mike stehr Posted January 3, 2002 Share Posted January 3, 2002 Thanks Ear, Your advice is most appreciated. Maybe this summer, when funds return to normal. Right now, about all I can afford to do, is fix the Non Audiophile Device. Painfull. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike stehr Posted January 3, 2002 Share Posted January 3, 2002 Okay, nobody was home tonight, so I measured my Chorus II's again, with the Rat Schack meter. Eight feet away, listening position. 12'x 14', 7 ft ceiling, speakers 11 and half feet apart. 98 Db's with the amp at about 9 o'clock, listening position. I decided to push it to ten. 104,106 Db's at the listening position. I measured at 1 meter from each speaker, pointing the meter at the enclosure. 114,116 Db's. It still sounds clean, nice! But then, the paneling on this cheap trailerhouse starts SINGING. Lame. Stepped outside for a minute, this poor little 60 footer's bumpin' like a Ghetto Hooptie. no subs. But these are ungodly levels, two or three songs at this volume makes you feel like you just snorted a line of crystal, gets ya Amped. Good thing the neighbors are mostly college students. Amazing what a crossover upgrade and cat5e wire can do. THANX! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lynnm Posted January 3, 2002 Share Posted January 3, 2002 So!!! that was you -you sob!! i was diying a seismic recorder and something flipped the recording drum off the spindle!! gonna getya boyo! ------------------ It is meet to recall that the Great Green Heron rarely flies upside down in the moonlight - (Foo Ling ca.1900) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mpgwagon Posted January 4, 2002 Share Posted January 4, 2002 The people living across the street say it's way too loud! ------------------ Yamaha RX-V620 receiver 1976 Klipsch La Scala's Klipsch KSW12 Sub. Klipsch SC1 Center Klipsch KG 3.5 rears Panasonic RV31 DVD Sharp 32" TV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike stehr Posted January 4, 2002 Share Posted January 4, 2002 There is 5 Carver TFM-75' floatin' on Ebay for around 3 or 4 hundred bucks! Damn! They got a Carver sd/a 360t changer on there, currently at 4 hundred bucks. LOL! Maybe I talk my brother-in law into frontin' some cash, I'm doing some work for him. I wonder how often the TFM-75's pop up on Ebay? Damn! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forresthump Posted January 4, 2002 Share Posted January 4, 2002 Carver what a joke. For $400 that about $100 for the amp & $300 for the name. ------------------ go forth & hump the world Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike stehr Posted January 4, 2002 Share Posted January 4, 2002 What do you suggest, forrest? I ain't bought sh*t yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEAR Posted January 4, 2002 Share Posted January 4, 2002 Mike, ForrestDumb could not tell you where a large pile of poop lied even if he had his nose in it. Gump always laces his posts with profanity and vulgarity.If you read his posts he has not said one good thing here.Gump must be a Bo$e owner who claims to have Klipsch.Its because the child does not have glasses...its Bo$e. Now Mike on a more serious side. The Carver TFM-75 if in top notch condition is a steal at $400.hear me...a STEAL. I dare anybody on this BB to give me a better deal for under $400.To drive subs. Remember the TFM-75 is built like a tank,will last years.Its a true DUAL MONO design(each channel has its own switch and power supply and needs a 15AMP outlet!...each channel!)This amp will deliver 1000W per channel into 4 Ohms and 750W into 8 Ohms! Its all RMS full bandwith. Now who can beat so many clean watts for subwoofer use at this price? NOBODY Only some trash can "PRO" amps can come close. ForrsetGump, If you can bash Carver so fast give me one amp that can match the TFM-75 for quality power for under $400. Here is another proof of your high IQ... "Carver what a joke. For $400 that about $100 for the amp & $300 for the name." You love to put both your feet in your mouth and pretend its mushrooms. Your audio experience is obviously very limited. So I am waiting...what is a better value than the TFM-75 to drive passive subs like SVS. If you cant provide an educated answer next time just shut the HELL up. TheEAR(s) Now theears Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P Ward Posted January 4, 2002 Share Posted January 4, 2002 I have to agree with the EAR, I have two carver amps and used to have the Carver Amazing Loudspeaker III's. Carver, that is when Bob owned them, was a very good company with quality equipment. Now that Sunfire is around they have raised the bar again with the True sub and their processors. I would put my old AL-III against ANY speaker under $6,000 for pure musical quality. I sold them because they are just too big and need alot of room to breath. I had them bi-amped with the Carver 705x that I still use for my cornwalls. I also have a TFM-35 bridged to 700 watts at 8 ohms that drive my sub and could not be happer. I know that some amps are better suited for specific things, but I'm happy with my carver stuff, and would only sell it for a major profit. ------------------ Paul Ward my home theater www.brookesbakersurveyors.com/klipschht.htm 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forresthump Posted January 4, 2002 Share Posted January 4, 2002 Earwax new name should be The Mouth. He no listen or look otherwise he would see I help all over this place with many years more experience. I've seen