ooteedee Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 Ok, look. I know what I'm about to say may seem like lunacy. And most likely will be perceived as blashphemy to purists,...but you have to bear with me and just accept the fact that my plan is for the fun of it... to provide some decent sound in my barn, and give me something to do over the holiday break. I'm building some La Scalas. But they're going to end up being more like FrankenScalas. I will build the cabinets based on factory dimensions. I will build them tight...no leaks. I will use sound carpentry practicess. But I cannot afford to use Klipsch woofers, horns, tweeters or crossovers. (I bought a bunch of stuff before I stumbled upon the La Scala plans.) (2) 15 Archer/Madison woofers 35hz 5000hz (2) 5x15 Piezo horns 2000hz 20,000hz (2) left over Tweeters of unknown brand my Dad has in the basement (2) Radio Shack Mach One adjustable (mid/high) crossover networks: Crossover points at 1200 Hz and 4500 kHz Now.... yes. This does sound frightening. But I'm no super audiophile for this project. They're for the barn. The La Scala crossover is at 400hz and 4500hz. Which is obviously completely different than what the FrankenScala will be. Any wild speculatation on how this will sound? Any suggestions? (No cursing please) Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coytee Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 Don't know how it will sound, but I love the name! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marvel Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 From most of the work folks have done here, the bass will only get up to around 500Hz. Maybe all the way to 700Hz, and this is because of the horn folds in the bass cabinet. Crossing as high as your crossover, will get you a big hole in your bass response. You can't just drop any 15 inch woofer into that cabinet. What are the T/S parameters for the woofers you have? If they don't sound good to you, who will you want to blame? It's a good question to ask yourself before you start building. There are components you can change (many here have done that), but usually after having the original (whether built by Klipsch or to their specs) and then having a baseline to work from. I wish you luck. It might sound great to you, but you are really taking a chance, even for the barn. Marvel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ooteedee Posted December 17, 2004 Author Share Posted December 17, 2004 Archer/Madison 15" Woofer Fs 32hz Vas 1.51 Sd 95.03 in Qts .860 Qes .914 Qms 14.742 BL 10.331 Re 5.5 Xmech .675 in Le 11.628 Mms 87.87g Spl 93db Fq.rs 35 5k Coil 2 Magnet 30 oz Wrms 100 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ooteedee Posted December 17, 2004 Author Share Posted December 17, 2004 RE: Using the Radio Shack crossover of 1200hz for the woofer. How can the properties of the folded horn "limit" the frequencies it emits? I thought the principle of the horn was to amplify them. Or project them more efficiently? Admittedly, the FrankenScala crossover will force the woofer to handle higher than 400hz. But how can the horn itself create a hole ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnA Posted December 18, 2004 Share Posted December 18, 2004 Those woofer specs look suspect for a La Scala. I think the performance will be poor. Get on eBay and be patient. You will be able to but the correct drivers and crossovers pretty cheaply. You can buy K-401 horns from Klipsch for about $50 each. Burn down the phone lines, that is a screaming deal. To conserve money, look through the compression drivers at PartsExpress.com. There is one that will run from 400 to 10K, or so. Build a 2-way with those and a Type AA network. Save your money until you can afford a pair of K-77/T-35s, or look up djk and ask him for help designing a circuit to use CTS/Motorola Piezo tweeters with the type AA network. The piezo tweeters are less than $20 each. If you scrimp on components, you'll squeeze all of the magic right out of your La Scala clones. You would have been better off to have just bought some old Cerwin Vegas, or put car speakers in a box. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fini Posted December 18, 2004 Share Posted December 18, 2004 ---------------- On 12/17/2004 7:18:56 PM Marvel wrote: Crossing as high as your crossover, will get you a big hole in your bass response. ---------------- Please, Marvel, in the Holiday spirit, and giving a newbie a break, don't make reference to his "big bass hole." I think once you've done some room treatments (and trained the cows and goats to stand in the proper positions) you might end up with something quite special. I can make you some interconnects... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ooteedee Posted December 18, 2004 Author Share Posted December 18, 2004 Ok, cool. Thank you for all the replies. What if I changed it a bit. But how about this. Instead of using those horns as mids, what if I were to use some new Cerwin Vega 5" speakers for the midrange and use the horn as a tweeter. Here are the Cerwin Vega specs: They are perfectly flat from 125hz to 1000hz. After that there is a slight hump at about 1500hz and then back to flat out to 12,000hz and then they start to die out at 16,000hz. poly impregnated paper cone inverted cloth rolled surround 20oz. magnet .75 kapton voice coil Mounting depth is 2" Mounting diameter is 4.25" 95db 90db usable flat response 8ohm 40 watts rms 80 watts peak 125hz to 16,000hz usable frequency response at +/- 5db (+5db at all frequency points except at 12khz where it is -1db) tested at 100 points using LMS 4.0 So the La Scalastein would have: (2) 15 Archer/Madison woofers 35hz 5000hz (2) Cerwin Vega 125hz - 16,000hz (2) 5x15 Piezo horns 2000hz 20,000hz (75 watts rms 150 watts peak) (2) Radio Shack Mach One adjustable (mid/high) crossover networks: Crossover points at 1200 Hz and 4500 kHz The only thing that worries me about the Vega's is 40 watt/80 peak. Plus it would look kind of weird...having a round speaker up there with the horn. (If it fits) Better solution? Or am I just reaching? