Brian F Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 I just picked up a pair of used klf-20's and the black front and black back panels are loose. I noticed it during heavier bass notes as they rattle. Any suggestions? Reglue possibly and with what adhesive? Is this normal with time/useage? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
runninshine Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 Welcome to the forum. Look in the Updates and Mods thread........you might find some luck there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pzannucci Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 If you don't want to try to rip the remaining glue off the panel, you can thin something like "Tightbond II" from Home Depot and while laying the speaker on the front (back later), pour the glue into the slots around the panels. Let it dry and fill in, repeat intil fully sealed. It takes a little time and you might have to use something thin to help it ease into the joints but it may be better than trying to break the rest of the panels away from the surrounding box. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garyeanderson Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 I searched for klf AND glue http://forums.klipsch.com/search/SearchResults.aspx?q=klf+AND+glue&o=Relevance There are a lot of posts but I remembered someone had done a repair with PL Premium, So I did another search for klf AND pl Only 3 pages of topics but this is the one that I remembered. http://forums.klipsch.com/forums/p/130214/1317116.aspx#1317116 Hope this helps some. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moray james Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 Brian: Peter's idea makes good sense. If you could incorporate some 3/4" soft wood strapping and then with a nail gun and glue install it so you make a fresh joint between the inside of the baffle and the walls you should be able to get things tightened up just fine. Just use enough nails to hold the strappin in place till the glue sets. Once all the glue is set up you could also install some screw on the front baffle into the strapping (pre tap the holes) and you should be good to go. Good luck with the project. Best regards Moray James. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
modoc48 Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 Hi Brian, yes that is common for the Legends. I used liquid nail on mine, worked like a charm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pzannucci Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 Brian: Peter's idea makes good sense. If you could incorporate some 3/4" soft wood strapping and then with a nail gun and glue install it so you make a fresh joint between the inside of the baffle and the walls you should be able to get things tightened up just fine. Just use enough nails to hold the strappin in place till the glue sets. Once all the glue is set up you could also install some screw on the front baffle into the strapping (pre tap the holes) and you should be good to go. Good luck with the project. Best regards Moray James. You can do a non-invasive fix with the thinned glue if the panels are just loose. You really don't need to nail anything. There is typically a slot around the front and back panels. They are mostly held to the blocks inside the box not the sides of the box. Pour the glue repeatedly in the slot using a small thin instrument the first couple of times to make sure you get it deep in the slot. Fill the slot and let it dry. If the panels are falling off, then for sure use something like liquid nails or PL 200 (or urethane based) construction adhesive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louis Bartay Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 I helped a friend remove the front motor board and rear boards. We used a very stiff/thick putty knife and slowly and with a LOT of work we pried the cabinets apart. We did remove all of the speakers etc first. We used Liquid Nails Glue but I am sure other brands will work. We also added a few of the 1x2 braces that the motor boards rest and glue against. We did not use nails or screws to help with the glue. We did each side and used some padded weights so the boards stayed down flat against the braces we reglued. Next day, flipped them over and reglued the back side boards. The hardest part was seperating the front and rear boards with out damaging them. They sound like new again. Klipsch replaced the his first pair that started to come loose. A Klipsch Manager came to his house with a New pair and said the this Q.C. problem had been addressed back when they were new. Great Customer Service... His new front KLF20 have never come loose. He purchased these second two from a member here and got a smokin deal on them as he lived near us. His 5.2 system sounds Much better with 4 KLF20's now and he sold me his 1989 Heresy's he had on stands for his rear speakers.. we are Both Very Happy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
