"The Epik Story" OR, "Is That Any Way To Run A Company?"

[doobie2]

I sent them an email last week and they replied promptly. They are expecting to revise the website in the next few weeks as well as introduce some new products.

They implied that the real issue right now for them is getting parts and they can only supply the Conquest right now.

[jacksonbart]

So it is an Epik story indeed!....

[askbob1]

I went on line and ordered a Tower from them. With in 3 weeks the sub arrived on a pallet in excellent shape. I was charged only after the sub was shipped and I was sent a tracking number. I have been using it ever since, replaced my RSW15. Its heavy, over built and sounds great, blends it seemlessly with the RF7s if set up correctly and simply does not have to work that hard to produce great bass. I would recommend them highly. I believe they have a single CNC machine so theu build each model in batches. Its a small operation for sure, but you really get a bang for your buck with thier products.

hey jb, how does the tower compare to the rsw-15?

[laager]

jb, how does the tower compare to the rsw-15?

Trick question, right?

[jacksonbart]

In my room the biggest difference is that the RSW has slightly more mid bass punch, its just more pronounced, while the tower goes lower. The tower has punch its just smoother though I am sure neither is producing a flat signal in my room. The Tower woofer excursion on similiar volumes and frequencies is much less and it does not get tubby at louder volumes, given my room, its nice upgrade. I was happy with the RSW 15, its just that I had a part fail and it took a while to get serviced so I tried Epik, glad I did.

[nola]

I bought a used RSW 15 over the summer. It is my bedroom sub and is great.

Just bought 2 Behringer B1800X subs (not newer Pro version). Still messing with then vs my 2 Madison Amp dual 18 cabs.

So my question is: how do higher end HT subs compare with Pro Audio (PA) subs (and yes I have separate sub amps)? I may not be able to move the RSW 15 back into the main room anytime soon?

Thanx

[harleyfatboy]

I bought a Conquest over the summer from Epik. Your best bet is to call them. Chad usually picks up or he will call you back. The guy wiill spend time with you over the phone and help you make the right subwoofer decision. They arent very good with emails or their web site because they are busy...Best part is the stuff is made in the USA except for the amps which are made in Canada.

[colterphoto1]

those holes are great for storing your remotes and army men

[jdm56]

I bought a Conquest over the summer from Epik. Your best bet is to call them. Chad usually picks up or he will call you back. The guy wiill spend time with you over the phone and help you make the right subwoofer decision. They arent very good with emails or their web site because they are busy...Best part is the stuff is made in the USA except for the amps which are made in Canada.

"Made in the USA." That has a nice ring of it!

[SWL]

So my question is: how do higher end HT subs compare with Pro Audio (PA) subs

I've wondered about this myself.......for a two-channel home system. You should start a new thread on this.

[DrWho]

those holes are great for storing your remotes and army men

You've got army men? []

[jamesV]

I sent them an email last week and they replied promptly. They are expecting to revise the website in the next few weeks as well as introduce some new products.

They implied that the real issue right now for them is getting parts and they can only supply the Conquest right now.

I also got the same email. Stating that they are only running the Conquest sub and don't know when the others will be put into production again. They are not even taking Pre-Orders for the other subs, who knows when they will start production again.

I would like to see what new items that will have. Maybe some replacements from the current line up...

James

[davisindy]

I really hate to hear this as my 12 year old sub just died and I really wanted a Epik Caliber.

Looks like I may have to go to AV123 MFW-15 as an option. I like the wood options on the MFW-15 better than just black for the lower level Epik.

But the Built in the USA with North American parts was a huge plus for this proud American.

[jamesV]

Davis,

Have you taken a look at Elemental Designs? People have talked about their products and they love them.

I know what you mean about Epik, I was looking to purchase a sub from them also.. [:'(]

James

[nola]

This is the link to craigsubs rankings of about 1 yr ago. There is also someone from the UK who did similar testing at about the same time; but I forgot the link/source. Both appear free of any commercial bias. Again, these were not tested in Your room, nor with Your room nodes, etc.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=768150

*****Skip 1st message ------ *****Go to message 8 !!!!******

It is copied below:

The scoring summary ...

