lech Posted November 22, 2006 Share Posted November 22, 2006 I am running my Khorns by JJ electronics 322 SET 300B without any feedback. It produce 20+20 watt well done. More than enough to blow out all funitures. My previuos speakers was von Schwickert VR 3 with a sensetivity of 87 db/m. Ok, they have a lower bottom frequence than my present Khorns. The Horns are fantastic but i am lacking the lowest frequences. I do not want to add a sub woofer. 105 db/m seems to be to mutch in the upper frequences. Can I add a attuentator in the Crossover filter for the upper frequenases ,and if how ?? The filter is AK 3 ( sorry for the Swenglich , hope you understand) BR Lech Lech Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnA Posted November 22, 2006 Share Posted November 22, 2006 http://www.carstereo.com/help2/Articles.cfm http://www.carstereo.com/help2/Articles.cfm?id=18 You can add an L-pad to the tweeter and/or the squawker. If you attenuate the levels more than 1.5 dB, you should drop the tap points on the autoformer, like the Cornwall crossover. Each tap on the autoformer drops the level 3 dB. Because bass frequencies are controlled by the length of the horn, you cannot modify the Klipschorn to make it produce deeper notes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEC Posted November 22, 2006 Share Posted November 22, 2006 John, He has the AK-3 crossover. It uses the T4A which does not have extra taps. Bob Crites Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leok Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 Try using the 4 Ohm output on your amps (if they exist). Leo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lech Posted November 23, 2006 Author Share Posted November 23, 2006 Thanks for thr tip There are 4 Oms outet as well. BR Lennart Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Klappenberger Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 Lech, There is nothing you can do to get lower bass from a Khorn. There is always a trade-off in every engineering situation. The Khorn design goal trades the deepest bass for far lower distortion with a slightly higher low end cutoff. Reducing the high end won't solve the poroblem, but it might reduce the harshness of the K400 midrange horn a bit. The best upgrades for the Khorn is to replace the midrange horn with something better or at least to cover the outsiide of it with damping material. Al K. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrestonTom Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 Lech, There is nothing you can do to get lower bass from a Khorn. There is always a trade-off in every engineering situation. The Khorn design goal trades the deepest bass for far lower distortion with a slightly higher low end cutoff. Reducing the high end won't solve the poroblem, but it might reduce the harshness of the K400 midrange horn a bit. The best upgrades for the Khorn is to replace the midrange horn with something better or at least to cover the outsiide of it with damping material. Al K. If the K-Horns are of a vintage that have an AK crossover, then the mid horn is probably composite (and not metal) and would not need damping. Regarding the bass response, there may be a chance that putting the K-Horns along a different wall may improve the bass response. If we are talking about very low bass, this may only change some of the room modes (in terms of location, & possibly in terms of frequency). Although it would not be a cure, the lower bass may become less objectionable. Good luck, -Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest " " Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 " Can I add a attuentator in the Crossover filter for the upper frequenases ,and if how ??" http://www.edcorusa.com/transformers/em/em_auto.htm If you want to do this at a low cost....52 bucks total for both speakers plus shipping You can use an em3015 on each of the tweeters. each em3015 will cost 11 dollars each. The spec's for the em3015 is 15 watts rms, 30hz - 15khz +- 1db. You can use an em3030 on each of the mid drivers. each emm3030 will cost 15 dollars each. The spec's for the em303 is 30 watts rms, 30hz - 15khz +- 1db. You would connect them simular to how a T2A is connected....but instead use a transformer for each driver...move the positive lead from the crossover that goes to the driver positive terminal off the driver and place it where the photo shows 70 volts, connect a wire from the positive lead of your driver to any of the 16, 8, or 4 ohm taps, and connect the ground of the transformer to the ground point used of the specific driver. 16 being the loudest and 4 beling the lowest sound level. Using autoformers in my view is better than resistors, lpads, or other resistive in-line devices. Total cost using the emXX autoformers would be about 52 dollars for both speakers (4 autoformers total). If cost is not an issue, Bob (BEC) has an autoformer that has 12 tap settings. Cost is about 32.50 each. Using the layout above, 4 would cost you about 130, plus shipping. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJkizak Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 Lech: Perhaps a picture of your K-horns in the listening room might help. JJK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djk Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 "The Horns are fantastic but i am lacking the lowest frequences. " How are your walls? The Klipschorn will lose bass below about 100hz with modern sheet-rock walls. If your walls are OK, is it only below 50hz? A passive filter on the input to your amplifier can boost the bass below 50hz. Many tube amplifers have an input cap. Some have a grid choke. By changing the values of these we can have 6~9dB of boost in the 30hz region declining to about 1dB in the 50hz region. If your amp doesn't have a grid choke, you can remove the grid-leak resistor and add the choke. Or you can simply build the cap and choke in an external box and use ahead of the amplifier. Values of the cap and choke depend on how low of impedance your preamp can drive, and the frequency and amount of boost required. I have used caps in the range of 2µF~4µF with chokes in the range of 10H~20H with good results. The preamp must be able to drive 5K ohms for this range of values. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Groomlakearea51 Posted November 24, 2006 Share Posted November 24, 2006 How are your walls? The Klipschorn will lose bass below about 100hz with modern sheet-rock walls. Interesting, I had not heard that before. Does that apply to conventional single sheet thick on studs type of construction only. I'm working with an architect getting ready to design a new house, and am looking at "treatment" of a room using two layers, first of greenboard, then gypsum or sheet rock, isolated from the studs. I don't want to unintentionally "kill off" bass on the Klipschorn's due to sheetrock problems, or will the method I'm looking at probably take care of that problem? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djk Posted November 25, 2006 Share Posted November 25, 2006 The Klipschorn sounds best in the basement, or solid concrete walls. Next would have to be 2" plaster and lath, sheetrock a distant fourth, and metal studs with sheetrock the worst. Read up on studio treatments using Acoustilead and mass-loaded-vinyl. STC curves head south below 250hz, and most stop at 100hz because nothing works below there. Acoustilead and mass-loaded-vinyl products work best between layers of sheetrock. See notes from various manufacturers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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