Need a new receiver

[Youthman]

umc-1 is set at 120 for the sub now.

Not a good idea. I don't believe SVS was telling you to set the xover at 120 on the UMC-1. That is WAY too high for sub frequencies. Typically it is recommended somewhere at 80Hz or lower depending on your setup.

I personally choose to set my RF-83's to FULL so they handle all frequencies and set my dual 15's at 50Hz. The RF-83's play down to 29Hz so there are no "gaps" or "holes" in the xover setttings.

If I did choose to set a xover for the mains, I probably would set them at maybe 60Hz and the sub at 60Hz as well. 120Hz would be WAY too high of a setting. The only time you would use 120Hz would be if your UMC-1 is set to a Xover frequency. By setting the xover on your sub to 120Hz, you are basically just allowing the UMC-1 to dictate what frequencies for the sub to play.

Does that make more sense?

[ivanhurd]

^^^From what I've read, movie sound engineers send everything 120hz and down to the LFE channel so that wouldn't be way too high. Right now I have my fronts set to 60, everything else to 80, and sub is at 120. (I keep messing around with different settings, so these aren't my end all settings) If you cut the frequency to the LFE off too low, your other speakers will have to do more work as your AVR will have no choice but to send the stuff it would normally send to the LFE to those other channels to reproduce. This may be ok in some setups as their fronts won't have any problems reproducing the lower lows, but it still takes a lot away from what your sub is designed to do.

[roaddog359]

the sub cross over is switched to off but I have the dial to 120. so you say that the umc-1 sub woofer setting should be set what my mains are or a little higher? Youthman remember what I do for a living, and I will give you a hint in case you for got. Its not the audio industry! LOL I need system set up for dummies!

[ivanhurd]

Try my settings and see if you like how it sounds. It really ends up coming down to preference, but I would say this could be a good starting point.

[roaddog359]

Try my settings and see if you like how it sounds. It really ends up coming down to preference, but I would say this could be a good starting point.

I wrote down what svs said to set the lfe and that was 120, but he also said to turn the sub cross over off and turn the dial up to 120 on the sub. then he said thet the LFE to 120 on the receiver. I will double check that tomorrow. I did not know where to set that in the receiver but when he says LFE he is just talking about the sub crossover on the receiver right? I had it at 120 for a bit and it seems good. I have the mains and center at 50hz now. The sides and back rf-62's are at 60hz. Boy am I feeling confused!

[roaddog359]

**Frequency response graph does not denote maximum output capability.

2-meter ground plane away from reflective structures (quasi-anechoic)

20 Hz Mode: 19-150 Hz +/- 3 dB

16 Hz Mode: 16-150 Hz +/- 3 dB

Sealed Mode: 26-150 Hz +/- 3 dB

So if I read this right I am in the 20hz mode on my sub and they say it can play from 19-150hz?

I put the umc-1 sub setting to 120 again.

[ivanhurd]

but when he says LFE he is just talking about the sub crossover on the receiver right?

Basically yes. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Low-frequency_effects

[ivanhurd]

@Youthman, you should really try raising the crossover on your subs up to 120 and see how you like it. I think you will see (hear) a whole lot more from your subs if you give them more to play with.

[Youthman]

I wrote down what svs said to set the lfe and that was 120, but he also said to turn the sub cross over off and turn the dial up to 120 on the sub. then he said thet the LFE to 120 on the receiver. I will double check that tomorrow.

I could very well be wrong but I would think they would suggest 120Hz for both your pre/pro and for your sub xovers. Just seems too high to me. But then again, I'm not an audiophile either.

[ivanhurd]

I wrote down what svs said to set the lfe and that was 120, but he also said to turn the sub cross over off and turn the dial up to 120 on the sub. then he said thet the LFE to 120 on the receiver. I will double check that tomorrow.

I could very well be wrong but I would think they would suggest 120Hz for both your pre/pro and for your sub xovers. Just seems too high to me. But then again, I'm not an audiophile either.

They were telling him to turn off the crossover on the sub and just use the crossover on the pre/pro. No reason to double up, and it's better to let the AVR do the work so it sends the correct frequencies to the correct speakers.

