ben. Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 Sounds to me like you've got the H running at the same levels out of the Dx38 as the 402 was? If so, that's about a 10dB drop in speaker output. So in very gross terms, you've applied 10dB of shelving EQ boost at 80Hz. It's still clean, because you haven't actually boosted anything and you've got an exceptionally clean bass unit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coytee Posted January 10, 2007 Author Share Posted January 10, 2007 Buckette: arent the Heresys rated to take 100 watts? (hope so and if not, then Colter, I never did it) Point being, if so, then I stopped at their limit and didnt continue feeding them more. Actually the FIRST time I did it, the peg on my 2102 was doing a LONG peg at 100 so I backed it off where it was later averaging between the 10/100 mark and maybe bouncing (instead of STICKING) on the 100 mark. I know the meters arent perfect but its the only gauge I have. <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /> Ben: I played around a bit more last night. I do not recall if I changed the basic attenuation used or not (something like 7 or 8 dbs to account for different amp input sensativities as well as bass bin/ 402) I THINK I kept the exact same attenuation I use for the 402 but bypassed all the PEQs I DID find that I made a bit of a mistake in that, I wasnt REALLY crossing over at 80 hz. What I found out last night, I crossed the HERESY over at 80 hz but I had forgot and left the Jub bass bin alone as I said, therefore it was crossed at 500. So the bass bin was going from its bottom to 500 and the Heresy was going from 80 to its top. Little bit of crossover between 80-500 (oops). Regardless of any of that, it DID sound good. We had it on during all of dinner last night. Now dont misunderstand me to be saying it sounds as good as the 402 on top. It doesnt. Im just saying that it sounds good for what it is (very good) and seems to add a TON of bass although I realize its addition by subtraction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldbuckster Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 Maybe the question didn't come out right, us commoners can't stay with you guys, so let me try this again; The Heresy will reach a point where it can't and won't play any louder.................I am sure the Jubilee will far exceed that point.........So, didn't the Jubilees drown out the Heresy's......................The spl to begin with must be hard to over come......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndyKlipschFan Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 Wow!!! Those are beautiful industrial Hersey's [] OMG What does Colter need them for?? I am jealous!! It's very hard to find those in that good condition.. If you find any more, let me know. Btw... adding a really good bass bin or sub to really any system will improve it a LOT to sound fuller... I bet this was very cool indeed.. Compare it to your big horns, too... PLEASE!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parrot Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 In reading your descriptions, it sounds like the gigantic 402 horn is too much for the circumstances. I bet you'd be better off with the horn that Miss Valerie has on her Jubilee. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coytee Posted January 10, 2007 Author Share Posted January 10, 2007 Maybe the question didn't come out right, us commoners can't stay with you guys, so let me try this again; Are you saying you don't know how to ask a question? [] The Heresy will reach a point where it can't and won't play any louder................. I'd say that's probably a fair statement I am sure the Jubilee will far exceed that point......... Another fair statement So, didn't the Jubilees drown out the Heresy's......................The spl to begin with must be hard to over come......... I think you asked your question (first time) perfectly fine. Perhaps the problem is in MY clarity to answer it? [*-)] Think of the weakest link theory. If the two are matched in volume, the Jub can go from 0-100 but the Heresy can go from 0-50, then as long as I go no more than 50, they're still in theoritical "lockstep" with matched (so to speak) volume. If that amount were exceeded, up to say 75, then the Heresy would perhaps blow up in smoke (oops, sorry Colter []) and the Jube would simply continue to march on within it's limits. I don't know if my theory is correct, but that's my logic on what's going on. At basic background listening levels, the Jubilee did NOT overpower the Heresy. Just added a nice floor to the sound. As the volume went up, the floor became an earthquake, but still within the basic limits of the Heresy since I was putting in between 50/100 wpc into the Heresy's (again, as per my basic meters on the amp). To be clear again, I think the main reason there was so much thunder going on, wasn't so much 'more' bass, as the reduction of higher frequency output of the Heresy (vs K402). I think bose has a 30 day 'excitement guarantee'??? perhaps that will be my next attempt... stick a bose cube on top of the Jube bass bin. After all, my wife DOES like those cute little cubes. Maybe a compromise is in order? [6] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark1101 Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 In reading your descriptions, it sounds like