gullahisland Posted May 16, 2004 Share Posted May 16, 2004 As some of you know, I just picked up pair of '77 lacquered rosewood Klipschorns this week. I've posted a few pictures for you to take a peek. Caveat emptor - I don't want to hear about my inadequate corners or how I have the K's toed out and not sealed into the corners properly. I don't think I'm sacrificing a whole lot of bass extension and the tradeoff is well worth the improvement in imaging and soundstaging. It's all about tradeoffs. Follow this link to take a look. Just click on "More Pictures" for a few shots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodog Posted May 16, 2004 Share Posted May 16, 2004 Nice crib! I especially like the stained glass. Woo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rckpls Posted May 16, 2004 Share Posted May 16, 2004 Those are some nice horns! The Belles look like they're just in the way. Would you like for me to haul them off for you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jorjen Posted May 16, 2004 Share Posted May 16, 2004 One of these days Dan, it would be nice to see some pics without Ed's Belles in the way!. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted May 16, 2004 Share Posted May 16, 2004 Did you know you have inadequate corners, the K-horns are toed out too far, and not sealed into the corners properly? Almost identical to my set up right now, except I also have mine tipped forward. Thanks to Maron Horanzak for riding my back on getting the tweeters on my ears -- there is a major improvement in imaging. I ran a frequency response plot on the setup today. My test CD is awful, but it does provide a general picture of what's going on. I used 1Khz at 80db for reference, and used the calibration scale for the Rat Shack meter. 50Hz.......................+2.5db 100Hz.....................+.5db 500Hz.....................+.5db 1000Hz......................0 2000Hz...................- 5db 5000Hz...................+2.5db 8000Hz...................+6.5db (yikes) 10,000Hz................- 4.5db (uhg) 12,000Hz................+.2db 15,000Hz................+2.5db Not great, but sounds good, and I sure don't see or hear the suckout between 100Hz and 500Hz from not having them in the corners. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdm56 Posted May 16, 2004 Share Posted May 16, 2004 Beautiful horns, beautiful home!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Robin Posted May 16, 2004 Share Posted May 16, 2004 Stunning! Keep them all and be oh so happy. Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik Mandaville Posted May 16, 2004 Share Posted May 16, 2004 Beautiful! Very nice stained glass window, too! My horns aren't sealed in the corners, either, and they sound better to me that way. I'm sure there may be some drop in response, but what we hear sounds very natural and unbloated. Others like to really seal them in the corners. Those K-horns just look good where you have them. Being interested in art for as long as I have -- particularly sculpture and 3-D design -- I have always really liked the sculptural, even architectural qualities of the La Scalas and Klipschorns. Could you imagine a building, 100 floors high, constructed in the shape of a klipschorn? It would be a fascinating structure, but would require a corner location in the sky! Again, they look perfect! You got yourself a really nice-looking pair of horns! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prodj101 Posted May 16, 2004 Share Posted May 16, 2004 does anyone know what klipsch uses as the test freqeuncy when determining sensitivity, or is it an average of a wide band? if not, wouldn't they be able to use a frequency of say....8,000 hz, which is 6.5 db higher than 1,000 to get these figures provided their testing rooms and equipment provide similar results to Deans? I was just wondering because I don't think they mention anything about the frequency used as a reference in the specs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdyer Posted May 16, 2004 Share Posted May 16, 2004 I'm glad to hear some of you folks toe your khorns out rather than seal them in the corners. I have had the same experience as the original poster; my listening position is 16 to 18 feet from the horns and 45ing them in the corners really adversely impacts imaging and soundstage. So i toe them out until the soundstage is most dramatic. i guess i might forfeit a little bass by doing this, but it is more than worth the loss to me. I have ordered a Martin logan sub and intend to try that at about 30 to 40 hz down. I am also surprised by the number of khorn users who speak favorably on the use of a sub with their horns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdyer Posted May 16, 2004 Share Posted May 16, 2004 BTW, the horns are stunningly beautiful, as is the room. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhawk92 Posted May 17, 2004 Share Posted May 17, 2004 Wow, those are beautiful speakers in a beautiful home. Good stuff there. What an incredible find! Congrats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3dzapper Posted May 17, 2004 Share Posted May 17, 2004 GI, Nice!!!!! ---------------- On 5/16/2004 12:43:46 PM prodj101 wrote: does anyone know what klipsch uses as the test freqeuncy when determining sensitivity, or is it an average of a wide band? if not, wouldn't they be able to use a frequency of say....8,000 hz, which is 6.5 db higher than 1,000 to get these figures provided their testing rooms and equipment provide similar results to Deans? I was just wondering because I don't think they mention anything about the frequency used as a reference in the specs. ---------------- Dean's chart in his system in his room and not representative of all Khorns. PWK measured in kis own test chamber with a faux corner.In other words YMMV. Rick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted May 17, 2004 Share Posted May 17, 2004 love the window seat = first I have ever seen that - no TV? BTW, did you know you have inadequate corners, the K-horns are toed out too far, and not sealed into the corners properly? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3dzapper Posted May 17, 2004 Share Posted May 17, 2004 ---------------- On 5/17/2004 2:44:59 PM Colin wrote: love the window seat = first I have ever seen that - no TV? BTW, did you know you have inadequate corners, the K-horns are toed out too far, and not sealed into the corners properly? ---------------- Colin, I tried not to mention that in my post. We want to be positive, positive, positive!!! Rick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gullahisland Posted May 17, 2004 Author Share Posted May 17, 2004 ---------------- On 5/16/2004 1:06:03 AM DeanG wrote: Did you know you have inadequate corners, the K-horns are toed out too far, and not sealed into the corners properly? Almost identical to my set up right now, except I also have mine tipped forward. Thanks to Maron Horanzak for riding my back on getting the tweeters on my ears -- there is a major improvement in imaging. I ran a frequency response plot on the setup today. My test CD is awful, but it does provide a general picture of what's going on. I used 1Khz at 80db for reference, and used the calibration scale for the Rat Shack meter. 50Hz.......................+2.5db 100Hz.....................+.5db 500Hz.....................+.5db 1000Hz......................0 2000Hz...................- 5db 5000Hz...................+2.5db 8000Hz...................+6.5db (yikes) 10,000Hz................- 4.5db (uhg) 12,000Hz................+.2db 15,000Hz................+2.5db Not great, but sounds good, and I sure don't see or hear the suckout between 100Hz and 500Hz from not having them in the corners. ---------------- That's interesting Dean. I didn't realize that it's the 100-500Hz frequency that is adversely affected by the horns not being sealed into the corners. This confuses me even more as it is that frequency range where I hear an exaggerated "tubbiness" in the frequency response. I've tried moving around the room to see if it's only a problem at the listening position, but it seems to be everywhere. If I didn't know better, I would say that it's the kind of sound you get when you place your speakers in the corners ! In fact, it's this particular frequency range that I find somewhat "un-natural" about the K-horns. I haven't tried pulling them further away from the corners yet (HERESY!) but I wonder if anyone else has noticed this "hump" in the 100-500 range? Is this due to the bass bin handling higher frequencies and resonating? I've also noticed that the recordings which have exaggerated bass to begin with (such as Holly Cole's Temptation or Don't Smoke In Bed) are the worst. Maybe they're just revealing a flaw in the recording which actually sounds pretty good on less "full range" speakers? It seems to me that K-horns would sound best pulled a foot or two out of the corners and with a subwoofer handling ~ 80Hz and lower. I know it would have to be a VERY FAST sub in order to integrate well with the horn-loaded bass bin, but for most listening rooms (ie, those less than 25' wide) I would think that the results would be better than compromising the stereo image. I should also note that the room extends another 10' or so to the right-hand-side. There's a short wall there where the right K-horn is placed which leads to the foyer. My listening chair is about 15-16' from the K-horns and there's another 15' or so behind me and the ceiling vaults to about 16'. The K-horns are spaced about 16' apart, but the overall dimensions of the room are 25'X 30'. Even with only 25wpc behind them, there's certainly no lack of dynamic headroom ! That's one of the traits that I find most endearing about these speakers. Dean - How far away does one need to sit before it's no longer necessary to angle them down? I understand the concept of sitting on-axis, but I would think that after 10-15', it wouldn't be necessary. I mean, for any listener to sit with their ears slightly below the axis of the Klipschorn tweeters, they'd need to sit on a BIG STACK of phone books! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justin_tx_16 Posted May 17, 2004 Share Posted May 17, 2004 in a word... Stunning Those look fantastic. Prestine, amazing... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gullahisland Posted May 17, 2004 Author Share Posted May 17, 2004 ---------------- On 5/17/2004 2:44:59 PM Colin wrote: love the window seat = first I have ever seen that - no TV? BTW, did you know you have inadequate corners, the K-horns are toed out too far, and not sealed into the corners properly? ---------------- Thanks for all the nice comments. The window seat houses my components and some of my cds. There are cabinets along the entire length of the window seat and all of the cabinet doors open up and slide back on tracks for a flush look. As for the T.V. - It's in the family room. The living room is strictly for two-channel audio ONLY! It's nice, too because my wife or kids can watch tv while I listen to music. And if I REALLY want to listen, I can close off the entire family room/kitchen area with a set of double-doors and three "pocket" doors. NOW - ABOUT THAT "CORNER" COMMENT! We can't have it ALL! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3dzapper Posted May 17, 2004 Share Posted May 17, 2004 GI, What you lose with loose corner coupling is the sharp, seemless transition between the bass and squaker. When coupled a rim shot is a RIM SHOT. If you get my drift. Even with the toe-out you can couple the backs to the corners with a number of means without building ugly false corners in your lovely conservatory. My Khorns stick out three or four inches from the corner, are toe'd slightly, on a knee wall and the corners aren't the squarest in the world but, they are still coupled tightly with foam cut for the job. Since it is out of sight there is room for you to experiment. Rick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gilbert Posted May 17, 2004 Share Posted May 17, 2004 Beautiful home gullahisland, very nice. And I too love that stained glass, very very nice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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