looks. Glad to see some new folks with my interests(styles of music) join the forum. You and others just keep making this klipsch forum better and better. Thanks! Hey stormin, im no dealer - but damned yeah, i love Rock and Metal - though i have some thousends of Classic and jazz records, too. But im coming from Hard Rock and make progressive Rock. If you wish and your mailbox has 12 MB free, is send you our newest song. You only must tell me your mail adress. But Werner Enge, our biggest german Klipsch dealer is a Rock guitar player, too and he loves Hard Rock, too! There are only a handful of speakers on the worldmarket which are able really to reproduce dynamic rock music. Klipsch speakers are perhaps the best one for that thing. Thanks for your warm welcome! This is the best forum ive ever seen! Cheers Werner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3dzapper Posted October 14, 2006 Share Posted October 14, 2006 Werner, I'd pick up a pair of those Emmiters but for two things: they are too heavy, I could only carry one and armed robbery is illegal.[] The bass must be wicked!!! src="http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/images/smilies/gif/tongue.gif" border=0 unselectable="on" editorid="vB_Editor_001"> Most of us here are in the 95% range. It's that top 5% of performance that gets soooo expensive. For the most part, we enjoy our Blueberries and mid-priced amps. It is difficult if not impossible to get the musical properties of a tube amp in SS within our meager budgets. It's not for lack of want, I also want an AMG Benz. That is the beauty of Klipsch. It allows us with limited funds to enjoy wonderful sounds without taking out a mortgage. I could afford my Klipschorns brand new by literally saving my change for a few years. That would be impossible with the high-end "audiopile" brands even in 1977. Dunka Klipsch. Rick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Spinner Posted October 14, 2006 Share Posted October 14, 2006 . It is difficult if not impossible to get the musical properties of a tube amp in SS within our meager budgets try a ...Crown D-45/75 series 2 or ... a K-1 .../2 or .. ifn' ya want to spend $$$ Crown Studio Reference ........[] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edwinr Posted October 14, 2006 Share Posted October 14, 2006 The Crown Studio Reference would be a good start - but I reckon my Classe Model Twenty Five isn't bad either. I would quite happily compare my Classe with a 50 or 60 watter tube amplifier. Maybe the tube amp would have the edge in 'atmosphere' and warmth, but overall the Classe does sound very tube like. Or have I got it the wrong way around? Maybe good tube amplifiers sound very solid state! [] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marvel Posted October 14, 2006 Share Posted October 14, 2006 Maybe the good equipment doesn't sound like anything and all you hear is the music. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Spinner Posted October 14, 2006 Share Posted October 14, 2006 ................[]................. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parrot Posted October 14, 2006 Share Posted October 14, 2006 The problem with this statement is that it is assuming that a 25W amp is sufficient for a low efficiency speaker. I don't think most people would agree with that. When you start out with a faulty premise, the conclusion you reach is also likely to be faulty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Painful Reality Posted October 14, 2006 Share Posted October 14, 2006 Well said, Craig. I've got a pretty good job. Many would give their eye teeth to do what I do everyday. But it doesn't matter what others think. I do this job day in and day out - to me it's just a job. No offense but unless your day job involves your intimate part and a pair of sexy twins, chances are that nobody envy you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Painful Reality Posted October 14, 2006 Share Posted October 14, 2006 The problem with this statement is that it is assuming that a 25W amp is sufficient for a low efficiency speaker. I don't think most people would agree with that. When you start out with a faulty premise, the conclusion you reach is also likely to be faulty. What is the definition of a low efficiency speaker? 99 db? 88? 93? The problem always get down to what are you listening to. I've got good results listening to jazz with a 25 W ultra linear tube amp and 83 dB Rogers LS3/5A. The same setup was awful for symphonies. And no matter the setup, everything was awful when I listened to Dean's compressed FM pseudo-rock tunes... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seti Posted October 14, 2006 Share Posted October 14, 2006 So your suggestingthat the Dope From Hope papers prepared by Klipsch and fellow engineers are bunk? These are not the words of a marketing department but pek and his engineers. What was a low efficeincy speaker for the sixties? The recurring theme over and over in the DFH articles is that their high efficeincy speakers do not require alot of watts. His comments on high powered solid state are hilarious. I love it when he uses the phrase "acid rock freak" too dam funny. If 2 watts can get you 100db out of the belle or la scala or khorn then it would seem that an 8wpc SET would do the trick. Next amp on my list is the 2a3 based Brook 12a that pwk raved about @ 10watts. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3dzapper Posted October 14, 2006 Share Posted October 14, 2006 . It is difficult if not impossible to get the musical properties of a tube amp in SS within our meager budgets try a ...Crown D-45/75 series 2 or ... a K-1 .../2 or .. ifn' ya want to spend $$$ Crown Studio Reference ........