La Scala Placement for Square Garage

[Shortrip]

Purchased a pair of relatively untouched La Scala speakers from 1979 over the weekend.

I know that a square garage with an open beam roof (there is some insulations stuffed up there) is less than ideal, nevertheless that is where I have my system set up, and where people congregate to have drinks when we have guests.

To furthur complicate things, the corners are not accesible since there is a mosquito mister tank located in one of the corners.

The garage is 256" by 256" or 21 and 1/3rd feet square.

According to the Evolution Acoustics site: http://www.evolutionacoustics.com/support/speaker-placement/square-room-placement/

They should be placed 70.656 inches from the sidewalls, this is easily accomplishable.

The problem is that it calls for the speakers to be placed 114.432 feet from the backwall which is silly, its half way into the room and with the size of the La Scala's my sitting position would be underneath the garage door, so that is out.

I was thinking about trying the 70 inches from the sidewalls, and 16 inches from the backwall, and seeing how that works.

Any suggestions?

[jason str]

Put them in the corners toed in.

They will be ok against the wall toed in also.

[tromprof]

With La Scalas distance to the back wall is not an issue, a couple of inches to breath will be ok. Being close to a wall help a little with bass, though corner placement is better. Get them as far apart as you can manage, and since you will have people wandering around I would suggest elevating them at least a foot or so as well. Box risers made of decent plywood are easy and don't seem to hurt bass any.

[muel]

In that link, the first thing they mention is to put them on the diagonal. That is the only real success I have had with square rooms. I was actually shocked by the improvement in balancing the lows. This may allow you to still have them pretty close to the walls... have to experiment.

[Marvel]

With La Scalas distance to the back wall is not an issue, a couple of inches to breath will be ok.

A couple of feet wouldn't even hurt. Imaging will probably improve quite a bit.Bass can still be fine. If you put them on boxes, your can port the boxes and remove the bootms and get more bass. Adjust the crossovers to pull the mids down and they will even more balanced top to bottom.

They don't need to be as far apart as most people want you to believe. In from the sides will also help imaging and keep from having too many side wall reflections.

Bruce

[mustang guy]

Welcome to the forum!

I use LaScalas in a shop, and they are very forgiving speakers. Put them wherever you have room for them, and point them in any direction you want. They are fine on the floor, or 7' off the ground. If your system has a mono mode, use that so people will not hear one channel at a time. Unless I am sitting watching a movie, or listening to albums from my sweet spot, I use full mono mode. It makes all the difference.

[Islander]

Generally speaking, the distance between the speakers (measured at the centre of the speaker fronts) should be about the same as the distance from the speakers to the listening position. If you have the speakers more than 18-20 feet apart, you may run into the "hole in the middle" effect, in which case you might need to add a centre speaker.

As for distance from the front wall, closer is better with La Scalas. They should not be more than a foot from the front wall, or their limited bass response will be even more limited, and there will be no improvement in imaging, either. Around 6 inches from the wall is usually ideal, based on the tests I made when I first got my La Scalas and was experimenting with their positioning and orientation.

The speakers should be toed in towards the listening position. If they're pointed directly at you, you may find the sweet spot a bit narrow, so some experimenting is called for. A bit less toe-in will give a wider sweet spot, but they should always be toed in to some degree.

Welcome to the forum, and congrats on getting some great speakers. Don't be shy to try different things, because every room is different, and it's worth doing a bit of work to get your speakers performing their best.

[Shortrip]

Tonight I will try them 6 inches off the back wall and 70.656 inches from each of the side walls. This should put the speakers about 9.5 feet apart, and set up my chair about nine feet from each of the speakers. Hopefully magic ensues.

I am sure that the amount of toe in will take some fiddlin, based on how wide a soundstage (i.e. wether its just me or we have guests).

Thanks for all the help.

[Marvel]

I have mine converge a little bit behind where I sit. I know others have them converge just in fron or exactly where they are. You just have to wrestle them into some different positions and listen.

Most important is to enjoy the music.

[CECAA850]

You just have to wrestle them into some different positions and listen.

Pick up a couple cheap furniture dollys from Harbor Freight. It really makes the job much easier.

[Islander]

A laser level or laser pointer can make the job easier, because it lets you see exactly where the speakers are pointing, saving on running back and forth with a tape measure while guessing at angles.

The laser is especially helpful with surround speakers that may be a little hard to get at, due to their height or nearby objects.

[muel]

A laser level or laser pointer can make the job easier, because it lets you see exactly where the speakers are pointing, saving on running back and forth with a tape measure while guessing at angles.

The laser is especially helpful with surround speakers that may be a little hard to get at, due to their height or nearby objects.

