Schu Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 (edited) I can pick up these SVS PB2000 for $1,000pr... a few months old and owner says warranty is still good. is this a fair deal, good deal or wait for a horn loaded sub? I would be giving up my SW-115 and replacing a single 15 with dual 12's... I am looking for MUSICALITY over HT, but at least 20hz would be cool! Edited September 26, 2014 by Schu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 600 off plus warranty is pretty good. In addition, you can get a little more even coverage with 2 subs. You're going from ported to ported so the sound will be fairly similar. That being said, I've always liked SVS products and have owned 2 in the past. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 You'll also have more displacement with the two 12's (if x-max is similar). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coleman Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 October 10th SVS is announcing a new product they've been working on for two years. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beeker Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 In my opinion good gear yet tough choice If this is to run with your cornwalls imo sw-115 all the way. Especially for music. Direct radiating in particular I find it a tough mix to toss direct 12's in with mains that have direct 15's...stick with the sw115.. then again.... on the other hand those pb2000's look nice. I looked at reviews and all were for theater nothing for music. I have noticed your looking for new subs so possibly give them a shot. Carl has valid points and they will likely do very well. Since you are looking for new subs those svs look like the ones at a good deal. get a good demo first and double check that warranty..mention the new svs coming out in October and offer $900cash reference heads running 2 svs or 1 and another 12, maybe 2, 13" svs& another 12. I forget with his cornwall sounding(he mentioned they sounded like cornwalls) 904's and likes it so your cw's may sound rather well with these svs pb2000's iv never heard either the sb or pb 2000....they may be real good Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heritage_Head Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 If you want a better sounding sub for music. Go with the plus or the ultra (if your buying svs). 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heritage_Head Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 In my opinion good gear yet tough choice If this is to run with your cornwalls imo sw-115 all the way. Especially for music. Direct radiating in particular I find it a tough mix to toss direct 12's in with mains that have direct 15's...stick with the sw115.. then again.... on the other hand those pb2000's look nice. I looked at reviews and all were for theater nothing for music. I have noticed your looking for new subs so possibly give them a shot. Carl has valid points and they will likely do very well. Since you are looking for new subs those svs look like the ones at a good deal. get a good demo first and double check that warranty..mention the new svs coming out in October and offer $900cash reference heads running 2 svs or 1 and another 12, maybe 2, 13" svs& another 12. I forget with his cornwall sounding(he mentioned they sounded like cornwalls) 904's and likes it so your cw's may sound rather well with these svs pb2000's iv never heard either the sb or pb 2000....they may be real good What do you like better for music from the sw15? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willland Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 I have not heard the SW-115 nor the PB2000 so my "opinion" is more speculation. If you are sticking to ported subs and you currently like your SW-115, why not just get another one? On the other hand, SVS subs are wonderful and a pair of SB-2000's would offer a more musical presentation over twin PB2000's. I am not discounting the PB2000 because that pair for $1000.00 is a good deal for well regarded subs. I am blown away by my SVS SB13 Plus(95% same as SB13 Ultra), and would have no problem suggesting a single SB13 Ultra if that is all that in the budget. On the other hand, a single PB12 Plus or a PB13 Ultra are very versatile subs(more $$$ though) with the ability to run them in different tuning modes, including sealed. Bill 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beeker Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 In my opinion good gear yet tough choice If this is to run with your cornwalls imo sw-115 all the way. Especially for music. Direct radiating in particular I find it a tough mix to toss direct 12's in with mains that have direct 15's...stick with the sw115.. then again.... on the other hand those pb2000's look nice. I looked at reviews and all were for theater nothing for music. I have noticed your looking for new subs so possibly give them a shot. Carl has valid points and they will likely do very well. Since you are looking for new subs those svs look like the ones at a good deal. get a good demo first and double check that warranty..mention the new svs coming out in October and offer $900cash reference heads running 2 svs or 1 and another 12, maybe 2, 13" svs& another 12. I forget with his cornwall sounding(he mentioned they sounded like cornwalls) 904's and likes it so your cw's may sound rather well with these svs pb2000's iv never heard either the sb or pb 2000....they may be real good What do you like better for music from the sw15? he mentioned he was looking for "MUSICALITY over HT" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heritage_Head Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 In my opinion good gear yet tough choice If this is to run with your cornwalls imo sw-115 all the way. Especially for music. Direct radiating in particular I find it a tough mix to toss direct 12's in with mains that have direct 15's...stick with the sw115.. then again.... on the other hand those pb2000's look nice. I looked at reviews and all were for theater nothing for music. I have noticed your looking for new subs so possibly give them a shot. Carl has valid points and they will likely do very well. Since you are looking for new subs those svs look like the ones at a good deal. get a good demo first and double check that warranty..mention the new svs coming out in October and offer $900cash reference heads running 2 svs or 1 and another 12, maybe 2, 13" svs& another 12. I forget with his cornwall sounding(he mentioned