[] I have to admit Duke the only Crown I've ever auditioned was the DC-150. At that time my Marantz was better. I know Leo likes his. Maybe I'll look for one for a "summer" amp next year. Rick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3dzapper Posted October 14, 2006 Share Posted October 14, 2006 Grrrr. "blue screen" error!!!! src="http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/images/smilies/gif/angry.gif" unselectable="on" editorid="vB_Editor_001"> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parrot Posted October 14, 2006 Share Posted October 14, 2006 You have to read what PWK wrote. You clearly are not reading what I wrote, just a few posts back. PWK is setting up an if/then scenario. The if/then scenario is given, is accepted. It's like in math, assume a perfect circle. That statement doesn't mean that all circles you meet up with are going to be perfect. As another example, if one raisin is enough to feed a man, then one raisin will feed one million ants. The logic is sound but the initial premise is nonsense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Spinner Posted October 15, 2006 Share Posted October 15, 2006 the only Crown I've ever auditioned was the DC-150. Rick the DC 150/ 300 has very high levels of negative feedback it is not a good choice for playback of music Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BARRA BAZZ: The Genesis Part 1 Posted October 15, 2006 Share Posted October 15, 2006 The problem with this statement is that it is assuming that a 25W amp is sufficient for a low efficiency speaker. I don't think most people would agree with that. When you start out with a faulty premise, the conclusion you reach is also likely to be faulty. Hey friend, my personal listening experience was that not the watts are the urgent thing. Most speakers today have a good efficiency, only a handful of monsters and electrostatics need more than a handful of watts on the paper. Im used to speakers with efficiency between 94 and 102 db in the last decades. I even had 400 Watts Melos tube Mono Blocks but got nearly no bass out of my 15 inch Westminster hornspeaker with 99 db efficiency. Another tube amp form Cayin , the TI 88 - was beating the dust out of the drivers with 25 watts! But it sounded flat in the midrange and highs and the speaker was colouring. Though it had even more bass like a big Pass X 600 SS or am AVM M3 or a Luxman M 383 or a NAD S 200! I tried so many things and talked with dozends of researching engineers, they all explained that the watt battle is the wrong way because the damping factor says how realistic an amp can punch a speaker. In the moment i have the ASR Emitters (since 1999) and they really do punch the speakers with a killing damping factor and perfect control. For my Klipsch RF 7 i also tested a SS watt giant from Tannoy Professionel line - was sounding horrible and dull. I also tested SS Mark Levinson 383 - was the opposite - sounding harsh that i was nearly before getting the blood out of my ears. ??? Good result with lower level did a Reußenzehn tube amp.(i forgot the type a friend was bringing it into my house) But best results had the Emitters 1 and 2 with a never ending damping factor. Ask Werner Enge, he hast audited the little Emmi in my house. I think everybody should test different amps and take the amp where you can not hear the speaker - only the musicians. A perfect 3 D stage and a sound which suits to the room acoustic and the personal taste. I was very surprised in the last decades that nearly every amp has perfect measuring datas in the prospect - but the sound is totally different, i can not understand why amps make so much differences with most speakers. Man - change a tube in your amp - and you fall on your ***! I experimented in the past with some Lorenz tubes and such Retro things - was very surprised. Im no engineer - but i do what my ears and my heart say. The only thing i understand is - watts are not so urgent -.exception is very very low watts - for example 5 watts for a 85 db efficiency speaker -can make a problem:) Cheers Your Klipsch Priest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Spinner Posted October 15, 2006 Share Posted October 15, 2006 what is the ASR damping factor ...???? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BARRA BAZZ: The Genesis Part 1 Posted October 15, 2006 Share Posted October 15, 2006 what is the ASR damping factor ...???? Hey Duke, ASR is not saying much to that - they only say much bigger 1.000. A german magazine stopped by measuriog over 10.000 !!!! and this was only little Emmi 2 plus. Cheers Werner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edwinr Posted October 15, 2006 Share Posted October 15, 2006 Well said, Craig. I've got a pretty good job. Many would give their eye teeth to do what I do everyday. But it doesn't matter what others think. I do this job day in and day out - to me it's just a job. No offense but unless your day job involves your intimate part and a pair of sexy twins, chances are that nobody envy you. LOL! Chances are you're right! [] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stormin Posted October 15, 2006 Share Posted October 15, 2006 . It is difficult if not impossible to get the musical properties of a tube amp in SS within our meager budgets try a ...Crown D-45/75 series 2 or ... a K-1 .../2 or .. ifn' ya want to spend $$$ Crown Studio Reference ........[] I have to admit Duke the only Crown I've ever auditioned was the DC-150. At that time my Marantz was better. I know Leo likes his. Maybe I'll look for one for a "summer" amp next year. Rick What I have found with my my style of music, which maybe it does matter, is that the QSC 2422 and the marantz 2325 are a great pairing with my chorus II's. The marantz alone just seems to smear alot of detail and the bottom in though punchy is just ok. But when you use the QSC as the amplifier what a difference. The QSC has a very tight and forceful bottom end with so much more of the music coming through. I can really achieve concert levels here in my listening room without any hint of pain. And always volume has equaled pain but just not so with this set up. The QSC is such a smooth performer and the marantz seems to add the perfect touch of warmth. I think I am going to stay right where I'm at for awhile cause I am really diggin it. Klipsch, which is so terribly truthful about what you put behind them let all the flaws in a system just come shining through. I've experienced the breaking glass with klipsch and I'm not going back. Also that upper midrange glare isn't coming around here again either. And I absolutely love a very solid foundation. Boom sucks but solid rocks! Now wait let me get this just right. How would Duke say it. I've got it this systems has Thwaaaaaaaaackkkkkkkkk !!!!!!!! PS: By the way QSC has that ridiculous high damping factor as well leading me to believe it might have alot to do with the extremely solid foundation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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