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mprowland

External Amp advice?

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I currently have a Denon AVR-x3300w that feeds a RC-3 and 2 x RS-3s.  I use the pre-outs from this receiver to feed an older Denon AVR-3802 that solely powers a pair of RF-7iis (I know this setup is rather goofy, but I wanted maximize the power to the RF-7iis).  The two options I am looking at is a used Emotiva XPA-2($500) or a new Outlaw-5000($599).  My main goal is to "wake up" the RF-7iis as they seem a little too "thin" running on the AVR alone.  So I guess my questions are; Do both amps have ample power to run the RF-7iis and is one better than the other in terms of clarity, sound stage and instrument separation?  Is there maybe a better option at this price point(maybe 2x Outlaw 2200 mono block)?  Thanks for any input....

 

Mark   

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Well, the Emotiva is the "beastier" amp but the Outlaw is no slouch and does offer more flexibility.  I would not be surprised if you only used 2 channels of the Outlaw that it would come close to matching the dynamics of the Emotiva.

 

When we were at Youthman's house doing the RF-7, RF-7II, RF-7iiDG, RF-7III, comparisons, we used my "90w/ch" Yamaha A-S1000 integrated amp part of the time and it held it's own when driving any of the 7's.  Not quite as dynamic and punchy as Youthman's Acurus A200 but still very acceptable performance.

 

Bill

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I might look into Class D or Hypex if I were you. completely silent floor and high dampening factor.

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5 minutes ago, Schu said:

I might look into Class D or Hypex if I were you. completely silent floor and high dampening factor.

I've actually looked at the "Class D" thread in the Solid State forum.   I'm very intrigued by the Texas Instruments TPA3255EVM board.  I'd like to know how this stacks up against the amps I've listed.  I wouldn't mind doing a DIY amp if I knew the outcome would be worth it.  

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Imo u need an amp with clean power of 300watts or more to make a significant difference.  Since u already ran an extra avr as an external i wouldn't think it worth it to switch for less than 2x power.

 

I actually use inukedsps (cheap class D) to externally amp my diy fronts and mbms.  They work very well at 8ohms with a flat response.  But fan noise and s/n ratio of the amp itself are issues (which i resolved and of course would share) but....with a 99db sensitive rf7, similar to my diy at 97...i would recommend u go with very clean power.  

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11 hours ago, mprowland said:

I've actually looked at the "Class D" thread in the Solid State forum.   I'm very intrigued by the Texas Instruments TPA3255EVM board.  I'd like to know how this stacks up against the amps I've listed.  I wouldn't mind doing a DIY amp if I knew the outcome would be worth it.  

Two great deals...

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Wyred4Sound-SX-500-Mono-Power-Amplifiers-Pair/222842085588?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Wyred-4-Sound-ST-250-Stereo-Power-Amplifier/232671266520?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649

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On 2/20/2018 at 7:19 PM, RoboKlipsch said:

Imo u need an amp with clean power of 300watts or more to make a significant difference. 

 

I don't think so, there's a big difference between my Marantz receiver with 140 watts and my Parasound Halo A23 with 150 watts.  I don't think that receivers like impedance dips very much.  A nice amp opens them up more.  
 

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9 hours ago, MetropolisLakeOutfitters said:

 

I don't think so, there's a big difference between my Marantz receiver with 140 watts and my Parasound Halo A23 with 150 watts.  I don't think that receivers like impedance dips very much.  A nice amp opens them up more.  
 

Excellent point.  Its not my fault the rf7s were designed with that dip ☺

 

Im interested to hear if the 3s addressed this.  My diysg speakers dont have a dip like that, there was a lengthy discussion about how many 8ohm speakers arent truly 8 and i hadnt considered that in this case.  Nice point MLO

 

I thought him having a receiver with say 150watts and even a 2nd with similar maybe it wouldnt make much difference until headroom was higher but I stand corrected.  Always happy to learn additional facets of design and actual use...thank you.  👍

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On 2/20/2018 at 7:10 AM, mprowland said:

Is there maybe a better option

To dip your foot in the external amplification look for a used QSC PLX2.  Gobs of sweet sounding high current.  It will certainly wake your 7's up.

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Thanks for all the replies, I truly appreciate it.  I keep thinking that Class D is the way to go, please correct me if I'm wrong.  For roughly $200 (minus the enclosure) I can buy a power supply and TI audio board that have some fairly impressive specs.  The issue I have with any amp is that I really can't audition them first.  My biggest worry is that I can easily end up spending $700+ and not really hear a discernible difference to what I have now ....and if this is a used amp, I'm stuck with it until I sell it(which can be a big hassle).  The TI board I was looking at is $150-ish + $40-ish for the power supply.  If the combo sounds great, I can then look for a decent enclosure, if it's bad, I'm out $200 versus $700+ for a "conventional" amp.   Does this seem at all logical?  Again, thanks for any input...

 

Mark    

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19 minutes ago, RoboKlipsch said:

I think how far away you sit and how loud you listen are deciding factors.

The room itself is 16' x 24' with 9' vaulted ceilings.  I sit roughly 12' feet away with the speakers being 10' from each other.  I tend to listen to music at loud levels for short durations(I'm guessing around 95 db).  My current AVR is fine for TV/movies but not so much for music.  The music becomes "thin" when cranked up.  Sad to say, as of right now I don't think there is too much of a  difference between my old RF-3s and my new RF-7ii.  I know the source/amp HAS to be the difference.  

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I have a hard time thinking at those levels....say 10watts max, the issue is the amp.  Either Denon should sound great imo.  Did u run Audyssey and if so do u like it better with or without?  So often these issues are the room, not the equipment.  It could be as subtle as how u run your Audyssey setup that u (we all) may be able to help you get a far better result before moving towards new equipment.

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I did run Audyssey and prefer it when listening to 5-channels.  I don't notice too much of a difference in 2-channel whether it's on or off.  Overall, I like the sound of my old Denon 3802 better than the new Denon-3300.  Even though it's better, the bass and overall sound is still too thin.  I expected more "slam".  I've combed these forums for hours and the general consensus seems to be that the RF-7ii shine when they have real external power.  I guess it could be my room, but it's far easier to change my "suspect" amps over changing room characteristics.  Thanks for the reply!             

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how u run audyssey has a massive impact on the sound.  you can spend 100s or 1000s on equipment when some time spent getting the autocal to do better will have a better result.  just my 2c.  the 3300 is no slouch (i have a similar x4000) and i have a 3808 so i know what u mean.  and i have external amps so i have compared.  imo your issue is not amp related.

 

is dynamic eq on?   

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I am using the 3300 currently and like Robo mentioned, it’s no slouch. 

 

I do believe my Pioneer Elite provides more actual power, it probably isn’t by much.

 

this sounds like more of a tuning thing to me also. With that said, keep your eyes open for a good amp on the used market and jump when the right one presents itself.

 

RF-3’s were my first pair of Klipsch speakers (pretty sure) and I have been hooked ever since I first heard them. 

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4 hours ago, K5SS said:

With that said, keep your eyes open for a good amp on the used market and jump when the right one presents itself.

 

Agree totally.

 

Bill

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