---

Here is the scoring summary with the Home Theater score and Music score, respectively shown as (HT-M).



Prices and whether the items are available Internet Direct or from a
store are now included. Keep in mind that ID pricing will usually be
firm, or slightly discounted, where some BM products will see
substantial discounts. BM = Brick and Mortar. ID = Internet Direct.
ID/SI = shipping included.



Elemental Designs A7-900 ($2200 ID/SI): 116 points (63-53)

Epik Conquest ($1599 ID): 112 points (60-52)

SVS PB13-Ultra ($1499 ID): 109 points (57-52)

Epik Castle ($999 ID): 109 points (59-50)

AV123 MFW-15 Duals: 109 points (56-53) (note, duals were tested as duals are offered as a package)

Creative Sounds Dual SDX-15 driver + Behringer EP-2500 Amp + Behringer DEQ2496 ($1630 ID): 105 points (57-48)

JL Audio Fathom 113 ($3500 BM): 103 points (53-50)

AV123 MFW-15 ($599 ID): 103 points (53-50)

Def Tech Trinity ($3000 BM): 102 points (54-48)

Velodyne DD-18 ($5000 BM): 100 points (50-50)

ACI Maestro ($2400 ID): 97 points (47-50)

eD A5-350 ($715 ID/SI): 96 points (50-46)

JL Audio Fathom 112 ($2600 BM): 95 points (45-50)

Hsu VTF-3 HO + Turbo ($999 ID): 94 points (47-47)

Hsu VTF-3 HO w/o Turbo ($899 ID): 92 points (45-47)

Hsu VTF-3 Mark III + Turbo ($799 ID): 92 points (45-47)

VMPS VSS ($1650 BM and ID): 92 points (45-47)

Epik Valor ($549 ID): 91 points (44-47)

Hsu VTF-3 Mark III w/o Turbo ($699 ID): 91 points (45-46)

SVS PB12-Ultra: 90 points (47-43)

Axiom EP-500 ($1230 ID/SI): 90 points (43-47)

Hsu VTF-2 Mark III + Turbo ($599 ID): 88 points (42-46)

SVS PB12-Plus/2 ($1299 ID): 87 points (47-40)

SVS PB12-NSD ($599 ID): 86 points (43-43)

Hsu VTF-2 Mark III w/o Turbo ($499 ID): 86 points (40-46)

Rocket UFW-12 ($999 ID): 85 points (provisional) (35-50)

Elemental Designs A2-300 ($350 ID/SI): 83 points (44-39)

SVS PB10-NSD ($429 ID): 83 points (43-40)

Dana Audio 600 ($869 ID): 83 points (36-47)

Rocket X-Sub ($199 ID): 78 points (34-44)

BIC H-100 ($229 eBay): 78 points (40-38)

Rocket Tyke: 60 points (If you care, PM me ... )



Pending subwoofers ...



VMPS VSS Powered sub - Early March, 2008

AV123 BMF ... Not sure of date

Epik Knight ... Not sure of Date



*: The Hsu MBM-12 has been tried with several subwoofers here. We found
it to be a good room solution, for times when the best placement with a
subwoofer for the deep stuff did not necessarily give the best
performance in the 50-80 Hz area. We could not come up with a
consistent way of scoring it with the other subs, including the VTF-3
HO. Instead, it is suggested to be look at as a possible enchancement
to any subwoofer package.



Listening procedures:



All listening us done under blind conditions. The panel of listeners
include several very experienced audiophiles, some of whom also design
and build high end pro audio speakers. The subwoofers were each placed
in the identical room position, and eq'ed to have a fairly flat (3 dB
window) response curve from 18 Hz and up, when the subwoofer was able
to go that "low".