Make it a laser distance measurer so you can pinpoint your distances. Inches count more than I ever would have believed. Just saw a great deal on a Bosch: http://www.homedepot.com/p/Bosch-Digital-Laser-Distance-Measurer-DLR130K/202504985#.Uh1Ximwo7PQ

$79

[beeker]

This thread should be stickied for lascalas

HF has good dollys that last forever. If you have $50(ignore the $69 price they are $50 in the store)you can grab 1 of these http://www.guitarcenter.com/Rock-N-Roller-RMH1-Mini-Hand-Truck-H77695-i2120344.gc I have several i use for multiple uses including luggage at hotel valet parking. I carry my own stuff i dont trust anybody with my stuff but the cheap 1 is $50 at guitar center and hauls 350lbs has more positions than any other and helps move equipment ever so easily. The 1 at guitar center big or small wheels is identical as the ones on ebay for $100 and on up beyond $600. Iv hauled my 300lb monitors on the small one and its fun.

You just have to wrestle them into some different positions and listen.

Pick up a couple cheap furniture dollys from Harbor Freight. It really makes the job much easier.

[colterphoto1]

Is this a 'garage' as in a storage room for cars, tools and stuff, or are you turning it into a home theater. .556 inches isn't going to matter a hoot either way. Set em up and enjoy them. For HT use, I suggest placing speakers 1/2 the screen width away from the screen, too wide of a soundstage is a bit unnatural for most folks.

[colterphoto1]

One of the best LS tips I ever heard was from IndyKlipschFan, IF yours are the split cabinet variety, put a soft mat on top of the bass bin, stack a milk crate or similar sized sturdy box on top, another mat, then put the MF/HF horn box on top of that. Raises the horns to listening level without taking the bass bins off the floor. Don't worry about the wheel boards (dolly) the guys are mentioning, it's a convenience thing. With a concrete floor, LS isn't going to vibrate it enough to give you any floor vibration, and the slight distance raised won't matter in terms of LF extension. My suggestion for HT is to couple them with the Klipsch THX sub system, which is a beautiful matchup.

[Islander]

One of the best LS tips I ever heard was from IndyKlipschFan, IF yours are the split cabinet variety, put a soft mat on top of the bass bin, stack a milk crate or similar sized sturdy box on top, another mat, then put the MF/HF horn box on top of that. Raises the horns to listening level without taking the bass bins off the floor. Don't worry about the wheel boards (dolly) the guys are mentioning, it's a convenience thing. With a concrete floor, LS isn't going to vibrate it enough to give you any floor vibration, and the slight distance raised won't matter in terms of LF extension. My suggestion for HT is to couple them with the Klipsch THX sub system, which is a beautiful matchup.

That's a great tip. With the JubScalas (and JubScala IIs), part of the sound improvement is due to the tweeters sitting higher than the listener. It makes for a bigger presentation.

The standard "rule" of placing the tweeters at ear height just makes the musicians sound like they're all sitting down, at the same level at the listener, instead of being on stage, or at least standing up.

Michael, do you find there's little or no difference between having La Scalas sitting directly on the floor, or raised a bit above it? One of PWK's 8 Cardinal Points of Reproduction is to have no space under the speaker. It's number 5: "Freedom from cavities. The space under a speaker box formed by mounting it on legs can destroy the bottom octave of response and deteriorate the next two octaves."

I realize that in PA and SR use, you rarely want the lowest octaves because they wind up sounding muddy or otherwise not so good, but for home use in a dedicated and quiet room, is the difference still insignificant?

[BE36]

One of the best LS tips I ever heard was from IndyKlipschFan, IF yours are the split cabinet variety, put a soft mat on top of the bass bin, stack a milk crate or similar sized sturdy box on top, another mat, then put the MF/HF horn box on top of that. Raises the horns to listening level without taking the bass bins off the floor. Don't worry about the wheel boards (dolly) the guys are mentioning, it's a convenience thing. With a concrete floor, LS isn't going to vibrate it enough to give you any floor vibration, and the slight distance raised won't matter in terms of LF extension. My suggestion for HT is to couple them with the Klipsch THX sub system, which is a beautiful matchup.

Great tip from Indy - I put my mids an tweets in top of the cabinet to get them to ear leve. Bass next to a short wall and not toed with mids and tweets toed in gave me the best sound.

[colterphoto1]

LS bass pretty much drops like a rock below 50hz. I've not done the math but that 4" rise off the floor for wheel board is possibly below the frequency that the speaker outputs anyway?

[Islander]

LS bass pretty much drops like a rock below 50hz. I've not done the math but that 4" rise off the floor for wheel board is possibly below the frequency that the speaker outputs anyway?

That makes sense. Perhaps PWK's rule is meant for speakers like the Khorn or the Cornwall.