they sounded like cornwalls) 904's and likes it so your cw's may sound rather well with these svs pb2000's iv never heard either the sb or pb 2000....they may be real good What do you like better for music from the sw15? he mentioned he was looking for "MUSICALITY over HT" Right, Why do you think the sw15 would be better for music? They are both the same design. I have no idea so im just wondering what your basing it off 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beeker Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 If I am building a theater or a pa as well as home theater or a home music system I would not use a subwoofer that is less than the size of my low frequency driver. There are tonal reasons why a smaller subwoofer will fall short of providing proper bass when exchanging harmony with a low frequency driver in a 2 or 3 way etc...cabinet/speaker. If you were to mix in some good or even descent 18's with your 904's you would be hooked I have to use the simple example when was the last time a band used say a 12" subwoofer with there 2 way 15" speaker cabinet...not going to find one. So why would I ever suggest somebody use one at home... It may work for you in your uses although under no circumstance would I mix any 15" woofer in a 2 or 3 way cab/speaker with a subwoofer of lesser size... I have owned speakers with 6 to 8+ inch drivers that will reach below 30hz...using a 12 or even a 10 as subwoofer duty reaches better harmony easier than if I use 5" subwoofers or multiple with the 6 to 8+ inch 2/3 way speaker...they just don't do the job... If I were Schu I would be looking for a 15" sub at least...or better yet try an 18. Once you do this you will not dump them and go back to a 12 or 13...at least a 15 in most instances will match a low frequency 15, direct radiating so, so much better I promise you... I have a stack of powered 12" subwoofers in my second room and would never try to mix them with any 15" 3 way cabinet, direct radiating...its just not smooth...the mix is not consistant or you would see 12" subs in pa systems or large theaters with 15" low frequency drivers Get some 18's and you will understand why...its that simple To have a direct radiating 12 or 13 digging deep with a direct radiating 15" 3 way or 2 way speaker is simply counter intuitive. Now im not going to explain anything lol its a simple acknowledgment you will reach if or when you get larger subwoofers. There is a reason you see people get 18's or even 15's and never buy another 12" sub... I learned when I was very young with car subwoofers, no matter what quality 12's I had the good 15's always did better. Its an easy companionship that does and will always make sense. With direct radiating drivers get a sub that is larger rather than waste money and time wondering about the big subs... This is in no way examples of horn subs and low frequency 15's in that such as the khorn or lascala etc... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heritage_Head Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 (edited) If I am building a theater or a pa as well as home theater or a home music system I would not use a subwoofer that is less than the size of my low frequency driver. There are tonal reasons why a smaller subwoofer will fall short of providing proper bass when exchanging harmony with a low frequency driver in a 2 or 3 way etc...cabinet/speaker. If you were to mix in some good or even descent 18's with your 904's you would be hooked I have to use the simple example when was the last time a band used say a 12" subwoofer with there 2 way 15" speaker cabinet...not going to find one. So why would I ever suggest somebody use one at home... It may work for you in your uses although under no circumstance would I mix any 15" woofer in a 2 or 3 way cab/speaker with a subwoofer of lesser size... I have owned speakers with 6 to 8+ inch drivers that will reach below 30hz...using a 12 or even a 10 as subwoofer duty reaches better harmony easier than if I use 5" subwoofers or multiple with the 6 to 8+ inch 2/3 way speaker...they just don't do the job... If I were Schu I would be looking for a 15" sub at least...or better yet try an 18. Once you do this you will not dump them and go back to a 12 or 13...at least a 15 in most instances will match a low frequency 15, direct radiating so, so much better I promise you... I have a stack of powered 12" subwoofers in my second room and would never try to mix them with any 15" 3 way cabinet, direct radiating...its just not smooth...the mix is not consistant or you would see 12" subs in pa systems or large theaters with 15" low frequency drivers Get some 18's and you will understand why...its that simple To have a direct radiating 12 or 13 digging deep with a direct radiating 15" 3 way or 2 way speaker is simply counter intuitive. Now im not going to explain anything lol its a simple acknowledgment you will reach if or when you get larger subwoofers. There is a reason you see people get 18's or even 15's and never buy another 12" sub... I learned when I was very young with car subwoofers, no matter what quality 12's I had the good 15's always did better. Its an easy companionship that does and will always make sense. With direct radiating drivers get a sub that is larger rather than waste money and time wondering about the big subs... This is in no way examples of horn subs and low frequency 15's in that such as the khorn or lascala etc... Got it ! I see your point. I did not see that it was the driver size you were coming from. Im sure your right that 18s would be a better match for my 904s. What if the 12" sub had more output (20-200) and less distortion in everyway than the 15"? Would you still take the 15'? Edited September 27, 2014 by reference_head 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heritage_Head Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 (edited) I have heard some pretty weak 15s. My epik empire had two 15s and just the one 13.5" ultra driver smokes those average 2x15s in the empire. In fact the two 15 empire was about the same as one pb12 plus. edit: I really liked the empire and was not calling it weak Edited September 27, 2014 by reference_head 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beeker Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 If I am building a theater or a pa as well as home theater or a home music system I would not use a subwoofer that is less than the size of my low frequency driver. There are tonal reasons why a smaller subwoofer will fall