60th Anniversary Khorns vs La Scala IIs etc.

[mr-b]

Hi

I was a victim of the recent floods in the UK and my La Scalas were
unfortunately caught up in it (it appears that they don't float very well ...) - but thankfully my insurers will pay for new replacements i.e.
La Scala IIs or else contribute their value towards something else e.g. some 60th
Anniv Khorns! So my dilemma is what to purchase!

I already had acquired some '88 Khorns (AK-2 xovers)
but although I haven't had time to test them out properly, I think I
may have some room/positioning issues with areas of boomy bass etc. Hence I thought that the 60th
Anniv Khorns with their enclosed backs might be an ideal sol'n to this. I definitely prefer the extended bass response of the Khorns over my old LSs, although I realise that in itself, could be showing up room problems.

My room is small by US standards - L 15' 4" x W 11' 7" x H 9' 9" but is part of an open plan layout with a large opening in the long wall (L 8'4" x H 7' 5") to
a long hall. The speakers are positioned on the corners of the short wall (they just didn't
sound right on the long wall). I've no idea how the opening would
affect the acoustic mode response calculations etc. e.g. do I measure
the room to include the hall portion too? Should I just give up on
Khorns as being too large for my small room's acoustics? However the Khorns' cabinets are rather less intrusive in the room than the LS.

After some research on the new Heritage speakers, I've
seen some opinions that the current models may not have as good xovers as
my '88 Khorn (AK-5 in 60th Anniv, not sure about LS II) and the same may
apply to the drivers - and so I might be better off upgrading my '88 Khorns (or buy, brace and upgrade some older LSs).

Of course the issue with this approach is that the insurers won't
contribute towards DIY upgrades (plus I have zero woodworking skills
for adding backs to the Khorns). ;-)

So what should I buy for best quality in my room? Any advice gratefully received.

[oldbuckster]

The 60th Anniversary's are a little over-kill, don't you think ? If you liked the La Scala's why not replace them ?

[Coytee]

The 60th Anniversary's are a little over-kill, don't you think ? If you liked the La Scala's why not replace them ?

Pay no heed to Robbie... I think he's off his meds now... [6]

My 2 cents?

If you already had LaScalas you aren't stepping up THAT much more if you go Khorns. Doing that will have the side benefit of actually saving you some floor space as the Khorns tuck into the corner(s). I presume you know that. They certainly won't have any issue filling your room with sound, will they!!

If you decide to go that route, you might as well look into the Jubilee as it was originally designed to replace the Khorn. Just do a search here (actually, maybe do two) on "Jubilee" and "chronicles". I mean...if you're going to stuff LaScalas in there and contemplate stuffing Khorns into there then you might as well investigate all your choices and do it once.

If you are near London (I noticed it only saying "UK") we might be able to get you in touch with someone over there who has the ONLY pair of Jubilees (that I know of) outside the USA. He too was originally looking at the new LaScalas and after doing some research, decided he wanted to go with the Jubes.

Lemme know and I can send your email address to him or vice versa & we can see what he says.

I'd bet lunch that if you're near him he'd love to share them.

[Guest " "]

mr-b

According to a very reliable source, the 60's have AK-4's which have been upgraded with premium componets.

The comparisons you are trying to make takes some really creative thinking.  Best bet is to listen to the various speakers and look at them in a home setting and come to your own conclusion.

There is a significant price difference between 60th anniversary Khorns compared to Jubilee's, regular khorns, and LaScala II's.

[mr-b]

Useful info - thanks. Anyway, you can never have too much "over-kill" ;-)

Sorry if I've posed too many issues to consider - the main problem is that I cannot listen to these new models beforehand since there are no UK Klipsch dealers! So I have to try and extrapolate my experiences of the older models using others' thoughts and experiences.

I like the La Scalas, apart from the lack of low-end (which the LS II seems to partially address) and the cab size.

The 60s look great and have the enclosed backs, but if I'm paying that much over normal Khorns it would be nice to get the best drivers and xovers as well (which seems to be the matter of some debate) and not have to spend even more on upgrades later on. What exactly are the "premium components"?

Also I gather the 60s were not intended for the US market (which seems rather odd)? Has anyone compared them against old/current model Khorns?

The Jubilees are just too big and industrial-looking to be acceptable at home (although I couldn't find any dimensions nor supplier details) although I'm sure they'd be very (too) compelling to hear!

[oldbuckster]

Ever consider the newer Cornwalls ?..Jubilee's are kinda'...AH, the medications are starting to work, what was I writing about?.[8-)]

[Coytee]

Buckie... in spite of what I say to people about you...I really do think you're pretty cool!

[^o)]

[dhtman]

Mr-b, Richard has made contact and I have emailed you at the address you gave to him. You really don't want to make a decision before hearing the Jubilees. They aren't just another pair of speakers!

Richard, you could have safely bet far more than lunch!

[scott0527]

Useful info - thanks. Anyway, you can never have too much "over-kill" ;-)

Sorry if I've posed too many issues to consider - the main problem is that I cannot listen to these new models beforehand since there are no UK Klipsch dealers! So I have to try and extrapolate my experiences of the older models using others' thoughts and experiences.

I like the La Scalas, apart from the lack of low-end (which the LS II seems to partially address) and the cab size.

The 60s look great and have the enclosed backs, but if I'm paying that much over normal Khorns it would be nice to get the best drivers and xovers as well (which seems to be the matter of some debate) and not have to spend even more on upgrades later on. What exactly are the "premium components"?

Also I gather the 60s were not intended for the US market (which seems rather odd)? Has anyone compared them against old/current model Khorns?

The Jubilees are just too big and industrial-looking to be acceptable at home (although I couldn't find any dimensions nor supplier details) although I'm sure they'd be very (too) compelling to hear!

