Advice on buying video cameras

[J M O N]

Well the wife is asking for a video camera. The problem is, this is not something I've followed so I don't know what the various types are and what would be the best kind to get. I know HD cameras are out there, but we don't have an HD television nor a HD DVD player. I don't mind holding off on getting a HD video camera but would consider getting one now if that really is the way to go. Anyway, does anyone have advice on what I shoud look for?

[Jay481985]

There are a few types out there.

There is the older Hifi tapes that are rather larger compared to now a days video camera (they should be around 299 or so) but that technology is near dead.

The next is minidv. They are okay quality, don't expect crystal clear picture but they do the job admirable. They are also around 299 and above. Sony got some good ones. When I worked at bestbuy it was about what most people were looking for, not too expensive, not poor quality and can be transfered to the computer or video player/dvd recorder. The minidv last about 60 minutes good quality 90 minutes extended. The tapes can be brought on sale for around 20 dollars for 5 of them if you check the flyers.

We then have mini dvd camcorders. This is for mostly people who don't want to deal with wires. It records on a mini dvd (not full size!!!) and records 30 minutes of play on each side (they are double sided or single sided. Any one that claims 60 minutes is double sided) The mini dvd are not cheap but one nice thing is you can just plop into a dvd player and go watch. You can get dvd-r which are one time and dvd-rw which you can record and erase. But if you try to erase something out of sequence (say you recorded 0-5 minutes 5-10 minutes and 10-15 minutes and you want to erase the middle 5 minutes you will not get that back as you cannot record over a written space you can just erase the whole thing or the last segment) These are not cheap they start 399 and up

Then we have hard drive camcorders. Basically think of them as ipods but for recording video. They have an ipod like harddrive (1.8 inch hard drive) that record everything. No more buying tapes or dvds.... but you can record only as much as your hard drive can hold (20, 30 gig and 60 gig, there might be an 80) I believe the 20 gig holds about 3 hours 30 about 4 hours and 60 about 8 hours. If you want high quality you basically half the time or if you want extended mode you lose quality but double the timing. Basically this camcorder can hold an entire vacation basically. You can also erase certain segments and not deal with the dvd camcorder problem. To get it on disk you can do a few things. Get a dvd recoder, or they might have a combo where you can get the matching dvd recorder that makes it simple one button and it records. or you can load it up to the computer (sony tends to make it difficult by making it required to use their buggy software) you can use some movie programs that are not esoteric and cost around 50-80 dollars to get you through some simple editing. or you can put it on the trusty vcr. Cost starts around 399 and up. The battery will die alot faster then the recording medium. The mini dv the battery and recording medium basically match each other about 60 minutes. You might for the hard drive ones get a longer life battery but that will cost $$$ note the three $

Last we have those high definition camcorders. They come in all flavors: mini dv (special mini dv that cost 30 dollars for two 60 minute ones), mini dvd (same mini dvd just expect to get less time then already), and the hard drive (expect less recording time again with comparable hard drives) The high definition means usually 1080i. Meaning it records pretty good and clear. But its a double edged sword. I noticed when working there the system is great but its small so you shake alot more so then those big on the shoulder type camcorders. Its nice to have a tripod to make them shine. They are around 999 and up. If you want crystal clear picture this is the way, if you care more for the memory and not the quality I would get a mini dv.