[roaddog359]

You see in my chart for the svs at 20 hz it plays from 19 to 150hz. why would they make it so high if it couldn't be used? That may be why svs said to set it at 120. They recommend that you turn the amp crossover off on the sub and just let the pre/pro handle the crossover and not have double or conflicting settings.

[ivanhurd]

I wrote down what svs said to set the lfe and that was 120, but he also said to turn the sub cross over off and turn the dial up to 120 on the sub. then he said thet the LFE to 120 on the receiver. I will double check that tomorrow.

I could very well be wrong but I would think they would suggest 120Hz for both your pre/pro and for your sub xovers. Just seems too high to me. But then again, I'm not an audiophile either.

Having a lower crossover may work better for music, but the 120 for movies is highly recommended.

[ivanhurd]

That may be why svs said to set it at 120.

Read my posts! =^P

[roaddog359]

I wrote down what svs said to set the lfe and that was 120, but he also said to turn the sub cross over off and turn the dial up to 120 on the sub. then he said thet the LFE to 120 on the receiver. I will double check that tomorrow.

I could very well be wrong but I would think they would suggest 120Hz for both your pre/pro and for your sub xovers. Just seems too high to me. But then again, I'm not an audiophile either.

They were telling him to turn off the crossover on the sub and just use the crossover on the pre/pro. No reason to double up, and it's better to let the AVR do the work so it sends the correct frequencies to the correct speakers.

BINGO! that is exactly what they are trying to do thanks for explaining it.

[dtel]

OK I get it now, I was confused also.

Does the LFE channel have info that does not go to the other speakers ?

Say if you were connecting a sub with normal speaker wires and not with the "sub out" would you be missing some info ?

I do use the "sub out" but was just trying to figure out how this works.

You have to realize things have changed so much since my first "pro-logic" receiver with no sub connection. It was a big jump to even what I use now, and new equipment is constantly getting better.

[ivanhurd]

OK I get it now, I was confused also.

Does the LFE channel have info that does not go to the other speakers ?

Say if you were connecting a sub with normal speaker wires and not with the "sub out" would you be missing some info ?

A. If you are utilizing the LFE (.1 channel), then all of the sounds dedicated to the sub channel in the mix should go to the sub channel, so if my memory is correct, yes you could be missing some of the stuff that is supposed to go there by cutting off the frequency too low. I could be incorrect in this as the AVR *should* (but may not) still send those frequencies elsewhere, but if you do send those frequencies elsewhere, it could make the other speakers work overtime and the sub wouldn't really be utilized as it should be.

B. It shouldn't as the crossover should still recognize it as being the sub (.1 channel)

[joshjp]

[^o)]I might have to try this out this weekend.

[roaddog359]

I think there is more than me learning here!!!! Good info!!! SO if sub is set to 120hz and mains are at 60hz the mains will still play down to 60hz before going to sub correct? The sub wont cancel that out since it is set to 120hz.

[Youthman]

@Youthman, you should really try raising the crossover on your subs up to 120 and see how you like it.

I believe I have and to my ears, there is just too much midbass for my taste. With your logic, why not set all your speakers to 120Hz or even to FULL range since you will hear more from them that way? Just saying...

I think you will see (hear) a whole lot more from your subs if you give them more to play with.

Of course I would hear more if I turned the Xover on the subs up but you have to remember, I have my mains set to FULL so they are playing down to 29Hz.

Here is my take on it (again, I in no way consider myself an audiophile, music buff etc....just merely an enthusiast at best). I want my 15" subs to do what they do best...dig down deep and hit the low octaves. Another reason I do not set my xover on my subs to 120Hz is the higher frequencies they play, the more localized they become. IMO, one of the goals for your sub is to calibrate it to where the only time you know it's on, is when you turn it off. In other words...you want it to blend seamlessly with your system in such a way that it does not draw attention to itself.

I'm curious if anyone else sets their receiver or pre/pro's xover to 120Hz? Somehow I believe this is not the norm (but I could be wrong).

That's just my 2 cents but you know in this economy, that equates to maybe a 1/4 of a cent. []

[dtel]

I think there is more than me learning here!!!! Good info!!!

YES your not alone, and thanks everyone.

My receiver is so old it has ONE crossover setting for everything 100Hz and it's not adjustable. [] At least it has everything but the new sound formats for Bluray, could be worse.