punks like him come and go over my years. Mike, you should look into a Heath Kit. I use the samson700 bridged for my SVS but look like you want to spend less. ------------------ go forth & hump the world Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Lindsey Posted January 4, 2002 Share Posted January 4, 2002 Forrest, I'm real curious how you have the Samson hooked up to the SVS in bridged mode. On page 4 of the Samson's owners manual, at the bottom of number 6 it states: WARNING: Due to the extremely high power output of the S700/S1000 when used in Bridged mode, be sure to use only loudspeakers sufficiently rated to handle the resultant wattage (in Bridged mode, these must be 8-ohm speakers). The SVS subs are 4-ohm speakers and I remember TV saying do not run them Bridged with the Samson. Do you know something we don't? Mike ------------------ My Music Systems Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forresthump Posted January 4, 2002 Share Posted January 4, 2002 mike L fine for me as in no blown 16-46 yet. seems a waste to me to have a 2 channel amp with one sub & let the other channel sit there unused. i do turn down the sub and LFE level 10db on my prepro. if I had it to do over I'd get the crown from SV. good price. ------------------ go forth & hump the world Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike stehr Posted January 4, 2002 Share Posted January 4, 2002 Forrest, I take it you have one SVS sub, right? Now when you bridged the Samson, did you series wire the sub to each channel? (Hot out one side and ground on the other?) I wired my two in series, because the Nad only bridges off the left side. Heathkit? From what I understand the general attitude about these, isn't all that great. What Heathkits do you favor? (From what I understand, is just net garb anyway.) But I am curious to your opinion to heathkit. Ear, couple questions. I gather you pulled the cover on your TFM-75. You said it's a dual mono design, are the transformers toriods? There is two, right? Are there rectifing circuits for each transformer? What brand of caps does Bob use in this amp? Two switches with TWO power cords? Do you have any ideas what output transistors are used (Mosfet/Bipolar), and what brands? Is it a straight class A amp? (SET.) Or is it Class A for so many watts then class A/B? (Like my MX-1.) There isn't a whole buttload of cheap jumper pins or wires? And does the circuit topology look nice and symmetrical, like a good dual mono SS should? If it has all these features, $400 can't be that bad. I'm a neutral party here. THANX! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forresthump Posted January 4, 2002 Share Posted January 4, 2002 Mike S yes just 1 16-46. The samson does the bridging internal with the standard hook up. They're just trying to relieve the returns saying not to use bridged mode. The bass is much stronger and cleaner this way. If you do blow something how are they going to know where the switch was anyway? ------------------ go forth & hump the world Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
h2xmark Posted January 4, 2002 Share Posted January 4, 2002 hey mike check out Cinepro at www.cinepro.com if you don't have a local dealer you can buy from the factory look at a model 1K2 that is a amp with level control knobs it packs some strong power and they have a couple of demo amps with full warranty for a great price,you can't go wrong with one of these ,mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEAR Posted January 4, 2002 Share Posted January 4, 2002 ForrestGump, "Earwax new name should be The Mouth. He no listen or look otherwise he would see I help all over this place with many years more experience. I've seen punks like him come and go over my years." You sure do help with 272 posts and half these are worthless attacks on Carver and Krell(two brands that put your Smason to SHAME). "I help all over this place" YOU NEED HELP ForrestGump,your case is very intriguing.You are as stubborn as a donkey! "I've seen punks like him come and go over my years" Your years? Where at the looney section of your local hospital.I am on this BB to stay,one or two mental cases will not chase me from a BB where I've made real contributions.Unlike you Gump. And dont confuse talking to yourself helping others. Mike, Yes I did just that! I did open the amp. The TFM-75 is a true dual mono,two separate sections. The center tunnel is a fan(92mm)cooled heatsing/tunnel. One each side you have two large shielded C-Core transformers. Each side has two huge 10000uf 125V caps and two 4700uf and two 6800uf Nichinon caps one each circuit board. The power supply is massive on this amp(for $400 there is no better amp period bring on the Samson). Each heatsink side has about 20 transistors(its very hard to count them as they are at the top/side and bottom of the heatsink tunnel).Made by Hitachi.These are at least rated at 100W each from their size. The chassis is buil like a tank and very rigid.This amp can be rack mounted for pro use. The amp weighs about 50lbs,power consumption can reach 1400W per channel at full power into 8 Ohms! The amp is rated at 750W into 8 Ohms and 1000W into 4 ohms per channel...full bandwith. Its not your classic class A or class A/B amp.Its a Magnetic Field amp.Bob Carver is the pioneer of these very eficient amps. It cannot compete with a Krell or Celeste when used as a two channel amp.Its outstanding from subwoofer use. So please dont make bad jokes. Inside the amp is quite complex,but the layout