I think the 60's were just not well receieved in the US market by the HiFi dealers who seem to crave smaller Home Theater speakers and/or a more "boutique" brand name such as Wilson. Also, from what I have seen, I can't imagine wanting to upgrade anything on the 60th anniversary Khorns. Let me back up, what makes you think, if your were to buy a new set of Khorns(regular or 60th) that you would need to upgrade components?

[Coytee]

Ralph...I'm searching for the thread where you posted some pics... can you find it quicker & copy it here for him??

[oldbuckster]

Buckie... in spite of what I say to people about you...I really do think you're pretty cool!

[^o)]

OH OH, Are my ear lobes safe ????

[mr-b]

I think the 60's were just not well receieved in the US market by the HiFi dealers who seem to crave smaller Home Theater speakers and/or a more "boutique" brand name such as Wilson. Also, from what I have seen, I can't imagine wanting to upgrade anything on the 60th anniversary Khorns. Let me back up, what makes you think, if your were to buy a new set of Khorns(regular or 60th) that you would need to upgrade components?

Yes, strange indeed. I'd have thought that the US would be Klipsch heartland - you've certainly got the bigger rooms to accommodate them. ;-)

re: upgrading the current Khorns, I've seen that analysis of the AK-4 (and which I guess is the basis of the AK-5 in the 60) has shown some 'weird' measurements compared to the previous ones, and AK-4s seem to divide opinion. Also that the newer K55-X squawker isn't as good as the K55-M that is in my current '88 Khorns. Of course this is just what I've surmised from scanning the forums etc., I'm not able to actually hear what they sound like for myself.

[Coytee]

Ralph, I found it...

http://forums.klipsch.com/forums/1/856373/ShowThread.aspx

Bruno...you can read the entire thread or skip to page 14 where Ralph's pictures start

[DrWho]

FWIW, the Jubilee is about 6" taller than the khorn and fits pretty much within the same footprint.

As far as Lascala II versus Khorn...for a dedicated 2-channel listening environment (without subwoofer) and being forced to select between the two, I would go with the Khorn. Depending on the genre of music being played, I might also consider the Cornwall III. In my opinion, Lascala II + proper stereo subwoofage will beat the Khorn.

[cjgeraci]

For me, its hard to quantify whether a LaScala II w/ sub v. a Khorn is better or would "beat" the other because the bass response of each speaker sounds so different It comes down to personal preference.

That being said, maybe I'll dissent for a different reason. Given the size of your room, I think that Khorns and/or Jubs would be overkill. In my experience, Khorns need a larger room to breathe, and while I have not heard Jubs, I am not convinced that putting them in a smaller-sized room is necessarily desirable given their design.

As a result, I would opt for LaScala IIs.

Carl.

[Coytee]

Carl...the voice of reason is NOT allowed on this forum...

[]

[ClaudeJ1]

FWIW, the Jubilee is about 6" taller than the khorn and fits pretty much within the same footprint.

As far as Lascala II versus Khorn...for a dedicated 2-channel listening environment (without subwoofer) and being forced to select between the two, I would go with the Khorn. Depending on the genre of music being played, I might also consider the Cornwall III. In my opinion, Lascala II + proper stereo subwoofage will beat the Khorn.

I'll go one better than LaScalla II's. I have 77 Khorns (original owner), will all new film capacitors on the mid with custom 3rd order Xover on JBL 2404H twweters WITH twin subs. I guarantee I can beat La Scala II's with that. The only way I could improve this is with Jubilees Bass Bins and 402/K69's in the corners, but I would sill have subs to get me to 20 Hz and fatten the low end around 60 hz. down in a smaller room. That would be the ultimate Klipsch high end in my book. Lowest distortion, most detail, highest output with any amplifier.

Aesthetics can easily be improved with veneers or speakers hidden behind a large corner grill cloth..............it's all about the best sound and that is what I would do if I had insurance money to work with.

[Guest " "]

Great contest..... kd6 (electrovice aristrocrat) cabs with some k-49 woofers, k-1132 mid drivers, k-70-g tweeters, ALK es networks.

[DrWho]

That being said, maybe I'll dissent for a different reason. Given the size of your room, I think that Khorns and/or Jubs would be overkill. In my experience, Khorns need a larger room to breathe, and while I have not heard Jubs, I am not convinced that putting them in a smaller-sized room is necessarily desirable given their design.

Actually, the point at which the sound waves sum into a single coherant wavefront should occur sooner with the Jubilee due to it being a 2-way and having much better controlled polars. You gotta get 30 feet back from the lascala for this to occur. I'd say it's probably around 10-15 feet for the Jubilee.

I think many see the large tweeter for the Jubilee and instantly are reminded of long throw horn designs. I would agree with your assessment if that were true, but it's actually NOT a long throw horn. [] The size is there only for low frequency pattern control.

[Islander]

That being said, maybe I'll dissent for a different reason. Given the size of your room, I think that Khorns and/or Jubs would be overkill. In my experience, Khorns need a larger room to breathe, and while I have not heard Jubs, I am not convinced that putting them in a smaller-sized room is necessarily desirable given their design.

Actually, the point at which the sound waves sum into a single coherant wavefront should occur sooner with the Jubilee due to it being a 2-way and having much better controlled polars. You gotta get 30 feet back from the lascala for this to occur. I'd say it's probably around 10-15 feet for the Jubilee.

I think many see the large tweeter for the Jubilee and instantly are reminded of long throw horn designs. I would agree with your assessment if that were true, but it's actually NOT a long throw horn. [] The size is there only for low frequency pattern control.

In regards to minimum listening distance for coherent wavefront, wouldn't that vary with different crossovers? Would a gentle slope crossover allow the driver wavefronts to coalesce at a shorter distance than a steep slope one would?