Measuring procedures: All measurements are taken at 2 meters/GP from
the front baffle of a subwoofer. In the case of a ported sub, the
microphone is placed so it is 2 meters from the center of the driver(s)
and port. The posted measured results are max "clean" 20 Hz output and
the average from 20 to 63 Hz. If it seemed like the amp was the
limiting factor in output, "AL" is added to the 20 Hz SPL.



The purpose of this information is to help people to quickly look at a
variety of subwoofers and get a pair of scores, some performance
numbers, and some listening tests describing the characteristics of
each subwoofer. Hopefully, this will provide some assistance when
researching for a subwoofer purchase. There will be times that a lower
rated sub will work better for someone than a higher rated sub. For
example, size, or output, in a lower rated sub may make a difference.
Listening preferences may also make a difference. If slam is valued
over extension, some subs excel at the 30-60 Hz slam. For others,
extension will be the most important issue.



1. Elemental Designs A7-900.



Listening results: This subwoofer has almost no weaknesses. It presents
everything from the deepest pipe organ and movie bass spectaculars to a
hard driving bass guitar with an effortless quality that is the best we
have heard to date. On the WOTW machines emerge scene, there was
nothing but waves of bass that one felt rolling through the room. The
standard Steely Dan 2AN disc was tight, tuneful, and the 18 Hz bass
present in this disc was easily felt, yet the upper bass regions were
agile.



Measured results ... 20 Hz: 113.5 dB AL ... 20-63 Hz average: 118 dB AL



2. Epik Conquest



Listening results: This subwoofer is hard to distinguish from the
A7-900. Once again, pipe organ, the WOTW scene, bass guitar - were all
played effortlessly. It is not quite at powerful, nor as visceral, as
the bigger eD sub, but it is also an easier sub to live with for some
rooms, because it is not quite as large as is the eD.



Measured results ... 20 Hz: 111.5 dB AL ... 20-63 Hz average: 116.5 dB AL.



3a. SVS PB13-Ultra



Listening results: This subwoofer delivers incredible performance from
a moderate sized box. It is almost on par with the larger Conquest and
eD subs in terms of delivering palpable bass, and it is as articulate
as the standard bearer Fathom 113. A great choice when one is looking
for a combination of reasonable WAF and performance.



Measured results ... 20 Hz: 108 dB ... 20-63 Hz average: 113.5 dB



3b. Epik Castle



Listening results: Another subwoofer of reasonable size which also
gives a terrific performance. It loses some in articulation to the SVS,
but also has a bit more authority on powerful movie scenes. It is a
solid choice when one wants a large slice of the Conquest/A7-900
performance in a package that is easier to live with.



Measured results ... 20 Hz: 108.5 dB ... 20-63 Hz average: 115.5 dB



3c. AV123 MFW-15



Listening results: Pairing two MFW-15's does exactly what one would
expect, it adds a signifigant amount of slam to the areas in which the
single unit excelled. What a pair of MFW-15's does above 20 Hz is what
makes it the 3rd alternative in the $1500 and under category for
excellent performance for the $$$. On music, it is tight, clean and
tuneful. It is the other sub combo the brought the Steely Dan 2AN disc
to life. On movies, one will experience room shaking bass that is
visceral, with the best slam of any subwoofer in its class. It is
overshadowed below 20 Hz by the Castle and Ultra, and it will be up to
the listener to decide which of the 3 "109 pointers" works best in his
system.







4. Creative Sounds DIY Dual SDX-15



Listening results: After carefully adjusting for a proper shelving
curve (kudos to Mark Seaton for the tutorial on the 2496), this
subwoofer gave a credible performance. The only real downside is that
the new Castle from Epik is a superior performer in a smaller package
for less money and no labor required.



Measured results ... 20 Hz: 104 dB ... 20-63 Hz average: 115 dB



5a. JL Audio Fathom 113



Listening results: The built in ARO system makes calibration into one's
system a snap. The Fathom allows the well heeled audiophile to get an
unmatched combination of powerful bass and extension with bass quality
that matches the finest monitor speakers, all in a package that will
fit in a room of high quality furniture. The panel of listeners was
shocked that something so compact could deliver such visceral bass.
This is the first subwoofer that delivers on the promise of small size
with true subwoofer performance.