the gigantic 402 horn is too much for the circumstances. I bet you'd be better off with the horn that Miss Valerie has on her Jubilee. Can someone tell me what horn and driver this is on Ms. Valerie's Jubs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coytee Posted January 10, 2007 Author Share Posted January 10, 2007 I don't know, but isn't that perhaps the 510? To hijack my own thread, when I was playing with the crossover last night something dawned on me. I had never listened to the bass bins 'unfiltered'. Meaning, they have always been capped at 500 hz and I simply turned the HF horn off. Doing this, I never quite understood the great shakes people meant, when they said how high the LF cabinet will go. Last night, I shut down the Heresy, listening to only the bass bin. I then went to the crossover where it cuts out at 500 hz and started to turn the dial. I ended up having it all the way up at 20K (just so I'd know I wasn't doing any limiting). It really WAS pretty interesting to see how high the bass bins go on their own. I really didn't have any idea. Then I started to twirl the wheel and scroll down the HZ curve, cutting the signal off at an ever decreasing amount. Was kinda fun/interesting to hear the real hf part knock out, then some vocals, then some drums...only to leave some room shake vibrations. It took me doing THAT process, to finally understand just how wide these bass bins play. As for Miss Valeries horn, I don't know that I would or wouldn't be better/worse off. I like what I have and what I have is the "ultimate" package as I understand it. I don't have the issues others seem to have, about the big horn on top. In fact, I kind of like it's imposing stance. No, let me rephrase that. I DO like its imposing stance [Y] To tell you the truth, when I see this smaller horn on top, the whole package seems a bit unbalanced in its appearance to me. Kind of like seeing a big guy who is 7 feet tall, 350 pounds, yet his head is the size of a grapefruit. Just something wrong about the proportions. Like its truncated on top (the above pic) (no offense to anyone here who is 7 feet tall, 350 pounds and have a head, the size of a grapefruit...was only an analogy) [] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators dtel Posted January 10, 2007 Moderators Share Posted January 10, 2007 Darn Coytee, it looks like a girl decorated that room![] Dang! I think I just got called a sissie!! [] Just remember it is not the color of the room but the size of the horn that matters ; > Your right, sorry, Maby I should have said " the husband of the lady who decorated that room sure has a huge set of horns ! "[] Now to get back on topic................................................. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldbuckster Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 One more question, and I'll stay out of this thread...........................You don't feel that because the Jubilee is a 2 way, and the Heresy is a 3 way, that the mid range horn had something to do with what you heard, given the fact that you feel the Jubilee's weren't drowning out the Heresy's? Yes you cut out the highs to the Heresy, but that should make the mids more noticable on the Heresy's, and blend into the total sound of both speakers? If I knew the answers I wouldn't be asking these questions..............................I will now stay off this thread...................... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark1101 Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 I like what I have and what I have is the "ultimate" package as I understand it. I don't have the issues others seem to have, about the big horn on top. In fact, I kind of like it's imposing stance. No, let me rephrase that. I DO like its imposing stance [Y] I agree. You have the PERFECT speakers for YOU...until Klipsch builds something bigger for home use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark1101 Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 I like what I have and what I have is the "ultimate" package as I understand it. I don't have the issues others seem to have, about the big horn on top. In fact, I kind of like it's imposing stance. No, let me rephrase that. I DO like its imposing stance [Y] I agree. You have the PERFECT speakers for YOU...until Klipsch builds something bigger for home use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark1101 Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 I like what I have and what I have is the "ultimate" package as I understand it. I don't have the issues others seem to have, about the big horn on top. In fact, I kind of like it's imposing stance. No, let me rephrase that. I DO like its imposing stance [Y] I agree. You have the PERFECT speakers for YOU...until Klipsch builds something bigger for home use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark1101 Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 I like what I have and what I have is the "ultimate" package as I understand it. I don't have the issues others seem to have, about the big horn on top. In fact, I kind of like it's imposing stance. No, let me rephrase that. I DO like its imposing stance [Y] I agree. You have the PERFECT speakers for YOU...until Klipsch builds something bigger for home use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parrot Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 