Jeff Matthews Posted January 10, 2006 Author Share Posted January 10, 2006 Very well-stated. I'll never screw the tops on those KHorns and switch from A to AA to meet the mood. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meagain Posted January 10, 2006 Share Posted January 10, 2006 I'm curious then, what the differences to the ear is between the oil can type and the yellow cylinder types? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Matthews Posted January 10, 2006 Author Share Posted January 10, 2006 Don't know, but you'll find out soon. Mine shipped today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted January 10, 2006 Share Posted January 10, 2006 I'm curious then, what the differences to the ear is between the oil can type and the yellow cylinder types? Forget the 'yellow' thing -- it's just the wrapping. Look at it all in the context of 'dielectric material'. Go here: http://ldsg.snippets.org/appdx-ec.php3 The GE cans sound rich and a bit lush through the midrange with good decay properties in the treble. They don't sound as clean, open, or coherent as what I normally use (Kimber, Auricap, Dayton, Janzten), but they do have an intoxicating quality that I haven't been able to put my finger on. I recently built a set of my favorite networks with them and was extremely surprised to find how much I enjoyed the result in the midrange. The main difference as far as construction and material goes between Bob's and mine is lead termination and the oil. All of these capacitors are metallized polypropylene types. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted January 10, 2006 Share Posted January 10, 2006 Don't know, but you'll find out soon. Mine shipped today. Well, you heard 'yellow types' in my networks over at LeMays', but not over at your place. Not only are the parts different but so is the circuit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Matthews Posted January 10, 2006 Author Share Posted January 10, 2006 I see. I was thinking "yellow/white" as same thing - just plastic vs. tin cans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted January 10, 2006 Share Posted January 10, 2006 Nope, the white caps are NOS (new old stock) Mylars. Better than old worn out caps, but that's about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meagain Posted January 10, 2006 Share Posted January 10, 2006 Do the 'yellow ones' also have the same richness in the low end as the oil cans? I guess my fear is with the yellows being better for the highs (as you say Dean) - well... they wouldn't sound too bright or piercing would they? I'm assuming it's a nice balanced sound? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3dzapper Posted January 10, 2006 Share Posted January 10, 2006 Dean, Those are 800VDC polyester. I bought them for use in amps. That's why I left all the leads intact. But, to my ears, they sound better than Hoveland musicaps.[] (Those are some big yellow ones Meaghan.) Jeff, If Bob will pay the postage back to me, you can send them over to him and he can measure them. Dean, you don't even want to know what i did today.[] Rick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pauln Posted January 10, 2006 Share Posted January 10, 2006 At any rate, my opinion is that none of the Klipsch networks sound very refined, open or smooth at moderate to high playback levels. Regardless of the networks or parts chosen -- expect a good deal of harshness and a nice case of earbleed if you like to push the envelope. I know you are discussing the older networks - what about the new AX-4 family? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEC Posted January 10, 2006 Share Posted January 10, 2006 Rick, I would be happy to measure them. Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Matthews Posted January 10, 2006 Author Share Posted January 10, 2006 So, is that a "go," Bob? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEC Posted January 10, 2006 Share Posted January 10, 2006 Yep, send them on when you get yours back and I will test them and send them back to Rick. Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Matthews Posted January 10, 2006 Author Share Posted January 10, 2006 Bob, just you keep the papers for the test you did of the old xovers of mine? How about the new? Just wondering if you had these to compare to Ricks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEC Posted January 10, 2006 Share Posted January 10, 2006 Dean said "but they do have an intoxicating quality that I haven't been able to put my finger on" Dean, You are not supposed to drink the oil from those oil filled caps. I have told you that is likely to make your ears bleed. Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEC Posted January 10, 2006 Share Posted January 10, 2006 Jeff, Yes, I have full documentation. Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted January 10, 2006 Share Posted January 10, 2006 "Do the 'yellow ones' also have the same richness in the low end as the oil cans?" Not the bass -- the midrange. No, the sound is fatter/fuller through the middle -- kind of lush sounding. However, it's at the expense of some clarity and openess. There is no free lunch with any of this stuff. Keep in mind that there isn't any substitute for actually listening to things. Describing the differences in sound is like trying to describe the differences in how food tastes. Want to take a shot at describing the difference in taste between vanilla and french vanilla ice cream? "I guess my fear is with the yellows being better for the highs (as you say Dean) - well... they wouldn't sound too bright or piercing would they?" "Bright and/or piercing" comes with the Type A/Type AA networks no matter how you build them if you dump too much power into them. However, I've built and sold plenty of these, and based on feedback from the buyers my choice in parts have always faired very well in this regard. "Dean, you don't even want to know what i did today." LOL, you actually think it can be any nuttier than what I did yesterday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted January 10, 2006 Share Posted January 10, 2006 "Intoxicating". Hmmm, yeah, that one conjurs up some strange imagery. How about -- really draws you into the music. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Matthews Posted January 10, 2006 Author Share Posted January 10, 2006 full, brimming, replete, ample, capacious.... exhilarant, roborant, vivifying.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted January 10, 2006 Share Posted January 10, 2006 AL/AK-4 I liked the sound of the AK-4 in my Klipschorns. Actually, I like the sound of everything in my Klipschorns! It's just that I prefer the sound of some things over others. My main complaint with that network was that I just had trouble getting it to open up at low volumes. The sound always hung to the baffles unless I went to 90dB+. My other complaint is related to cleanliness. I loved the big soundfield at the higher SPL's, but always ended up with a flashback to how much cleaner my modded RF-7s had sounded. No contest there at all -- the RF-7's walked all over them in the 'clean' category. I wanted to upgrade the caps in those networks, but it was simply to cost prohibitive. After I sold those networks and built up some simple Type A's I was immediately much happier with the sound. No doubt this was due primarily to my small room. The Type A opens up very fast -- a great network for low level listening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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