short of providing proper bass when exchanging harmony with a low frequency driver in a 2 or 3 way etc...cabinet/speaker. If you were to mix in some good or even descent 18's with your 904's you would be hooked I have to use the simple example when was the last time a band used say a 12" subwoofer with there 2 way 15" speaker cabinet...not going to find one. So why would I ever suggest somebody use one at home... It may work for you in your uses although under no circumstance would I mix any 15" woofer in a 2 or 3 way cab/speaker with a subwoofer of lesser size... I have owned speakers with 6 to 8+ inch drivers that will reach below 30hz...using a 12 or even a 10 as subwoofer duty reaches better harmony easier than if I use 5" subwoofers or multiple with the 6 to 8+ inch 2/3 way speaker...they just don't do the job... If I were Schu I would be looking for a 15" sub at least...or better yet try an 18. Once you do this you will not dump them and go back to a 12 or 13...at least a 15 in most instances will match a low frequency 15, direct radiating so, so much better I promise you... I have a stack of powered 12" subwoofers in my second room and would never try to mix them with any 15" 3 way cabinet, direct radiating...its just not smooth...the mix is not consistant or you would see 12" subs in pa systems or large theaters with 15" low frequency drivers Get some 18's and you will understand why...its that simple To have a direct radiating 12 or 13 digging deep with a direct radiating 15" 3 way or 2 way speaker is simply counter intuitive. Now im not going to explain anything lol its a simple acknowledgment you will reach if or when you get larger subwoofers. There is a reason you see people get 18's or even 15's and never buy another 12" sub... I learned when I was very young with car subwoofers, no matter what quality 12's I had the good 15's always did better. Its an easy companionship that does and will always make sense. With direct radiating drivers get a sub that is larger rather than waste money and time wondering about the big subs... This is in no way examples of horn subs and low frequency 15's in that such as the khorn or lascala etc... Got it ! I see your point. I did not see that it was the driver size you were coming from. Im sure your right that 18s would be a better match for my 904s. What if the 12" sub had more output (20-200) and less distortion in everyway than the 15"? Would you still take the 15'? For at home use it really wouldn't matter. Those 904's could be pushed like an absolute freight train. To me I have found in the past 2 years in particular at home 18's with 15's(in 3 way configuration/speaker) is sonic nirvana...then again the quality of your svs with the 904 has to be absolutely stunning as well. The 15 will take less watts to do as much power wise(this is proven) and even more in my opinion in particular matching tonally with 2/3 way speaker configuration 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beeker Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 I have heard some pretty weak 15s. My epik empire had two 15s and just the one 13.5" ultra driver smokes those average 2x15s in the empire. In fact the two 15 empire was about the same as one pb12 plus. edit: I really liked the empire and was not calling it weak There are some absolute junk subwoofers around. Them combo/multiple subs in 1 cabinet imo were trial and error and mostly chalked up to error. I have heard your subs in single sub setups and know they are very good...I have to take some of my prior comment back. At home limiting the watts its really not necessary for the 15 or 18" sub. I do wonder how you would compare dual, single 18" subwoofers or more in your 904 theater...regardless your svs are trump or equal to even the old fathom jl 13. I don't remember the epic but I know I had heard one. I believe they were dual subs with 1 facing 1 way and the other facing forward or what have they. Both facing the same direction would be my preference. Im putting some subjective material down on the forum now and don't want to muck up schu's thread 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heritage_Head Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 (edited) Yea I would love some of those subs Derric and Scrappy have. I would have went diy if I could go back in time. Edited September 27, 2014 by reference_head Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heritage_Head Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 Schu have you thought about diy? A few sealed 18s would be cheap and better than anything (value)I can think of (thats not a horn) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beeker Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 Yea I would love some of those subs Derric and Scrappy have. I would have went diy if I could go back in time. For subs and I was going to suggest it to Schu as well considering he has been looking. With all the pa systems going powered(the big quality ones are not but the small ones are still switching) you can find crazy deals for pa subs on clist and guitar center etc...even online brand new...some may look a bit tacky although after testing you can recover them or just wrap the cabs in speaker grille clothe...this is sort of how I got my dual single cab 18's... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason str Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 I can pick up these SVS PB2000 for $1,000pr... a few months old and owner says warranty is still good. is this a fair deal, good deal or wait for a horn loaded sub? I would be giving up my SW-115 and replacing a single 15 with dual 12's... I am looking for MUSICALITY over HT, but at least 20hz would be cool! SVS subs are good but in no way a substitute for the effortless sound of a horn loaded subwoofer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schu Posted September 27, 2014 Author Share Posted September 27, 2014 I can pick up these SVS PB2000 for $1,000pr... a few months old and owner says warranty is still good. is this a fair deal, good deal or wait for a horn loaded sub? I would be giving up my SW-115 and replacing a single 15 with dual 12's... I am looking for MUSICALITY over HT, but at least 20hz would be cool! SVS subs are good but in no way a substitute for the effortless sound of a horn loaded subwoofer. That's what I was waiting to hear jason... but you never got back to me via email... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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