STL Posted December 17, 2001 Share Posted December 17, 2001 http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?&PartNumber=299-184&DID=7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilH Posted December 17, 2001 Share Posted December 17, 2001 These drivers did not come from our factory. They are most likely units that did not pass our QC specifications and instead of being destroyed like they were supposed to be, wound up in someone's hands. PhilH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike stehr Posted December 17, 2001 Share Posted December 17, 2001 P.E. claims that there is no problems from their measurements on the drivers. For what possible general reasons would they not pass through Quality Assurance at Klipsch? Damn nice woofer for P.E.'s price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilH Posted December 17, 2001 Share Posted December 17, 2001 All manufacturers have parts that they reject, just a way of life. Not every produced part meets the specs they are supposed to. Those parts are either sent back to the supplier for credit or disposed of by the manufacturer. Any separate RF-7 woofer available out there (including ones that recently appeared on eBay)that is not purchased directly from Klipsch falls into that category. If I were trying to sell those, I would probably tell you they were fine also. PhilH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STL Posted December 17, 2001 Author Share Posted December 17, 2001 Good points PhilH! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Warren Posted December 17, 2001 Share Posted December 17, 2001 It seems odd to me that reject level is high enough that that a high volume dealer like Parts Express can market and sell them as a stand alone part number. Why is is it unreasonable to assume that your woofer supplier is just "breaking out" the woofer and selling direct? As a manufacturer, your driver rqmnts are strict because you need consistent results from driver to driver to insure replacability and consitent results. This makes perfect sense too me. For the DIYer, these rqmnts are moot since the box is designed around measured T/S parameters (not the other way around). You are implying that something devious ("smarmy") is going on at Parts Express, why? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dome Posted December 17, 2001 Share Posted December 17, 2001 I dont think thats what he is saying at all. It says right on the PE webpage that the woofers were rejected for some reason or another.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WMcD Posted December 17, 2001 Share Posted December 17, 2001 I believe Phil can only speak in reasonable assumptions. And here he is reasonable. Maybe they meet the specs listed by P.E. or maybe they don't. If they don't, the buyer's gripe is with P.E. alone. Which is the real point. I've bought Pyramid woofers from P.E. They were certainly dead on the specs published by P.E. and presumably published based on information from Pyramid. Presumably if I need tech support, more info, design suggestions, Pyramid will provide it. I've got no gripe with P.E. on those types of transactions. But that is not quite the situation here. P.E. is leading us to the conclusion that the units meet Klipsch specs and Q.C. But they stop short of saying that. Perhaps the units do. P.E. is certainly not saying that Klipsch warrants the specific hardware. That is a point which Phil could have made. Not that I speak for him. Gil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ESOTERIC MAN Posted December 17, 2001 Share Posted December 17, 2001 I Was told by Parts Express, Klipsch rejected because the fill rate or sell through was not what they expected so they did not have a need for more woofers they could not sell.... The economy has ALOT of factories looking for ways to move product hence Parts Express.... Buy them, they are the identical woofers as Klipsch has in stock!!! EM www.noav.com ------------------ NO EQ'S ALLOWED Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Warren Posted December 18, 2001 Share Posted December 18, 2001 If what ESOTERIC MAN is saying is fact, then these are factory overstocks that the LLC released as a skidded lot of 150 pcs to PE. If I'm to believe the LLC, these woofers were tested at the factory, rejected and sent back to the supplier. The supplier has a contractual agreement with the LLC to destroy them. Instead, the supplier violated terms of a contractual agreement and sold them to Parts Express. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soundog Posted December 18, 2001 Share Posted December 18, 2001 Something doesn't make sense here. If Klipsch is selling overstock - perfectly good woofers used in popular new speakers that are widely distributed - then 150 if purchased by parts express for say 50% of what they are selling for would net Klipsch a big $7500 or less. Now subtract Klipschs cost, shipping etc. and its either a loss or a wash entry for Klipsch. Come on why wouldn't they hold on to 150 rather than cheapen their speakers and their name? I think either: they were sub-standard and returned to be destroyed OR the supplier was overstocked and made a "side" deal with parts express and maybe others or they were stolen and sold. Anyway you cut it I bet Klipsch's lawyers are at work. ------------------ Soundog's HT Systems This message has been edited by soundog on 12-18-2001 at 08:05 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Cornell Posted December 18, 2001 Share Posted December 18, 2001 If you ask me, id say theres a thief, or con artist at a Klipsch factory, sneeking a sale of the woofers to parts express! If they have a quaity to sell, then they have a connection somewhere, and what good is the woofer, without Klipschs design! I really wonder if the logo is still on the magnet! Regards Jim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BobG Posted December 18, 2001 Share Posted December 18, 2001 The drivers in question are NOT 'overstock' sold off by Klipsch. In fact, the RF-7 is taxing our ability to produce, being even more popular than our forecast. The drivers have been diverted, and must be considered gray market in the truest sense of that term. Buy them at your own risk. If you choose to do so, you are furthering a nefarious endeavor. While we take it as a compliment that people wish to buy our parts, we take very seriously any effort which may tarnish our brand. In this case, we DO have our lawyers working on it. Buyer beware. