wsu99999 Posted August 19, 2008 Share Posted August 19, 2008 Does anyone have a set of Sonicaps laying around that they aren't using? I want to rebuild one of my AA Crossovers with Sonicaps and compair them to my other AA which is done with Clarity Caps. I would rather not buy them because I don't know if I will hear an improvement. If anyone has any laying around that would be willing to let me borrow them for a few weeks, I would appreciate it. If not, I guess I will just have to buy em. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kg4guy Posted August 19, 2008 Share Posted August 19, 2008 You can buy 2 of the 2 ufs and a 1 of the 13 uf for around $34. plus shipping direct from Sonic Craft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wsu99999 Posted August 19, 2008 Author Share Posted August 19, 2008 Basically, I don't want to buy them if I'm not going to use them. I just did a complete upgrade with ClarityCap PX's and wanted to do a side by side comparison to the sonicaps because I have never heard the differences. The main reason for this is because after doing the upgrade in one crossover, I can tell absolutely NO difference whatsoever between the one with new caps and the one with the old caps. This concerns me significantly considering how many people have stated night and day differences between upgrading the caps. I've spoken with BEC and he told me that literally every original AA cap he has tested has been bad, so I don't if it's that I had "wonder caps" built to stand the test of time OR if it's that ClarityCaps suck OR if it's that I did something wrong in the soldering - but the bottom line is that something is off. I want to stress - the way it is now sounds fine, but no better than before - therefore, I don't think I did anything wrong. Also keep in mind - I was completely satisfied with the sound before with the old caps - and I'm satisfied with the sound from the new caps - but they are exactly the same - I didn't get any noticable improvement subtle or otherwise from the upgrade. Is there any chance my caps were good in a 77 crossover? Are clarity that bad? Please advise Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted August 19, 2008 Share Posted August 19, 2008 "I can tell absolutely NO difference whatsoever between the one with new caps and the one with the old caps." The last guy around here that said that after buying some networks from me decided to go get his hearing tested -- and found out that he didn't have much left passed 6kHz. "Is there any chance my caps were good in a 77 crossover?" Doubtful. "Are clarity that bad?" Doubtful. Definitely check your build again -- carefully. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SET12 Posted August 19, 2008 Share Posted August 19, 2008 "I can tell absolutely NO difference whatsoever between the one with new caps and the one with the old caps." The last guy around here that said that after buying some networks from me decided to go get his hearing tested -- and found out that he didn't have much left passed 6kHz. "Is there any chance my caps were good in a 77 crossover?" Doubtful. "Are clarity that bad?" Doubtful. Definitely check your build again -- carefully. I'll second that! As I have heard every cap signature and inductor for that matter that I have inserted into my networks! I'd also be willing to point at the systems electronics ability to resolve the caps signatures as well. I hope its not your hearing buts its possible especially as one ages. SET12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kg4guy Posted August 19, 2008 Share Posted August 19, 2008 Sorry Arron I did not read your full post.I have 2 -1.5 Sonicaps with .47 Dayton film and foil bypass caps I can send you to try but no 13uf .[] I also have 2-kimber kaps 1.8 and 2 solen 2ufs forgot I had those. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wsu99999 Posted August 19, 2008 Author Share Posted August 19, 2008 Well, I double checked the build, everything is perfect as far as I can tell. I used caps in parallel and potentially that has something to do with it. As for the hearing, I'm only 27 and have never had any issues, but I suppose it's a possibility. I finished both crossovers a few min ago and I can honestly say that to me, the sound of the clarity caps made no significant change whatsoever, and in actuality, took away from some of the depth of the audio. If it's my hearing, then my Wife's is going too because she noticed a bit of a negitive difference, but she isn't into this as much as I and could be subjectivly hearing a difference from my opinion. The only think I can think of is the fact that I ran the caps in parallel, so instead of a 2uf, I used 2 1 uf's and instead of a 13, I used a 8.4 and a 4.6. Could that be it? Could the solder points not be clean enough? Do the caps have a burn in period? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark1101 Posted August 19, 2008 Share Posted August 19, 2008 The caps in parallel should be OK..........not your problem. Honestly, I would expect 1977 caps to be bad, and although Clarity caps are not the top of the line they are definitely a respectable part. I can't see how there would NOT be a noticeable improvement in tweeter output. I have no expanation..............if your opinion has been seconded by someone else (your wife)........your hearing is probably OK too at 27. Are you sure your tweeters are operating correctly? You can unplug the woofer and squawker to be sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeBaron Posted August 20, 2008 Share Posted August 20, 2008 Also, the rest of your equipment will make a big difference in the what you are not hearing. Try making the signal path as short as possible and keep the EQ flat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted August 20, 2008 Share Posted August 20, 2008 I don't know about that. Regardless of what he's running, it would seem to me if you change "bad" parts in the filter with "good" parts, you'll hear a difference (whether it's an improvement or not is another matter since it's subjective). I do agree however that if the downstream stuff isn't all that revealing, some of the smaller differences might be masked -- the bigger differences should definitely stand out though. A bad capacitor is like adding a good sized resistor on the tweeter -- that should be pretty easy to hear. wsu99999, Since your wife was underwhelmed with the change as well I think your hearing is probably fine. So, that leaves two possibilities: The first being that the original capacitors may not be in as bad a shape as most. Would you mind describing what they look like -- are they metal cans, or the small plastic types? The second possibility is that the PX Series measures with a higher ESR than some of the more expensive types, leaving you with a situation where there simply isn't much measurable difference between what you had and what you have. I went out and looked at the PX capacitors, and the 2.2uF value is less than $3 -- it was probably a good idea on your part to try some Sonicaps to see what happens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wsu99999 Posted August 20, 2008 Author Share Posted August 20, 2008 Dean, I googled the AA and found this pic. This looked exactly like my crossovers, but mine were much cleaner. http://www.acousticpsychos.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/normal_HPIM0176.JPG So in your opinion, I should just plunge and buy a few Sonicaps? If I just got 2 2uf's in one of the crossovers, I should hear the difference right? That would be the cheapst option and I don't want to upgrade all of em if I'm not going to see a change. This was the reason for my orignal post - to see if anyone had some extras for me to play with for a day or two (I don't know how good the caps are after they have been solderd, so this may not be an option) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted August 20, 2008 Share Posted August 20, 2008 Where did I get "wuzzzer", too funny. Yeah, those cans need to go, if they ain't bad yet they will be soon enough. If you are really strapped for cash, then finish what you started -- just do them both using the PX Series caps and forget it. At least you'll have those cans out of the networks before they start leaking oil. Caps are fine after they've soldered as long as the people handling them don't pull on the leads too hard or drop them on a hard floor. Back and forth movement of the leads should be kept to a minimum as well. Kg4guy offered to send you some stuff -- solder it in and see what happens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted August 20, 2008 Share Posted August 20, 2008 I just went through the thread again real quick and realized you haven't done anything with those 13uF cans yet. That might explain why you didn't hear a difference -- the tweeter section hangs off of that cap, that is -- everything going to the tweeter leg of the filter goes through that cap first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wsu99999 Posted August 20, 2008 Author Share Posted August 20, 2008 Dean, Both crossovers are completely refinished. All caps have been removed and replaced. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark1101 Posted August 20, 2008 Share Posted August 20, 2008 Why don't you send the old caps to Bob Crites for testing? He can give you an accurate report as to their condition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wsu99999 Posted August 22, 2008 Author Share Posted August 22, 2008 You know what's weird, I just changed the screw from magnetic to stainless steel and I now hear a significant difference. I don't know how much of a difference changing that screw makes, but I heard a clear difference before and after. Maybe it's due to the caps, maybe not, but I heard it. I guess I could put the old caps back in to see but I don't really want to go thru all of the trouble. I am sending my old caps to Bob for testing, so hopefully he can help shed some more light on this. Thanks for everyones input. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tigerwoodKhorns Posted August 22, 2008 Share Posted August 22, 2008 The metal screw has an effect on the inductor. Need to use brass, aluminum or stainless. So what do you think of the Clarity Caps now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wsu99999 Posted August 22, 2008 Author Share Posted August 22, 2008 Considering I didn't hear a change until I changed the screw, I don't know which affected the sound. Now I can hear a difference, but I don't know which caused it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tigerwoodKhorns Posted August 27, 2008 Share Posted August 27, 2008 Considering I didn't hear a change until I changed the screw, I don't know which affected the sound. Now I can hear a difference, but I don't know which caused it. Do you like the change? Whether it was the caps or the screw or a combo of both (most likely), yoru crossovers are now in factory spec due to the caps being the correct value and the inductor not having interference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wsu99999 Posted August 27, 2008 Author Share Posted August 27, 2008 I do like the change. I don't know if it was the screw, break in period of the caps, or both, but it does sound better now. It doesn't sound "AMAZING, LEAP's AND BOUNDS" better, but there is a noticable difference. Are there any other changes that would make the difference make me jump for joy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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