Measured results ... 20 Hz: 102 dB ... 20-63 Hz average: 112.5 dB



5b. AV-123 MFW-15.



Listening results: The MFW-15 amazed the panel by largely matching the
PB13 Ultra in all musical areas with the exception of pipe organ. Bass
is deep, tight and powerful, with no overhang at all. The cabinet work
done on this subwoofer is absolultely stellar, especially in its price
range. By stellar, we mean just how inert it is. The cabinet barely
vibrates during the most powerful passages, and this helps the MFW-15
to get its excellent musical rating. It is, as an earlier graph shows,
very linear in its response curve, all the way to 100 Hz. It is in the
area of slam an linearity that allows this subwoofer to match more high
priced units. The Steely Dan disc on this subwoofer is a bass head's
dream, with a lot of the panel requesting to hear it again after the
test. Stanley Clarke was also as crystal clear on the MFW-15 as with
any subwoofer we have had.



Measured results... 20 Hz - 105 dB ... 20-63 Hz average: 112 dB



6. Definitive Technology Trinity



Listening results: The Trinity surprised a few listeners by being much
musical than a dual active 14 and quad passive 14 inch drivered sub
"should". Its music/movie weakness was above 60 Hz, and this sub is a
total performer when used with a 50-60 Hz crossover. For home theater,
no sub here delivered a better performance on the machines emerge scene
from WOTW, while Steely Dan's 2AN was almost as good as the Elemental
Design's delivery.



Measured results ... 20 Hz: 109 dB ... 20-63 Hz average: 115.5 dB



7. Velodyne DD-18.



Listening results: The big Velodyne was our original standard bearer
here. It is a beast above 25 Hz, and is the ultimate in "plug and
play", in regards to its auto eq. The DD-18 is still worthy of
consideration, but it is eclipsed by many newer offerings.



Measured results ... 20 Hz: 95 dB ... 20-63 Hz average: 109 dB



8. ACI Maestro (2nd edition).



Listening results: The ACI shares a lot with the DD-18. At the time we
teste it, it was a spectacular performer. It delivers a solid 25 Hz
floor, with a roll off below that. It does not handle the WOTW scene as
well as a $2400 subwoofer should, but on music it is stellar.



Measured results ... 20 Hz: 95 dB ... 20-63 Hz average: 108 dB (note,
these #'s are a lot lower than the original Maestro. At the time of the
original Maestro, I measure @ 1 meter from center of enclosure, or
about 18 inches from driver, and achieved 107 dB).



9. Elemental Designs A5-350



Listening results: The eD surprised a lot of the panel with its ability
to retain excellent music scores. It is another sub that loves the 2AN
disc, and most were impressed when they find out it was a $715
subwoofer. It also handles the WOTW scene with a lot of power and floor
shaking ability. It does not quite match the more expensive subs in
articulation, but for $715, it is a bargain.



Measured results ... 20 Hz: 105 dB ... 20-63 Hz average: 111 dB.



10. JL Audio F-112



Listening results: From 25 Hz and up, it is impossible to tell the
difference between it and the Fathom 113. It is an outstanding compact
subwoofer. The general concensus, though, was if one was going to buy a
112, spend the extra $$$ and get a 113.



Measured results ... Not measured. Sorry, somehow this slipped past us.



11. Hsu VTF-3HO (With and Without Turbo)



Listening results: For a subwoofer package of $900 to $1000, the Hsu
VTF-3 HO was, at the time of its release, the standard bearer in its
price range. It is exceptional on music, and delivers slam on HT which
will impress anyone used to what is normally purchased for more money
at a store. The Turbo adds extra heft below the 20 Hz standard for a
true subwoofer, and the Hsu is a solid choice even today for someone
looking for a relatively compact subwoofer.



