whatever55 Posted March 1, 2009 Share Posted March 1, 2009 Greg. You are simply a craftsman. It thrills me to see all those beautiful creations after all those emails and the phone calls. You didn't give up despite the frustration of "visualizing" the build and the challenge of seeing this in 3-D. People can talk the theory but to put it together is different. You have now become dangerous with a vision to create the midhorn of your liking. I am betting that you will come up with another one as you now have a taste of new design verses clean-up the gold standard with veneer exotica. Now you do both. I am a long die hard Klipsch fan as you are. And yet I as you can ask for more of a great thing. I'm certain those midhorns are gonna sing....pure tractix. I will say again PURE TRACTRIX. Also 2" drivers to fit in the khorn tophat. You just stepped into a new area....... Congrats..... jc Thanks JC, I couldn't have done it without you. They really do sound wonderful, I'm very happy. Thanks to Gothover too, for some really good tips on the construction. I already have a plan for the next horn. Top secret. Greg Could that be something to help "the pug ugly" be a little more WAF ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted March 1, 2009 Share Posted March 1, 2009 Man, that's so cool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BE36 Posted March 1, 2009 Share Posted March 1, 2009 How moch for a set of horns only (with out the Tweeter hole, mouningt on top of La Scalas)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bhendrix Posted March 1, 2009 Share Posted March 1, 2009 Beautiful work, Greg!!What is the depth of the horn with the driver? I wonder if those wouldn't make a perfect "top hat" HF section to sit on top of a stock Cornwall (using woofer only) with a BEC crossover to make CornScalas? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg928gts Posted March 1, 2009 Author Share Posted March 1, 2009 How moch for a set of horns only (with out the Tweeter hole, mouningt on top of La Scalas)? Please email me gregroberts@roadrunner.com Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg928gts Posted March 1, 2009 Author Share Posted March 1, 2009 Beautiful work, Greg!! What is the depth of the horn with the driver? I wonder if those wouldn't make a perfect "top hat" HF section to sit on top of a stock Cornwall (using woofer only) with a BEC crossover to make CornScalas? About 18". I think a tractrix horn could be made to fit in the stock Cornwall cabinet. A larger mid horn cutout would be necessary, or maybe cut out a large section and then install a new motorboard to relocate the tweeter. I'd have to look at it and figure it out. I don't know if there'd be much of a market though, kind of an expensive upgrade for Cornwalls. I should just start building Cornscalas with a wooden tractrix horn and sell them. I could do the double woofer Cornscalas too, with a large mid horn in a two-way configuration. I can do any of this stuff, the drawback for most people is that I'm expensive. Although I haven't been able to figure that out, because I only charge $35 per hour for shop time. Ever price out custom work at a cabinet shop? Maybe I'm just slow! Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg928gts Posted March 1, 2009 Author Share Posted March 1, 2009 Man, that's so cool. You might have to get some Khorns again. [] Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted March 1, 2009 Share Posted March 1, 2009 Too much hassle for my room. I'm stuck with the short wall and false corners -- as good as it sounded, I don't think I'll be going there again. I'm primarily HT now and need the center channel. Though I'm not the biggest fan of large driver bass reflex designs, cost considerations make the CornScala type solution rather appealing. I also find some of the Beyma coaxials intriquing -- as well as the Great Plains 604-8H-II. I only have 13 feet across the front and Plasma to support -- it really narrows down the options. I'm just one guy though -- most aren't saddled with that problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg928gts Posted March 3, 2009 Author Share Posted March 3, 2009 Almost all painted now. Grills are next. Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkalsi Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg928gts Posted March 6, 2009 Author Share Posted March 6, 2009 I just had someone tell me they thought a 2" driver would be overkill for their home system. I couldn't disagree more - unless the system is a smaller system to begin with. But for Khorns, La Scalas, and even Cornwalls, the larger format driver is a huge improvement over the stock K55. Think of it as headroom in an amplifier. The larger driver is working effortlessly to produce the same volume as the smaller driver, and the resulting sound is free of the constricted, edgy sound that I endured for decades from the K400/K55. If anyone here thinks a 2" mid driver is overkill, THINK AGAIN! It's not, it's as natural as having a 15" driver for the bass, and in fact is a much better match. My Khorns right now are singing beautifully. All of the upgrades are working together extremely well. My woofers have broken in now too. I'm finding myself having a big smile on my face listening to music these days. My friend Derek came over to listen. He's the one who doesn't really like horn speakers, but he's very good at giving me constructive feedback about my system/s. I set him up with a particular song, at just the right volume - all he had to do was press the "play" button. I left him alone in the living room to listen to that song, and when it was over he came out with a smile on his face too. "Really nice" he said, "They don't sound like horn speakers anymore". Those are good compliments from him, and he's right, they really don't have those ugly characteristics that traditionally, even the best (Khorns) horn speakers tend to have. Getting close to having a webpage done to sell these. Coming soon. Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 As Dennis has pointed out several times in the past, a two inch driver has four times the surface area and 10x less distortion. It's a no brainer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark1101 Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 I've been using 2" HF drivers for almost 2 years now...........in a 17W x 26L x 11H room.......and yes, this is what you want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cjgeraci Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 Truly works of art that likely sound even better than they look. Carl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAKO Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 Been useing 2" drivers for 40 years now,,, All that is left is a good quality horn like these. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr_eric_s Posted March 9, 2009 Share Posted March 9, 2009 I'd like to second the suggestion of looking into a Cornwall tractrix upgrade. Khorns are never going to work in my room, and I'm never going to be handy enough to build Cornscalas, but I surely would like to partake of the improvement to the midrange you are describing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crossman Posted March 9, 2009 Share Posted March 9, 2009 Been useing 2" drivers for 40 years now,,, All that is left is a good quality horn like these. Which 2" drivers (brand name) have you been using? Have you been using them on a Khorn and if so how did you modify and what type of crossover are you using? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crossman Posted March 9, 2009 Share Posted March 9, 2009 A crossover is just a dividing network and needs to provide the proper attenuation levels to "balance" the output of the drivers. The Type A is a simple electrical first order, and people use modified versions of that network to drive all kinds of things. I sure hope Al didn't say they're "not really crossovers", which would be an idiotic statement. The BMS is a very well behaved driver, and would undoubtably sound very good with a low order filter and little if any correction. I've been trying to follow the crossover theme in this post but remain somewhat confused. According to "some" the Khorn A or AA crossovers will not work with the BMS driver but I didn't perceive a definitive reason as to "why". Dean, am I understanding you to say that the A or AA crossovers will work relatively well because I would like to take this upgrade in steps instead of one big commitment that I might regret. Lets see: Horns - $799.00 + shipping / BMS Drivers - $967.00 / ALK Crossovers $540.00 + shipping. Then throw in some Beyma tweeters for $300.00 and before long we will be out of the chump change category. Don't get me wrong - I could and would slap down the cash today if I thought it would make a noticable improvement in the sound of my Khorns. However I can't afford the complete upgrade and a divorce at the same time. Crossman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg928gts Posted March 9, 2009 Author Share Posted March 9, 2009 Lets see: Horns - $799.00 + shipping / BMS Drivers - $967.00 / ALK Crossovers $540.00 + shipping. Then throw in some Beyma tweeters for $300.00 and before long we will be out of the chump change category. Don't get me wrong - I could and would slap down the cash today if I thought it would make a noticable improvement in the sound of my Khorns. If you spent the money on all those upgrades, it would definately be more than a noticeable improvement. It would totally transform your Khorns into a much better sounding pair of speakers in every way. I have first hand experience with these things. The crossover issue. With the A and AA networks, the K55 is allowed to roll off on its own, there are no components that cut the high frequencies from the mid driver. This is why Al said that the A and AA networks are really just balancing networks, not crossovers, because they work with and depend on the characteristics of the particular stock drivers used in the Khorn. If you put a new midrange driver in place of the K55 that has a frequency response that goes above what the K55 does, you will have two drivers (the mid and the tweet) producing the same frequencies, which obviously would not be good. Also, different brands of drivers have different impedences and efficiencies, so the network must account for those differences to balance the output of the midrange driver to the rest of the speaker. The amount of balancing that can be done with the stock A and AA networks is limited. The Universal network has the ability to compensate for the differences by offering many different attenuations for the mid driver, a very important feature with the two-inch driver upgrade. Hopefully this explains the crossover issue a little better. Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg928gts Posted March 9, 2009 Author Share Posted March 9, 2009 Horns - $799.00 + shipping / BMS Drivers - $967.00 / ALK Crossovers $540.00 + shipping. Then throw in some Beyma tweeters for $300.00 and before long we will be out of the chump change category. Expensive - yes, but less so than Jubilees and a lot of other speakers out there. I'll get shot down for saying this, even though I own a pair of Klipsch Jubilees and have carefully listened to them in comparison with other speakers I have, but my current Khorn configuration sounds much better than my Jubilees. The only thing I miss from the Jubilee is the powerful, in-your-face bass output. If I only listened to Jazz or Classical music, the Khorns would be better for me all around, but I like to kick it out once in a while, and the Jubilees have the power to do that, more so than my Khorns. Jubilee bass is totally different in the way it is delivered into the room. The voicing of the Jubilee is more bass-heavy than the Khorn. But in the top end, the smoothness and effortless articulation from the V-Trac, Beyma, ALK combination is way ahead. I do NOT have this same opinion about the stock Khorn. It's that much of a difference. Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.