russ69 Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 I used some Elmers yellow glue on some cabinet repairs and that stuff is stout. My wife dropped a spot on the kitchen tile and it chipped the tile when I tried to scrape it off, wow I was impressed. Thanx, Russ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkyDover Posted January 28, 2011 Share Posted January 28, 2011 Unfortunately I've discovered my KLF-20's have a couple of places on each cabinet that the glue is giving away. Looking inside the cabinet, it's glued to a black laminated surface, and is only where the glue is separating. Not really something I wanted to take on to fix but looks like I'm going to have to invest some time with re-gluing the seems before the glue starts giving away in the other areas. If I scrape gently where the glue is on the black laminated surface, it comes off too easy. I'm afraid if the speakers get a good thump, it might fall apart now!! I was told that Klipsch got a bad batch of glue run from the manufacturer who makes the glue and that is why the glue isn't holding up, some other speaker manufacturers got some of the bad batch as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moray james Posted January 28, 2011 Share Posted January 28, 2011 When you are ready to get dowwn to the repair business I would suggest a hard rubber mallet and make sure the whole existing glue line is broken open all around. That way when you re glue the whole thing is good and there will be no sections waiting to let loose later. Just my 2 cents. Best regards Moray James. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkyDover Posted January 29, 2011 Share Posted January 29, 2011 I was hoping to take the easier way out, but it makes a lot of sense what you are saying. I should do it right the first time so I don't have any problems later! Thanks for the tip! I'll follow your advice. [Y] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pzannucci Posted January 30, 2011 Share Posted January 30, 2011 Sometimes taking the easy way out makes sense. If the glue hasn't pulled away from the boards, the glue failure most likely was due to "lack of". Filling the voids will likely do what the glue should have in the first place and last for ever. Now if they are seriously loose, yanking them makes sense since that will be just as easy as putting glue down the slots. If they just barely rattel, you may have fun pulling them apart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkyDover Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 I know I won't have fun pulling them apart! I really don't want to, I just finished a new speaker build and really didn't want to take on another project! [:S] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adam2434 Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 Hi, been I while since I visited the forum. A friend a of my brother-in-law gave me a pair of KLF-20 yesterday. He just wanted them out of his garage and I helped him with some audio consulting in exchange. I also own a pair of Forte 1 and RF-7 III. I have not had a chance to test the KLF-20 yet, so I don’t know if the drivers all work properly. I also don’t yet know if the front and back baffles are loose from the known gluing issue on the KLF series (which I have been reading about). If the front and back baffles are loose, I’ve been thinking of ways to secure them without removing and regluing them. Aesthetics aside, could the following work? I am not worried about the aesthetics of the below because the front would be covered by the grill and the back is, well, the back. Run screws (pre-drill holes) around the perimeter of the front and back baffles (blue circles in pic), spaced maybe every 6-8 inches. Isn’t there a wood lip that the baffles sit on, maybe around 3/8 inch wide that I could screw into all around the perimeter of the baffle? To ensure air-tightness, run a small/neat bead of black RTV sealant in the joint/gap (green line in pic)? Would the above work to fasten and seal the baffles? These speakers are medium oak and have some scratches in the veneer, so they are not going to be used in a living room anyway. They would be man cave or garage speakers where their appearance doesn’t really matter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adam2434 Posted March 17, 2022 Share Posted March 17, 2022 I tested the KLF-20's today and all the drivers work. I also don't hear any baffle rattling when I push the volume. I found the thread below, and the insides of the baffles are black. Looking through the ports on mine, the inside surface of the front baffle is not black. It is a tan color, maybe raw MDF, but I can't be certain. This makes me wonder if some KLF-20 baffles do not have the melamine coating that is reported to be the cause of the glue adhesion issue that causes the baffles to rattle. Could it be that some versions of the KLF-20 don't and won't have the baffle rattle issue because the baffle inside surfaces are not covered with melamine? Am I barking up the wrong tree here? https://community.klipsch.com/index.php?/topic/132208-klf-20-cabinets-exposed/ Also, mine have inspected and tested signature labels with English names on the backs, so I assume they were made in the US, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
001 Posted March 18, 2022 Share Posted March 18, 2022 On 3/16/2022 at 11:52 AM, adam2434 said: Hi, been I while since I visited the forum. A friend a of my brother-in-law gave me a pair of KLF-20 yesterday. He just wanted them out of his garage and I helped him with some audio consulting in exchange. I also own a pair of Forte 1 and RF-7 III. I have not had a chance to test the KLF-20 yet, so I don’t know if the drivers all work properly. I also don’t yet know if the front and back baffles are loose from the known gluing issue on the KLF series (which I have been reading about). If the front and back baffles are loose, I’ve been thinking of ways to secure them without removing and regluing them. Aesthetics aside, could the following work? I am not worried about the aesthetics of the below because the front would be covered by the grill and the back is, well, the back. Run screws (pre-drill holes) around the perimeter of the front and back baffles (blue circles in pic), spaced maybe every 6-8 inches. Isn’t there a wood lip that the baffles sit on, maybe around 3/8 inch wide that I could screw into all around the perimeter of the baffle? To ensure air-tightness, run a small/neat bead of black RTV sealant in the joint/gap (green line in pic)? Would the above work to fasten and seal the baffles? These speakers are medium oak and have some scratches in the veneer, so they are not going to be used in a living room anyway. They would be man cave or garage speakers where their appearance doesn’t really matter. i would not use screws to fix the loose boards if thats an issue, yes the grilles will hide them but screws will hurt their value if/when you want to sell them. the best way to repair loose baffles is by removing them & re glue them. or the other option is to use a good glue that will hold the panels without removing them, i have done this a few times on loose klipsch KG speakers & subs as well as other brands... i use gorilla glue with excellent results, it is incredibly strong & will bond the panels together as good or better than the factory, works great on melamine too but there is a glue specifically made for melamine. thats great the boards seem to be in good shape on your speakers, try some bass heavy music up loud, its not upper freq at high volume that will show the problem, its lower bass at high volumes that will expose the vibration of loose cabinets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adam2434 Posted March 18, 2022 Share Posted March 18, 2022 2 hours ago, EpicKlipschFan said: i would not use screws to fix the loose boards if thats an issue, ys the grilles will hide them but screws will hurt their value if/when you want to sell them. the best way to repair loose baffles is by removing them & re glue them. or the other option is to use a good glue that will hold the panels without removing them, i have done this a few times on loose klipsch KG speakers & subs as well as other brands... i use gorilla glue with excellent results, it is incredibly strong & will bond the panels together as good or better than the factory, works great on melamine too but there is a glue specifically made for melamine. thats great the boards seem to be in good shape on your speakers, try some bass heavy music up loud, its not upper freq at high volume that will show the problem, its lower bass at high volumes that will expose the vibration of loose cabinets. Thanks for the input. Regarding gluing the panels with removing them, do you mean getting some glue into the seam/joint that I marked in green in the photo a couple posts back? I did test pretty loud with some bass heavy music and could not hear any vibration. I will do more testing. However, is it known whether the melamine was used in all the KLF production runs? The reason I ask is because I found the first KLF-20 photo below on this forum, and it shows that the interior surfaces of the front and back baffles are black. Black melamine, I presume? The second photo is taken through the port on my KLF-20. The interior surface of the front baffle is a tan color. Maybe raw MDF? So, I'm wondering if some versions of the KLF's won't develop the loose baffle issues because they don't have the melamine. Or, do mine have a tan colored melamine maybe? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
001 Posted March 18, 2022 Share Posted March 18, 2022 YW. no glue on the outside seams, its done from the inside so is not visible, you want to preserve the outside of these cabinets the best you can, the wood finish is a big part of the value. the glue klipsch used was defective for a while & would harden & loose its grip. scrape as much old glue as you can & scuff up about 1" on both sides of the seams on the loose board(s). then follow directions on the back of the gorilla glue bottle which has you lightly moisten the area with water then apply a 1/4" bead of glue, it will expand & force its way into any voids or loose areas then dries almost as hard as a rock. just need to be sure you get rid of as much of the old glue & have a nice clean surface. other construction adhesives will work too. if you remove the panels a good wood glue or other stronger adhesive is all thats needed. i dont think melamine was used in the KLF but i could be wrong on that, i know its not used in the KG or other models that were made in the same era as KLF. i have seen some black over spray inside ported cabinets, not sure if this was done on purpose so you dont see bare wood inside. maybe some other members that own KLFs can confirm if they used melamine. yes your pic is showing raw wood & the yellow original hot glue they used. if yours dont vibrate or you can't see slight movement when pushing from the inside then they are probably good. but again, leave the outsides of the cabinets alone, no screws or glue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adam2434 Posted March 18, 2022 Share Posted March 18, 2022 I found a few threads that talk about melamine on the KLF's being the cause of the loose baffle issue. Here is one of them: https://community.klipsch.com/index.php?/topic/144757-issues-with-klf-20/ The first pic in the earlier post today shows that both the front and back baffles have a black interior surface in that speaker. I'm thinking that the black coating in that pic is the black melamine mentioned in the thread I linked above. If this is true, mine simply don't have the black melamine, so should not have the loose baffle issue...at least that's what I'm hoping. 🙂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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