is very clean.And remember the two gain stages are exposed so its not more complex than say a Celeste and muchh less than a Levinson or Krell. The bottom line is I dare you to find a better value in a subwoofer amp. And WHAT is a great subwoofer amp. A: It has HUGE POWER B: Good damping C: Can drive 4 Ohms loads without any strain D: Does not cost too much The TFM-75 coveras all these and more. When you asked about class A or A/B you must be joking.If you knew Carver you would know Carver makes to this day amps you cant label class A or A/B. Even the Sunfire amps and the famous Carver Lightstar are not your classic class A or A/B amps. Dont mistake these with BASh amps,BASH amps are as refined as a bulldog.Bob carver's amps can compete with the best class A/B amps out there in terms of detail and overall sound quality. TheEAR(s) Now theears Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike stehr Posted January 5, 2002 Share Posted January 5, 2002 Okay at $400, with dual trannies, 23,000uf total capacitance, and Nichicon caps, I can't see this being a bad deal, any brand amp. (Did you notice if the Nichicon capacitors were green or gold, like the audio grade muse's?) or were they blue like the general grade stuff? No slam intended. Forrest, what is it you don't like about this particular carver amp? The sound? Or do you not like the sound of Carver products in general? Do you think they are cheaply made? (Explain.) I ain't here to flameout, I 'm just curious to your biased opinion on Carver products. I think the Carver CDP's suck, and Ear agrees with me. I think a good quality amplifier IMO, should double power output as the impedance lowers. For example,(no bridging) a 100 watt per channel amp, 200 watts total 8 ohms, should double to 200 watts per channel, 400 watts total into 4 ohms. At 2 ohms, the output should be 400 watts per channel, 800 watts total. And a real good one should have no variance in THD or TIM as the impedance lowers. (Does a Samson 700 do this?) But this sort of design I could never afford. Oh well, my sub amp situation is toast until income tax time. I had to buy a DVD player for my girlfreind to keep her happy, and now I am short. Looks like I have to fix the Non Audiophile Device. Oh,the pain! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike stehr Posted January 5, 2002 Share Posted January 5, 2002 Now Ear, This Carver TFM-75 has to have some sort of class rating. Don't Consumer amplifiers have to have a class rating for legal sale? Or is the Field magnetic a switching power supply, class D?(I think I'm aware of this circuit.) Refined as bulldog, that's good! BASH amp! BASH! BASH! BASH! BASH! I know this is class D switcher. THANX! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEAR Posted January 5, 2002 Share Posted January 5, 2002 Mike, Yes you guessed right its a Magnetic Field power amp. Or class D if you want,remember Carver masters class D amp better then any company I know of. Bob Carver proved time and again he is a master amp designer for class D amps. Mike like I said the TFM-75 has a total of four 10000uf 125V caps plus four 6800uf and four 4700uf of lower voltage(~25V?).Most would only see the 40000uf on the main caps.Its not only the 40000 value but these are 125V caps not the 40000uf at 60V or lower most see on amps. "I think a good quality amplifier IMO, should double power output as the impedance lowers." Yes it should,but its not always the case.Look at Bryston,their amps(4B) will be rated at 250W into 8 Ohms and "only" 400W into 4 Ohms.Would you say Bryston makes bad amps? Celsete amps also double the output(and when bridged the output at 8 Ohms is quadrupled,try this with a Samson). For what its worth the Samson amps make very good sub amplifiers.As I said you dont need a Pass Aleph Class A amp to drive a sub.Sure its much better...on paper but in actual use its impractical(cost)and almost foolish unless you have a six digit income each year. Krell and Mark Levinson are among the very best amps to showcase this.The FPB series will double its output down to 2 Ohms(and remain 10% above specs!).And the Krell MRA can do this to 0.5 Ohm! Now who can best this? Nobody Krell amps can be used as arc welders(jokes made by anti Krell haters who cant fault the amp and want to take a stab). The TFM-75 has all the drive and power you will ever need for even the SVS SS(I am sure).With ONE KILOWATT per channel you dont even need to bridge,its all the wattage most even heavy duty drivers will take. BTW I doubt Gump has anything important to say about Carver or Krell.He will rant here and there about how worthless these are,perhaps he knows Krell is out of his reach and hates Krell for this reason,perhaps he knows he cant lift a large Krell,perhaps he hates a company that makes better amps,who knows what makes the Gump tick ...Carver cheaply made! What is cheap,Gump should explain clearly. And YES I think...NO am convinced Carver CD players SUCK(err are not what I call value for the dollar)The only products I like from Bob Carver are the amplifiers and subwoofers.And his large hybrid speakers are ok. TheEAR(s) Now theears Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike stehr Posted January 5, 2002 Share Posted January 5, 2002 I'll still torture my Carver CDP with tweeks. Maybe I'll get it to sound like a Oracle, LOL! Where's the Forrest of flames? Don't be scared. varied opinions matter. THANX! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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