Colin Posted June 27, 2006 Share Posted June 27, 2006 Parrot hates tubes.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /> I think the bigger the horn, the better SET tube amps sound with them. True they can not pound the bass like solid state equipment can, but even low cost ones have a delicacy to the mid and high range that only super expensive s-s amps approximate.. 3. You dont always get what you pay for. I think the refurbished vintage stuff is better than most modest price s-s amps. 4. If you are trying to replicate natural voices and acoustic equipment at moderate volumes in a typical size room, SETs can thrill you. If you want to duplicate the rock band experience, get lots of horns and plenty of s-s power 5. Most tubes are set it and forget it. If they are run cool (low voltage), they do not wear out for years. I have dual-amped, with a s-s amp to the bass bin and a SET to the top. I love it. Parrot is intentionally confusing the THD of tubes vs. s-s amps. He knows that tube amp lovers arent looking for low THD the Stereophile article compares tube amps with what is an adopted s-s standard for clipping (1%). IMO, you cant go wrong with either Craig or Marks amps. [H] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rplace Posted June 27, 2006 Share Posted June 27, 2006 Chew on this idea a bit. It is the journey I have traveled. Thebes hit on it a bit but I will give you the details. I started off with a dedicated HT room. A wall full of gear - all solid state. For various reasons I won't go into I got back into vinyl. I wanted to use the khorn mains but also experiment with tubes. I did not want to build a 2nd system in a different room. I picked up a niles switch box (DSP-1 I think). Got a NOSValved reworked Scott integrated and borrowed a turntable. With a flip of a switch you can have all your HT stuff running through 7.1 channels of SS gear or vinyl/tubes using the same L/R main as your 2 channel speakers. Once I was convinced it was for me I got my own TTable, and have since sold the Scott in favor of a Juicy Music Blueberry Xtreme and NOSValves reworked MK III monoblocks. I am currently thinking about upgrading my TT. Arn't we all. Long story short you will probably love the tubes and end up with some pretty nice gear, so you could jump right in and spend your 1-2K (or a bit more) and be done with it. On the other hand it might not be 100% for you so starting off with a properly fixed up vintage integrated will allow you to see if it is for you. You can just about get your money back down the road if you don't like it or want to upgrade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steamer Posted June 27, 2006 Share Posted June 27, 2006 Parrot hates tubes.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /> I think the bigger the horn, the better SET tube amps sound with them. True they can not pound the bass like solid state equipment can, but even low cost ones have a delicacy to the mid and high range that only super expensive s-s amps approximate.. 3. You dont always get what you pay for. I think the refurbished vintage stuff is better than most modest price s-s amps. 4. If you are trying to replicate natural voices and acoustic equipment at moderate volumes in a typical size room, SETs can thrill you. If you want to duplicate the rock band experience, get lots of horns and plenty of s-s power 5. Most tubes are set it and forget it. If they are run cool (low voltage), they do not wear out for years. I have dual-amped, with a s-s amp to the bass bin and a SET to the top. I love it. Parrot is intentionally confusing the THD of tubes vs. s-s amps. He knows that tube amp lovers arent looking for low THD the Stereophile article compares tube amps with what is an adopted s-s standard for clipping (1%). IMO, you cant go wrong with either Craig or Marks amps. [H] Colin, Well said...sometimes it's hard to spot these tube haters,lol!!!! Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted June 27, 2006 Share Posted June 27, 2006 Here are the measurements on that $350,000 amp: http://www.stereophile.com/tubepoweramps/704wavac/index5.html Mark Wow....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Lindsey Posted June 27, 2006 Share Posted June 27, 2006 Chew on this idea a bit. It is the journey I have traveled. Thebes hit on it a bit but I will give you the details. I started off with a dedicated HT room. A wall full of gear - all solid state. For various reasons I won't go into I got back into vinyl. I wanted to use the khorn mains but also experiment with tubes. I did not want to build a 2nd system in a different room. I picked up a niles switch box (DSP-1 I think). Got a NOSValved reworked Scott integrated and borrowed a turntable. With a flip of a switch you can have all your HT stuff running through 7.1 channels of SS gear or vinyl/tubes using the same L/R main as your 2 channel speakers. Once I was convinced it was for me I got my own TTable, and have since sold the Scott in favor of a Juicy Music Blueberry Xtreme and NOSValves reworked MK III monoblocks. I am currently thinking about upgrading my TT. Arn't we all. Long story short you will probably love the tubes and end up with some pretty nice gear, so you could jump right in and spend your 1-2K (or a bit more) and be done with it. On the other hand it might not be 100% for you so starting off with a properly fixed up vintage integrated will allow you to see if it is for you. You can just about get your money back down the road if you don't like it or want to upgrade. Hi Rich, Not to hijack the thread but does that DPS-1 allow for banana plugs? I've got banana's on the end of my bi-wired AQ Slates, and I really don't want to mess with them. If not, do any of these switch boxes have 5 way binding posts on the back? I ask because I am tired of moving the cables from the backs of the VRDs to the back of my HT receiver. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rplace Posted June 27, 2006 Share Posted June 27, 2006 Mike, the Niles box does not. That might be the one complaint I have about it. Since you have to get a lot of wires (2 sets in one set out) in a small space it has tiny set screws to hold the wire in place. However once installed it is very secure. I believe it will take up to 12 guage wire. Mine has been in service for over a year now and no problems with loose wires at all. You can get them a lot cheaper then the MSRP (about 80 bucks) as well. I got mine online. Will try and find a link in a bit for you. EDIT: Wow, the price has really gone up. I know I got mine from JandR last year for $49 or so. http://www.jr.com/JRProductPage.process?Product=23405 BTW looks like the correct name is DPS 1 not DSP. My memory is failing me[:|] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted June 27, 2006 Share Posted June 27, 2006 You must of landed on some special sale! As long as I can remember back they were always near $100 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marvel Posted June 27, 2006 Share Posted June 27, 2006 I don't think Parrot