Measured results : 20 Hz... 101-102 dB (depending on configuration) ... 20-63 Hz Average ... 108 dB



12. Hsu VTF-3.3 (With and without Turbo)



Listening results: The VTF-3.3 is very close overall to the VTF-3 HO.
It is exceptional for its price, in terms of its output and visceral
feel. For music, it is unmatched in its price range - or was, until the
Epik Valor came along. This is a subwoofer that goes beyond its
measured numbers, and for its often quoted sale price of $629, an
exceptional value.



Measured results: 20 Hz: 100-101 dB (depending on configuration) ... 20-63 Hz average ... 107 dB



13. VMPS VSS



Listening results: The VMPS is a very capable subwoofer, with excellent
power to 30 Hz, and adequate power below 30 Hz. It is a good choice for
someone who places a premium on music performance, especially classical
music. Bass is subjectively deep and tight on discs like Two Against
Nature. It does lack in visceral response to many other subwoofers,
including several less costly competitors.



Measured results: TBD



14. Epic Valor



Listening results: The Valor is a subwoofer which will be the answer to
many budget audiophile's dreams. It is an exceptional musical performer
from about 18 Hz and up, with a very agile presentation of bass at all
times. In our smaller basement theater, using a pretty good high end
set up, it amazed listeners in its presentation of the Steely Dan 2AN
disc, and also with its slam for HT. It is not an SPL monster like the
Castle, but in the right room, it is magic.



Measured Results: 20 Hz... 99 dB ... 20-63 Hz average: 109 dB



15. SVS PB-12 Ultra



Listening results: A terrific subwoofer considering its 2002 design. It
remained competitive in the $1200 - $1500 arena until 2007, when it was
replaced by the PB13-Ultra. The "old" Ultra was at one time a standard
bearer for performance, and remains a solid mid pack subwoofer today.



Measured results: 20 Hz ... 102 dB ... 20-63 Hz average: 109 dB



16. Axiom EP-500



Listening results: The EP-500 was one of the first subwoofers to stress
linearity across its frequency band. What is somewhat ironic is it
sounds more like the baby brother to the new PB-13 Ultra than do
smaller SVS models. It is capable of surprising amounts of bass slam,
and is excetionally articulate for music. Its down side is that is
current price is rather expensive for the performance. Its up side is
it is quite compact, and an excellent choice when space is a
consideration.



Measured results: 20 Hz ... 97 dB ... 20-63 Hz average ... 107 dB

__________________

Owner of Tweak City Audio, where you can say the "F" word on our forum.



Disclosure: I am a customer of AV123 and a friend of Mark Schifter.



link to subwoofer summary

---

Last edited by craigsub; 04-08-08 at 09:26 AM..


Reason: changed ID to BM in the second paragraph.

[davisindy]

I didnt give eD as good a look as all the others.

I decided upon and ordered a SVS PC12-NSD, its supposed to be here Friday. For the total cost including shipping and the 16" diameter footprint it seemed to be the most "boom for the buck" so to speak for me.

After I set my AVR to no sub and let the Forte II do all the work I almost decided to put the sub purchase off, but for HT I wanted that down to 18HZ or so effect. I have never had a real sub so to speak just a old cheapie so I am looking forward to it.

[jamesV]

Great to hear about the new sub purchase. [Y] You have to report back after you break it in and see how you like it.

I hope to purchase a new sub this year. Maybe if I stop getting other equipment instead... []

James

[jdm56]

I sent them an email last week and they replied promptly. They are expecting to revise the website in the next few weeks as well as introduce some new products.

Check'em out now! New look on the website; Almost all new product lineup; Products actually appear to be available for sale! On the downside, prices have gone up and the models I looked at had amps that do not have speaker-level inputs and outputs.[]

[White_Hawk]

Sounds like they aren't going to continue making the conquest forever either... I NEED A SIGNING BONUS!!!

[doobie2]

Thanks for the heads up..more surfin' to do now[]