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Spinner Posted December 19, 2004 Share Posted December 19, 2004 you need to download some design programs .. DIYspeakers.com . ..maybe .. and really DESIGN what yer gonna build i think you already know what these are gonna sound like .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ooteedee Posted December 19, 2004 Author Share Posted December 19, 2004 TO: bsafirebird1969 Thanks for the "help". A guy wants to have a little fun experimenting with some less than perfect components, and he gets dissed. Merry Christmas . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Spinner Posted December 22, 2004 Share Posted December 22, 2004 straighten out yer panties, there .......you Need to download somebodys DESIGN program ... it ain't a "diss" ... it's the truth ... you are just gonna stuff parts in this box, and see what happes ... why throw money away on stuff that isn't gonna work worth a crap ??? ..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ooteedee Posted December 22, 2004 Author Share Posted December 22, 2004 Dude. It'll sound fine. Gimme a break. If it doesn't, I'll change it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironwoods Posted December 23, 2004 Share Posted December 23, 2004 Hi, while Klipsch doesn't really provide a DIY forum, you might consider taking your project to the Madisound, Partsexpress BB or DIYaudio forums for help with non-Klipsch components. "(2) left over Tweeters of unknown brand my Dad has in the basement"? I'd omit this line from the list, beforehand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Champagne taste beer budget Posted December 23, 2004 Share Posted December 23, 2004 Admitting up front that I know less than most about speaker design or construction, it seems you're asking the New York Philharmonic Orchestra what they think of the violin strings you made out of various lb test of fishing line. All of the guys here mean well, but they are often concerned with "correct" sound. Chances are, with the components you are planning on using, you won't have that, but you will have speakers that make music. I'm often in your spot, using things for a project that aren't necessarly correct for the purpose at hand, but will do the deed. I'd say go ahead and build em, considering the intended usage, but don't expect em to sound all that exciting. Getting some properly matched components would be a good idea, if in the budget, and I would look into some of the aforementioned programs for design and construction. If nothing else, they'll give you information you might be able to use in the future. Good luck with your project. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quick&dirty Posted December 23, 2004 Share Posted December 23, 2004 ooteedee,(what name!) you sound like an intelligent cuss,why sweat it so, gi' it a try. as you stated in your last hurrah to dude. If that humongous hole those pundits and wise beards are talking about is appreciably noticeable you can the take steps to plug the hole. I doubt you ever will; remember : If at first you don't suck seed suck until you do suck seed for we all know that nothing succeeds like a seedsucker, or as the old german :Goethe said :wir sind gewoehnt das die menschen verhoehnen dass was sie nicht verstehen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ooteedee Posted December 23, 2004 Author Share Posted December 23, 2004 Yavohl, herr commandant! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ooteedee Posted December 23, 2004 Author Share Posted December 23, 2004 By the way. I wired those speakers up through the crossover and the amp...and I know that by themselves without a cabinet NO speaker sounds right.... but....... They kind of sounded like crap. I'll pop them in the finished cabinet and at least try them.... but then I'll cook up some crow with BBQ sauce and plunk down a little more cash for some better speakers and the right crossover. Maybe even Klipsch speakers. Thanks for all your comments. Gotta go. Mein kind hat gebuchts full gemact. Or something like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ooteedee Posted December 23, 2004 Author Share Posted December 23, 2004 Oh... and another thing "Quick and Dirty", Go look at the post: "Splitter modification for Belle and LaScala" in the Updates & Modifications forum. It's pretty informative. The splitter is the wedge at the opening of the horn. See you Friday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAKO Posted December 24, 2004 Share Posted December 24, 2004 Thats not a splitter or wedge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ooteedee Posted December 24, 2004 Author Share Posted December 24, 2004 According to the factory design blueprints: Part #3 is called a "splitter". If you don't want to call it a "splitter", what would you prefer it be called? An acoustic diverter? Long wave re-director? A tri-sided chamber support? And if you don't want to call it a "wedge", what would you prefer it be called? Triangular shaped beam? An extended half pyramid? A bisected square rod? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.