hates tubes altogether. Just the 2-5 watt output ones. [] Bruce Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SET12 Posted June 27, 2006 Share Posted June 27, 2006 I don't think Parrot hates tubes altogether. Just the 2-5 watt output ones. [] Bruce Thank You tube Lovers! For giving "Me Loves Khorns" a hand here! I might add that Remember to always have a speaker connected to the tube amp when it is on! As some amps are prone to having their output transformers damaged unless their is some form of protection. Not all SETs are equal Parrot just hasn't heard one in that range yet! As Far as the 833 yes the specs are lousy but its about the music. I suggest reading the rest of the review. If the editor thought that the reviewer was totally nuts it would of never gotten its Class A recomendation. The Manufacture went after power and when you do this with this tube it requires a very high primary load impedance for its output transformer the tube is easier to manage at lower output powers giving better specs. Their are a many DIYer people around the world working with it including myself. It has a 10 volt @ 10 amps filament A 300 Watt plate rating thats 300ma. @ 1000 volts A Mu of 35 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SET12 Posted June 27, 2006 Share Posted June 27, 2006 Paul, If you liked the Cayin stuff you may like this beauty it has alot going for it including a slow turn on rectifier tube along with many nice features including remote! Its from Eastern Electric Audio Company Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebes Posted June 27, 2006 Share Posted June 27, 2006 Just wanted to say Set 12, you have some seriously cool looking gear. Major drool factor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Me Loves Khorns Posted June 27, 2006 Author Share Posted June 27, 2006 Do integrated amps like that one have phono stages, can you go directly in with the phone, or do you also need another component? By the way, thanks to all for all of your help. Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SET12 Posted June 27, 2006 Share Posted June 27, 2006 Do integrated amps like that one have phono stages, can you go directly in with the phone, or do you also need another component? By the way, thanks to all for all of your help. Paul Thank you! Paul You would use the Thorens Phono straight in into any High level input that includes tape inputs as well. Personally as a phono stage Designer your more than likely to do better with, an outboard phono stage, their are many to pick from the Thorens that I think you said is inside your table maybe very good! I once heard some Thorens Electonics at a show and thought it was perhaps some of the best solid state I had ever heard I told A High Level Thorens representative that who ever was their designer was to never let him go! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SET12 Posted June 27, 2006 Share Posted June 27, 2006 Just wanted to say Set 12, you have some seriously cool looking gear. Major drool factor. Thebes, Thank you for the compliment! What is it that caught you eye? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steamer Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 Just wanted to say Set 12, you have some seriously cool looking gear. Major drool factor. Thebes, Thank you for the compliment! What is it that caught you eye? Hello, Like Thebes I was droolin' on that pic,what caught my eye was the funky looking tube on the right with the wires connected to it.Can you expain that one please. Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SET12 Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 Steamer, Do you mean the 833 two chassis Mono Block with the wiring connected to the tube? If so the bottom of the tube are filaments connections, The top is for the grid and plate I have additiona pics if you'd like to see them! This not my amp but just an example what DIYing can do! SET12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steamer Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 Steamer, Do you mean the 833 two chassis Mono Block with the wiring connected to the tube? If so the bottom of the tube are filaments connections, The top is for the grid and plate I have additiona pics if you'd like to see them! This not my amp but just an example what DIYing can do! SET12 Yes More pics?,bring em on! Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SET12 Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 Steamer, Do you mean the 833 two chassis Mono Block with the wiring connected to the tube? If so the bottom of the tube are filaments connections, The top is for the grid and plate I have additiona pics if you'd like to see them! This not my amp but just an example what DIYing can do! SET12 Yes More pics?,bring em on! Greg This is DIY at its best and I might add 1/10 or less of manufactured prices you don't have to go to these lenths to get involed with DIYing it there is a great DIY site called www.diyaudio.com with some 50,000 members covering every topic of which I am a member of. I might add that the 833 tube is just 150$ and there are 4 versions including a graphite plate version as well a guy by the name Bob Daniellak has done a fairly simple Class A2 16 watt amp with this tube with very good results you should be able to find his schematics if you want to take a look. Power Suppy underside Underside of the 833 chassis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryC Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 Paul, If you liked the Cayin stuff you may like this beauty it has alot going for it including a slow turn on rectifier tube along with many nice features including remote! Its from Eastern Electric Audio Company Boomac's Eastern Electric CD player sounded very nice at the Wisconsin gathering last month. It went extremely well with his BAT preamp and amp, and his Cornwalls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SET12 Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 This is a photo of my own 811-10/572-10 project 10 watts peak or 5.5 watts RMS Class A2, bias is 0 volts the output transformer in this picture is a 6 lb Hammond I now use Hammonds 28 lb with this chassis for even better sonics they replaced the 6lb Iron with 11 lb version and recently have came out with a 10K primary that would mate well with a 16 watt 833 project. These amps where inspired by an 811 project featured in Glass Audio around 1996 and my first listening experiance with the Cary 805 single-ended mono blocks equiped with the 211 transmitting tube in 1991 and other than the tubes they do not resemble the original project they exceed it. The whole idea of the Glass Audio project was to give people a taste of the big Transmitting Triode Sound with out having to spend a fortune I can tell you that these were built with simple hand tools and grey box's from Hammond they now offer powder coated black box's that are very nice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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