Erik Mandaville Posted June 10, 2005 Share Posted June 10, 2005 I've thought about this off and on for some time. When upgrading an older network, one must rely on the opinions of others concerning not only which of the two types is the 'better' network, but the most suitable type/brand of capacitor for the more critical tweeter filter. To help alleviate some of the uncertainty, I thought this might be an idea: 1)I would construct two separate networks (A and AA)on the same board, one each for each channel. 2)The networks would consist of both tested recycled parts, as well as brand new capacitors for the tweeter. 3)The user would have the ability to switch between the three different types of capacitors associated with the tweeter in order to choose which one he or she prefers and/or would like or rather be able to afford. Using the switch would involve nothing more than rotating to three preset positions. 4)The new capacitors would consist of a Hovland Musicap, A Solen, and a new GE motor run oil capacitor -- all of which of course of the same value. 5)Adjustable L-pads.............................Surprise!!! Will NOT be used. I will use a recycled or new autoformer. My reason: The last thing in the world I would be interested in is reproducing crossover networks in order to sell. I want to provide the opportunity for those interested in upgrading a chance to audition alternatives as far as type and parts used. We already have sources for crossover upgrades, but what I would like to provide is a more educated way of deciding the best combination of crossover type and critical parts before making the investment. It would be a crossover roadshow of sorts, and the networks would travel from one interested party to the next. The reason I don't want to use adjustable L-pads, even though I, having tried both, think they are superior to the autoformer in terms of flexibility and ease of use, is that the people who sell network upgrades don't use them. You won't get the best idea of what you would be investing in. 6) I get nothing out of it. I have some parts I'm not using, and this would be a constructive way of using them. I also have a gift certificate for a great source of parts, including the Hovlands, yet have nothing I really need for myself right now. Does this sound like something worth while? Erik edit: That should be 'an' idea -- not 'and' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShapeShifter Posted June 10, 2005 Share Posted June 10, 2005 I think it's an excellent idea. Very generous of you, and it would be a great benefit to anyone considering crossover upgrades. Wish an opportunity like that would have been available before I upgraded my Klipschorns. Wes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cal Blacksmith Posted June 10, 2005 Share Posted June 10, 2005 Your thoughtfulness again knows no bounds. I think it is an excellent idea for sure! My sound memory is short indeed, if the networks were setup with some sort of switching so you could change settings while the speaker is playing, to me would be most useful. I am not currently considering upgrades to the networks I have, but this method serves me better than turning everything off, making the change then turning everything back on and trying to remember what the last setting sounded like. You know sort of like the machine that the eye doctor uses when testing your eyes. Which is better, this? (Pause click) Or This? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daddy Dee Posted June 10, 2005 Share Posted June 10, 2005 Erik, Sounds like a good idea. This would allow switching between alternatives for real comparison. Bob Crites was discussing the need to switch between one crossover and another... a/b comparison in order to have the ability to hear the difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rplace Posted June 10, 2005 Share Posted June 10, 2005 Wow, this seems to be just the ticket for my delima. Check out my thread form yesterday. crossover thread I will gladly be your first test subject. What a great idea and thoughtful gesture on your part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik Mandaville Posted June 10, 2005 Author Share Posted June 10, 2005 Bob's idea is a good one. He sells a combined A/AA network, which I also think is useful for some. If one can only afford one or the other, than having the opportunity to listen and choose would be useful. I would want to make the switching as straightforward as possible, and it would probably be easier to have two completely separate networks for this. There are certainly ways one could use parts from both, but might bring about some confusion. The GE caps are not expensive, and work well. I have those in my own networks and find them to sound very good -- but we all hear differently, and have different hearing efficiency, so it just makes sense to have the chance to compare. Eye like the idea of testing for corrective lenses at the I doctor! Perfect analogy -- and exactly right, I think. If Bob already has plans for this, I concede to him on this -- although it could still be a benefit to have as many 'out there' as we can. Swtiching between taps on the autoformer is something I've always thought would be very useful. Erik Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik Mandaville Posted June 10, 2005 Author Share Posted June 10, 2005 Bob's idea is a good one. He sells a combined A/AA network, which I also think is useful for some. If one can only afford one or the other, than having the opportunity to listen and choose would be useful. I would want to make the switching as straightforward as possible, and it would probably be easier to have two completely separate networks for this. There are certainly ways one could use parts from both, but might bring about some confusion. The GE caps are not expensive, and work well. I have those in my own networks and find them to sound very good -- but we all hear differently, and have different hearing efficiency, so it just makes sense to have the chance to compare. Eye like the idea of testing for corrective lenses at the I doctor! Perfect analogy -- and exactly right, I think. If Bob already has plans for this, I concede to him on this -- although it could still be a benefit to have as many 'out there' as we can. Swtiching between taps on the autoformer is something I've always thought would be very useful. Erik Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik Mandaville Posted June 10, 2005 Author Share Posted June 10, 2005 It's something I would like to do, as well, so I'm just sharing something I think would be helpful to others. This is a completely not-for-profit interest. I really have no interest in going into the crossover business, and really got the idea from Mark D., whose Peach preamp we had the pleasure of seeing and listen to. The difference is that what people would end up with after comparing two different networks and their requisite parts is a better understanding of a best choice 'for them'. That includes preferences for tweeter capacitors that is independent of the opinion of others. Opinion is a personal thing, but sometimes the opinion of others is all we have to go on -- which is why I think Mark's preamp roadshow idea is both an effective and really, really good idea. Erik Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jheis Posted June 10, 2005 Share Posted June 10, 2005 Erik: Sign me up! At the very least I'd be interested in hearing the difference vs. my "dreaded" AL's (which - not knowing any better - sound pretty good to me). James Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt1stcav Posted June 10, 2005 Share Posted June 10, 2005 Ditto. I think my original crossovers for my '79 Cornwalls sound good. But having an alternate A and AA network to compare with would be quite beneficial, and if an improvement is detected with either network, then I'd know which one would work for my loudspeakers in my listening room. You have my blessing, Erik! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fini Posted June 11, 2005 Share Posted June 11, 2005 Great idea, Eric! Sign me up for the roadshow. I'll take it just before jheis...I can deliver it to him by hand! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted June 11, 2005 Share Posted June 11, 2005 I think my original crossovers for my '79 Cornwalls sound good. But having an alternate A and AA network to compare with would be quite beneficial... How do you figure? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piranha Posted June 11, 2005 Share Posted June 11, 2005 Corns take B's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted June 11, 2005 Share Posted June 11, 2005 Tom, you have a PM. Man, I really wanted to see if Jim would load those A/AA's in his Cornwalls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fini Posted June 11, 2005 Share Posted June 11, 2005 Hey, Jim could be on to something! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colterphoto1 Posted June 11, 2005 Share Posted June 11, 2005 Erik, excellent idea. I have quite a few Cornwalls and LaScalas which could use refurbished/new crossovers, but it's a pretty costly proposition and I hesitate to do anything because I don't know how much improvement each of the various approaches would give. Having a way to audition a variety of crossovers would be an excellent idea. Thanks for your thoughtfullness! Michael Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt1stcav Posted June 11, 2005 Share Posted June 11, 2005 ---------------- On 6/11/2005 4:35:31 PM Piranha wrote: Corns take B's ---------------- A's, B's...whichever! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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