Oh also it is worth it to get those special lenses. Sony offers Carl Zeiss lenses (ask any camera freak and they will tell you way Colter where are you []) though more a gimick it is still an improvement. Carl Zeiss lenses cost around average 3000 per lens

Panasonic I believe offers the Leica Len which again is on par with Carl Zeiss..... I believe Carl Zeiss is still the best (He basically is the father of mother optics), Leica a good second, Then Nikon (I am biased), then Canon (flame on, canon boys will flame me now)

[Marvel]

Really Jay, explain it more []. The minidv is still a fine medium. It uses a 5:1 compression ratio if I am remembering correctly and 720 x 480 resolution (I think, off the top of my head). HD will, as Jay points out, use more bandwidth. A few simple searches on the net can give you more info than you want to know. Picky does video on a regular basis, so he could give you a LOT of info. You can shoot 24p if you are thinking of transferring to film, but I would guess not (24p is 24 frames of progressive video, and motion pictures are shot at 24 frames per second if shot on film. Video is normally 30 frames per sec., two fields each)

tape is cheap, but you have to import in real time to do any editing. Hard drives allow the files to be copied and edited more quickly. The new, big bucks cameras use extremely high density memory cards.... you can imagine the cost.

Low price cams don't have any provision for external microphones, and we are interested in the sound, right.. this being an audio forum and all. It is another disease......

Bruce

[sunburnwilly]

About 5 weeks ago I jumped in both feet first . Never had a camcorder before . So what did I get ?

The mack daddy Sony HD with 5.1 Dolby surround and hard drive . This thing is awesome ! Allthough as I mentioned it is my first . Wonderfull picture quality , great sound and takes fantastic pics to boot . 10 x optic zoom and 80 x digital zoom . "Looks great on my 50" Samsung ."

I don't know what to tell you . I probably should have gotten a regular camcorder but I wanted something special for my trip to Costa Rica !

[Jay481985]

About 5 weeks ago I jumped in both feet first . Never had a camcorder before . So what did I get ?

The mack daddy Sony HD with 5.1 Dolby surround and hard drive . This thing is awesome ! Allthough as I mentioned it is my first . Wonderfull picture quality , great sound and takes fantastic pics to boot . 10 x optic zoom and 80 x digital zoom . "Looks great on my 50" Samsung ."

I don't know what to tell you . I probably should have gotten a regular camcorder but I wanted something special for my trip to Costa Rica !

I love the advertised 5.1..... yeah where is the 5.1 mic [] its virtual 5.1

Also make sure I forgot to write about it.... Get the highest optical.... Digital just means it crops the existing optical but loses quality...... digital is like blowing a picture picture meant for a certain size over the size it can normally be.

[sunburnwilly]

About 5 weeks ago I jumped in both feet first . Never had a camcorder before . So what did I get ?

The mack daddy Sony HD with 5.1 Dolby surround and hard drive . This thing is awesome ! Allthough as I mentioned it is my first . Wonderfull picture quality , great sound and takes fantastic pics to boot . 10 x optic zoom and 80 x digital zoom . "Looks great on my 50" Samsung ."

I don't know what to tell you . I probably should have gotten a regular camcorder but I wanted something special for my trip to Costa Rica !

I love the advertised 5.1..... yeah where is the 5.1 mic [] its virtual 5.1

Also make sure I forgot to write about it.... Get the highest optical.... Digital just means it crops the existing optical but loses quality...... digital is like blowing a picture picture meant for a certain size over the size it can normally be.

The camera has a 4 channel built in mic and somehow mixes it to 5.1 . Don't know how it works but it does . Wired and wireless mics can be added as well .

So whada ya say Hotshot ?

[Jay481985]

virtual []

i like to tease people on that, let alone anyone that knows about audio..... okay if it has a 4 channel mic build in the but the separation is less than an inch between microphones?

[wstrickland1]

About 5 weeks ago I jumped in both feet first . Never had a camcorder before . So what did I get ?

The mack daddy Sony HD with 5.1 Dolby surround and hard drive . This thing is awesome ! Allthough as I mentioned it is my first . Wonderfull picture quality , great sound and takes fantastic pics to boot . 10 x optic zoom and 80 x digital zoom . "Looks great on my 50" Samsung ."

I don't know what to tell you . I probably should have gotten a regular camcorder but I wanted something special for my trip to Costa Rica !