Mark1101, I'm not sure I'm following you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark1101 Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 Wow...sorry about that! The forum performance is very inconsistent at various times and posts just hang. You can't tell if they are going to "go" or not. So I guess it went when I thought it would not. Sorry about that. It was jsut supposed to be 1 post. Do you know what horn and driver are on Ms. Valeries Jubs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest " " Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 "I think bose has a 30 day 'excitement guarantee'??? perhaps that will be my next attempt... stick a bose cube on top of the Jube bass bin. After all, my wife DOES like those cute little cubes. Maybe a compromise is in order?" Can you put those little 1" ipod speakers on the list as well.......might need a arrow or something pointing to them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coytee Posted January 10, 2007 Author Share Posted January 10, 2007 One more question, and I'll stay out of this thread...........................You don't feel that because the Jubilee is a 2 way, and the Heresy is a 3 way, that the mid range horn had something to do with what you heard, given the fact that you feel the Jubilee's weren't drowning out the Heresy's? Yes you cut out the highs to the Heresy, but that should make the mids more noticable on the Heresy's, and blend into the total sound of both speakers? If I knew the answers I wouldn't be asking these questions..............................I will now stay off this thread...................... Bucky, Bucky Bucky... First off... no need to stay out of this thread. The thread was started on a lark and a moment of silliness. To answer your second question about Jube being 2 way and Heresy 3 way, being drowned out by the Jubes... I have not put a SINGLE thought into that as I simply wanted to see how it would sound. I'm not suggesting anyone do this (though it clearly bolsters the sound of the Heresy's lol) I didn't cut any highs to the Heresy's. In fact, they were fed a unfiltered signal over 80 hz and I let their passive do all their internal crossing. Let me try to repaint the picture of what I did: I already biamp, crossing the Jubilees over at 500 hz. I removed the K402 and replaced it with the Heresy's, plugging them into the same amp (MC-2102) that the 402 is plugged into. I then went into the activve crossive and took the spot where the 402 is fed (500 hz and up) and LOWERED it to 80 hz. So, the Heresy's were now getting unfiltered full signal from 80 hz upward, allowing their internal passive to finish the work. What I failed to think about and therefor failed to do, was go to my bass bins (which were ALSO crossed over at 500 hz) and REDUCE the 500 hz down to 80 hz. Meaning, the bass bins were driving from 0-500 hz and the Heresy's were going from 80-?? and I had overlap from 80-500 hz of the bass bins and Heresy's. The net effect to my simpleton ears, it sounded pretty good. Doesn't compete with a 402 on top at all. compared to a stock Heresy though, it was like pumping it full of steroids with a LOT more bottom end (duh!!). The mids/highs on the Heresy simply don't have the db's that the same frequencies do on the 402 so those bands were not as prominent as when using the 402. I think THAT is the main reason why the bass sounded so much more pronounced. The 402's seem to be able to put you much closer to the music than the Heresy's (I think that goes back to Roy's bubble talk??). This isn't something that was done with any serious intent/designs on my part... I simply wanted to play. If I had a Cornwall, I'd probably try the same. Hmm...now that I say that, I realize I have 2 LaScalas that have no deep bass to speak of.... [*-)] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coytee Posted January 10, 2007 Author Share Posted January 10, 2007 Can you put those little 1" ipod speakers on the list as well.......might need a arrow or something pointing to them. That's funny lol. I like your new avatar too! Too bad I didn't bonk you on the head when you were here... You would have never been found lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrestonTom Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 Wow...sorry about that! The forum performance is very inconsistent at various times and posts just hang. You can't tell if they are going to "go" or not. So I guess it went when I thought it would not. Sorry about that. It was jsut supposed to be 1 post. Do you know what horn and driver are on Ms. Valeries Jubs? Mark, I am assuming that horn was K510. I think that has been confirmed by Roy Delgado on other threads. HOWEVER, looking at the pictures posted by Shawn where is making measures with the K510 and various drivers, I am not so sure. Shawn posted some pictures that show the K510 as a little guy relative to some Altec horns (which are almost the width of a K-Horn Cabinet). However, the pic that Parrott displayed show a horn that is wider than the Jub bass bin's front piece. I have not seen the Jub and perhaps it is narower than I assumed. Or perhaps this is an optical illusion. Or perhaps my memory is shot. In either case, the horn is substantially smaller than the K402. -Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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