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vacs2000 Posted December 18, 2001 Share Posted December 18, 2001 I donnot really want to be inpolite or ofend anybody but following this disussion, which by the way I have no jugdement, it remind me of my big surprise when I wanted to get some diaphragms for my K77 tweeters. If I remember well ~70$ from Klipsch, 25$ from EV. Is this also a question of QA of the parts I doubt and really it would be an insulte on our intelectual ability. So I guess companies to survive has to sell more expensive than the manufacturers and there is nothing bizarre in this. ------------------ --------------------- Fisher 400-CX pre-amp Fisher 100 (EL37) monoblocks (3) Fisher 101R tuner Fisher 100-MPX Sony SCD-333ES Ampex 1260 reel to rell Garrard 401/SME3012R/Grado Speakers... ------------------------- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Warren Posted December 18, 2001 Share Posted December 18, 2001 I'll bite my tongue... This message has been edited by John Warren on 12-18-2001 at 08:28 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ESOTERIC MAN Posted December 18, 2001 Share Posted December 18, 2001 First Monster Cable, Now this.... Klipsch is really showing why Bose survives. Marketing and PROFIT from followers like us.. Have you guys seen there is also another site that is selling the same woofers for $65.00 (APEX JR.)!!!! GUYS WE NEED TO DEMAND A BETTER PRICE FOR KLIPSCH, LIKE SVS DOES....... KLIPSCH LISTEN UP--WE ARE WATCHING YOU!!! Peace, Steve www.noav.com ------------------ NO EQ'S ALLOWED Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STL Posted December 18, 2001 Author Share Posted December 18, 2001 Okay now people...I'm going to surprise myself and stick up for Klipsch. Klipsch is producing a fine product (or at lest my KGs and KLFs are) and last time I checked we were a free, capitalistic country -- so they can charge whatever they want. From a business sense, they have to set their prices low enough to keep the sales figures good and high enough to make a profit (else why are they in business). This means their speakers are going to cost more than just totaling up the speaker drivers & parts -- you have to factor their R&D in there as well as salaries of all their workers and management. If you don't like Klipsch pricing them don't buy their product...it's that simple. Any comparisions between Klipsch and Bose are TOTALLY off base in my opinion!!! Bose is 99% marketing with little substance. Klipsch is mostly substance -- albeit I see the company changing some putting more emphasis on marketing (at the expense of substance?) than they used to...but that's going to happen as a company grows. The only constant is change... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
decibel man Posted December 19, 2001 Share Posted December 19, 2001 All of the above are valid opinions and good insight. I think I may still have to go check out a couple of these babies to see if we can get to the bottom of this debate. I have been to the parts express warehouse a few times to pick up the occasional parts for my shop speakers and other projects. If there is nothing wrong with these speakers the only gripe I would have with Klipsch is the price on their replacement parts. If I paid $70 a driver for my RF-3 drivers and those are only $700 speakers. What the heck would the price be on the RF-7 drivers? I can't seem to find the parts listing on this site anymore. My problem is that we bought the speakers from Klipsch and had a problem that required replacement parts (in my case a careless mover). Then to reward the consumer for purchasing a Klipsch product Klipsch sticks it to them if they need replacement parts. I get it if the parts are not in production because you then have warehousing and inventory cost to cover, but that is a small amount on current parts. I also work for a manufacturer (we do food and pharma ingredients) and I have had problems where the customer ruins a load of product at no fault to our company. In a case of this nature I will sell them replacement product at cut price if it is available. I help them out when I can for being loyal to our organization. I am getting tired and I am starting to babble (sp?) so I will end it here. If I can get down there in the next week or two I will follow up with a post. Good night all! JT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boa12 Posted December 19, 2001 Share Posted December 19, 2001 from my experience i think drivers from klipsch are pretty reasonably priced. hey it includes shipping then again fortunately i haven't been a big buyer of them for replacements. doubt klipsch makes a huge overall profit on their parts biz. especially if that includes parts we get under warranty. i can say that klipsch over the years has been pretty generous replacing under warranty some of my drivers that were maybe pushed beyond reasonable limits they even sent me a new foot I broke on an rf-3 for free. would like to see the return of the parts list to this site soon. & maybe it'll be new & improved. ------------------ My Home Systems Page This message has been edited by boa12 on 12-19-2001 at 01:55 AM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Cornell Posted December 20, 2001 Share Posted December 20, 2001 There is a difference doing markett tradig on products, knowing thats the plan, then markets exploiting one companys products with no (know abouts)! I do not blame klipsch, for any wrong doing whatsoever, i think the monster deal is subpurb! EV is our parts for our old heritage, thru klipsch, or EV, if klipsch, the parts are adapted to fit the original design! Prabably in wattage, to fit the speaker, or to fit the crossover frequency better! The Klipsch company is the enclosure design, other han that, most drivers are made by another companys, klipsch doesnt make the drivers! Klipsch, will design them to have them made, so the woofers there on parts express, were prabably stolen by the manufacturer! OUT of klipsch, knowledge, and hands! Go get em Bob.G Regards Jim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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