Moderators dtel Posted January 6, 2012 Moderators Share Posted January 6, 2012 You know I'm just kidding,, but it sucks when you go; that's not the way it looks in the picture. OK you now have me having one of those moments, my pic looks different,[] not counting the ugly access door opening i made. What did i do Tater ? Guess it does not matter how the drivers are mounted as long as they are wired right. [:$] The first time I tried mine I had them wired wrong, gave up until the next day when I caught the problem. It just does not have any output with the drivers fighting each other. [:S] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 Pete, Having gone over to the dark side a year ago, most of my speakers are actively crossed, so I use pro amps exclusively these days. I know some folks don't like Behringer amps, but I have had great success with the ep4000 line. I currently have 5 of them! They are inexpensive and have way more power than you will ever use. BTW, I use a Behringer DCX2496 to contol the signal going to the sub amp. Your QSC quality will be wasted on the subs and you will likely miss them if not on your mains. I think your Carver, even if bridged will limit your headroom here and there, but will work of course. You might compare the price of a plate amp, with getting a DCX crossover and an ep4000 or something similar to that you will have all you need to control two subs. If you build a twin, you will need two plate amps etc. Plenty of that stuff on the used market as well. I'm partial to having the active setup. You will always be able to use it for other projects if you don't like the 'tater' project. If you decide to sell your Carver, you will be out of pocket very little and have all the power you will ever need for this or other projects. Matter of fact, I'm about to replace my main Hafler amps with a QSC PLX2 which I recently got and probably another ep4000 for my center channel. I have enjoyed watching your project. I had a nice time with my build, although I made my share of mistakes as well. You are so close....can't wait for the results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators dtel Posted January 6, 2012 Moderators Share Posted January 6, 2012 I use a small amp in comparison, a ADA 250 plate amp from my last sub from Adaire Audio, I think it's only like 180 wpc, I can't remember and it has nothing marked on it. Even with this little amp It's set at less than 1/2 volume. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete H Posted January 6, 2012 Author Share Posted January 6, 2012 You know I'm just kidding,, but it sucks when you go; that's not the way it looks in the picture. Ok you now have me having one of those moments, my pic looks different, not counting the ugly access door opening i made. What did i do Tater ? OK, so were you not going to tell me that the access door is in the wrong location until I put it there? Follow Rudy's build in regards to the access door because I just figured out today that the prints show an access door that is useless. The more I think about this, the more I think about mounting the top panel with screws and gasket material, but who knows; there's no clue what I'll decide tomorrow. At least you moved the access door to begging with so you're headed in the right direction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators dtel Posted January 6, 2012 Moderators Share Posted January 6, 2012 I wish you could actually hear how hard I'm laughing; and that is the second time I'm laughing about the same thing. Glad I'm not the only one to get it and my builds will always be informative and entertaining because that's just the way I roll. I believe if you, me, Carl, Rudy and a few others got together, they would lock us up and melt down the key. That would be fun, we could all bring our subs and hang them from a tree and see how long it takes before the police get there with rubber suits for everyone ! [Y] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 Yes, the available drawings have a different hatch setup. Those drawings have two access panels IIRC, one for each driver. I didn't like one of the panels, which was located along the side of the sub. I created the template pictured above to just allow the driver room to slide into the enclosure, yet have enough room to work a small screw driver. I then moved the template around and selected a location that seemed to ensure the 'hole' would be supported on all sides. If you plan on just screwing the top, you will hopefully not have any air leaks bettween the interior risers. I would guess if that happens, it is not going to work very well. I focused a lot of my energy in ensuring there would be absolutely no air leaks between the horn interior spaces. That was one of my motivations to rabbet the interior, glue and screw the entire thing. Of course, once I sealed it that was it. No going back to fix something. Based on the success of other builds just like it, I was confident it should work. The risk of not being able to change anything, was worth the peace of mind knowing there would be no air leaks and the problems they might cause. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 BTW, I also used insulation tape around the lip of the hatch. That is, the hatch cover sits on and attaches to the lip I routed in the opening. That lip has black insulation tape on it to ensure that when the lid is screwed on, it compresses the insulation tape and creates a good seal.....once again preventing air leaks. That hatch is located next to the drivers and around the last turn of the horn, so I suspect a leak there would be a bad thing as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 That would be fun, we could all bring our subs and hang them from a tree and see how long it takes before the police get there with rubber suits for everyone ! I'll be there as soon as I figure out how to transport my IB[:|]. Been there, done that with the police. No rubber suits but I did have to turn it down[H]. Like Rudy, I too like the Behringer amps and have 3 currently. The only problem with them is there's no high pass filter that you'll need for HT. You'll need a seperate component for that unless you use a sub specific amp that has one. One of the Behringers that I use for my IB doesn't need one due to the nature of an IB sub. The other 2 that I use are for music only so my drivers get very little, if any, info below their tuning point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 Like Rudy, I too like the Behringer amps and have 3 currently. The only problem with them is there's no high pass filter that you'll need for HT. You'll need a seperate component for that unless you use a sub specific amp that has one. One of the Behringers that I use for my IB doesn't need one due to the nature of an IB sub. The other 2 that I use are for music only so my drivers get very little, if any, info below their tuning point. If you are connecting the sub amp to the LFE channel of your pre/pro, would you still need a high pass filter? The LFE channel should only send LF information to the sub. That is, assuming you are using the sub strictly for LFE. Otherwise, that is why I mentioned the DCX2496 or some other low cost active crossover. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators dtel Posted January 6, 2012 Moderators Share Posted January 6, 2012 That hatch is located next to the drivers and around the last turn of the horn, so I suspect a leak there would be a bad thing as well. That's what i did also, sealing it, looking at the inside design that last turn in the path of the sound before exiting has got to have the least amount of pressure than anywhere else in the cabinet. If there is any pressure at that point it should be very little, i would think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators dtel Posted January 6, 2012 Moderators Share Posted January 6, 2012 I'll be there as soon as I figure out how to transport my IB. That might be tricky. [:S] One thing for sure, you have the biggest and most expensive cabinet for your sub than anyone, it's so big it has to have an exterior roof ! [H] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 I agree that looking just at the horn, it should be a low pressure area. However, one of the woofers is firing right next to the hatch. My theory was to make it a solid as possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators dtel Posted January 6, 2012 Moderators Share Posted January 6, 2012 My theory was to make it a solid as possible. I agree, the more solid the whole thing is the better, wouldn't want any vibrations anyway. I would think the small part where the drivers are has got to be pressurized pretty well at certain times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 If you are connecting the sub amp to the LFE channel of your pre/pro, would you still need a high pass filter? The LFE channel should only send LF information to the sub. That is, assuming you are using the sub strictly for LFE. Otherwise, that is why I mentioned the DCX2496 or some other low cost active crossover. Correct me if I'm wrong but you don't want to send the sub a signal lower than the tuning point of the enclosure or you risk damaging the drivers. The pre-pro will limit the upper frequency sent to the sub but not the lower frequency. Many movies have content down to 10Hz or even below. Sending that to the sub at "spirited" volumes could send the drivers into overexcursion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete H Posted January 7, 2012 Author Share Posted January 7, 2012 If you are connecting the sub amp to the LFE channel of your pre/pro, would you still need a high pass filter? The LFE channel should only send LF information to the sub. That is, assuming you are using the sub strictly for LFE. Otherwise, that is why I mentioned the DCX2496 or some other low cost active crossover. Correct me if I'm wrong but you don't want to send the sub a signal lower than the tuning point of the enclosure or you risk damaging the drivers. The pre-pro will limit the upper frequency sent to the sub but not the lower frequency. Many movies have content down to 10Hz or even below. Sending that to the sub at "spirited" volumes could send the drivers into overexcursion. These are the things that I worry about because I don't want kill the drivers out of the gate. I'm assuming that just running music through them isn't going to hurt as the content won't go that low. I guess it's time to read the darn manual on the DCX2496 when I bring it in and at lease learn how to use the thing and what could be more simple than a single sub, but I'm going to take a look at the amp suggestions now and see what I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 You should be fine for music. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete H Posted January 7, 2012 Author Share Posted January 7, 2012 Pete, Having gone over to the dark side a year ago, most of my speakers are actively crossed, so I use pro amps exclusively these days. I know some folks don't like Behringer amps, but I have had great success with the ep4000 line. I currently have 5 of them! They are inexpensive and have way more power than you will ever use. BTW, I use a Behringer DCX2496 to contol the signal going to the sub amp. Your QSC quality will be wasted on the subs and you will likely miss them if not on your mains. I think your Carver, even if bridged will limit your headroom here and there, but will work of course. You might compare the price of a plate amp, with getting a DCX crossover and an ep4000 or something similar to that you will have all you need to control two subs. If you build a twin, you will need two plate amps etc. Plenty of that stuff on the used market as well. I'm partial to having the active setup. You will always be able to use it for other projects if you don't like the 'tater' project. If you decide to sell your Carver, you will be out of pocket very little and have all the power you will ever need for this or other projects. Matter of fact, I'm about to replace my main Hafler amps with a QSC PLX2 which I recently got and probably another ep4000 for my center channel. I have enjoyed watching your project. I had a nice time with my build, although I made my share of mistakes as well. You are so close....can't wait for the results. I have a DCX2496 as well, and I guess it's time to blow the dust off the user manual and figure it out, but I'm going to look for an amp today that will have controls built in as that is going to work better for me and my long term plans for the DCX. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 I guess it's time to read the darn manual on the DCX2496 when I bring it in and at lease learn how to use the thing and what could be more simple than a single sub, but I'm going to take a look at the amp suggestions now and see what I think. From the Behringer product page: "Several types of EQs (LP/BP/HP) for each input and output" It looks like you should be able to use it as a HP filter (I didn't read the manual however). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 I'm going to look for an amp today that will have controls built in as that is going to work better for me and my long term plans for the DCX. The O-audio plate amp should have everything you need to run your sub. There may be other options out there however. Just be sure whatever you select has a selectable HP filter. A single band PEQ is nice too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClaudeJ1 Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 Follow Rudy's build in regards to the access door because I just figured out today that the prints show an access door that is useless. Not only is the Rudy/Dtel access door actually useable, it's in a lower pressure area of the horn, as opposed to in the throat (in the original drawing), so the seal doesn't have to be as strong................. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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