I love the advertised 5.1..... yeah where is the 5.1 mic [] its virtual 5.1

Also make sure I forgot to write about it.... Get the highest optical.... Digital just means it crops the existing optical but loses quality...... digital is like blowing a picture picture meant for a certain size over the size it can normally be.

The camera has a 4 channel built in mic and somehow mixes it to 5.1 . Don't know how it works but it does . Wired and wireless mics can be added as well .

So whada ya say Hotshot ?

easy Willy, remember he worked at Best Buy

[JJkizak]

I haven't been following the "lens quality syndrome" lately since the old film days but have read that the expensive HD cameras primarily have over 70 % of the cost in the quality of the lens. ($110,000.00) I used to try and get prices from the big guy's on 20 x1 zoom lenses for "Anamorphic 2.66 x 1--- 16 & 35mm lenses" and see which one would make me fall off my stool, and they all did. And this was in the 60's and 70's.

JJK

[picky]

JMON: I've been shooting movies since I was a young pup. It all began with regular 8mm film, then Super 8mm film with sound and so on. In 1988 I bought a high-end VHS camcorder by Panasonic. I used that machine until 1997, when I upgraded to MiniDV. I bought a Canon Elura for $1,400 and used it for the next 8 years until I literally wore it out. Then, because I freelance and make some money with some of my video work, I upgraded again to a large, Prosumer model Sony HD camera that still uses the MiniDV format which cost nearly $4,000. But, i currently down-convert my work to SD and burn it to standard DVDs. Everything I do is mastered on tape in HD so I can go back to it later and re-release it in Hi-Def if I want to.

Here is what I have discovered:

If you are new to videography:

Don't buy a particular camera based on the lens maker alone. Most reputable brands of camcorders in the consumer market today have resonably-good lenses.

The MiniDV format is fabulous. When shot in standard definition, it is recorded in uncompressed AVI format which edits like a breeze, as does down-converted HD..

If you don't think you will ever wish to edit any of your work, consider one of the direct-to-DVD cameras and be done with it. If you do wish to edit, buy a MiniDV tape-based camera.

Whatever the brand or model of camera you choose, you should expect to garner at least 10 years use from your camera (unless you shoot as much as I do) so buy one you are going to want to keep for ten years. In other words, buy an HD camera that will down-convert the video to SD (standard Definition) on the fly during the video capture mode to your hard drive.

Editing HD (which is actually based in a form of (mpeg-2 compression) is both precarious and expensive right now; hence the need for down-converting to SD.

If you have deep pockets and can afford a lot of rechargable batteries, consider a camcorder that records directly to a hard drive rather than to tape. This eliminates the need to capture to video to your hard drive. This gives you the option of just processing SD now and using HD later when you are ready, without any added expense.

Avoid being impressed with a camera's claim to digital zoom power. Digital zoom is pretty crappy. Be more impressed if the camera touts its optical zoom as being high.

Set a budget for your camera and stick to it. The are many cameras out there in every price range.

I like the Canon, Sony, Panasonic and JVC brands in no particular order.

Pay attention to the physical size of the camera. Is it convenient to carry around? If you buy one too large (much bigger than your hand), you won't want to hassle with taking it along with you when you go places. Remember: Smaller cameras tend to intimidate fewer people (subjects). I've had people freak-out when I point my large camera at them.

If you plan to edit your work, don't overlook te fact that your PC will have to be up to the task, too! To capture a one-hour MiniDV tape requires 15 gigs of free space on your hard drive and at least 30 gigs of free sace to edit it. The better MiniDV camera use firewire to transfer te video to the hard drive. Your computer will need to have a firewire terminal or PCI card.

If you plan to edit HD, you will need a speciality video editing card ($$$) from a manufacturer such as Matrox, Ulead, Pinnacle or Avid, as well as a Blu-Ray burner.

[J M O N]

Wow!! Thanks for all the great advice, and especially to Jay and Picky for their long lists of things to look for. This helps a lot!