Repairing/modifying Heresy II's

[Analytics]

Hi Everybody,

 

As background, about a year ago my wife purchased this unique piece of furniture at an auction.  In one tall piece, it includes a lit up bar, a cheesy artificial fireplace, and an old, non-functional console stereo.  We decided to call the thing our multi-media love center: if I come home from work and the artificial fireplace is on, there is a martini on the lit-up bar, and a Barry White album playing, then I'll get the hint--action tonight!

 

So, I started working on fixing the thing.  All of the stereo equipment was old broken junk, so I started there.  I found a gorgeous Mac-1700 McIntosh receiver that fit perfectly into the console.  That really captured my imagination, and I decided to really go all-out on this.  I bought a new turntable to go with it, and hooked up some speakers.  It sounded great, but I didn't feel the speakers were quite good enough to go with the Mac.

 

So, I started researching speakers that would do the system justice, and decided that what I really needed was a pair of Klipsch Heresies, ideally Heresy II's to match the Mac.  So I started saving and looking.

 

Yesterday I purchased the Hersey II's.  Oiled walnut, perfect grill, and given the age, practically flawless on the outside.  The problem is, the woofers aren't doing their job right.  At low volumes there isn't quite enough bass, and once you crank it up to about a medium volume, they get an awful distortion and vibration.

 

So here is my question: what do I do?  I really want this to sound nice, so I'd like to get the speakers back to their original performance level.  But I wouldn't be opposed to modifying them to better-than-new performance, if such a thing is possible (e.g. I saw another thread where somebody described installing a powered woofer in the cabinet).  I'm not opposed to working on them myself, but I've never attempted to fix a speaker before and really don't know where to start.

 

I could probably afford to take them to a repair shop if that's really the best way to go.  But I'm nervous that the shop might thrown in cheap parts and leave me with a working speaker that isn't as good as this one should be.  I could send them back to the factory to get fixed by Klipsch (assuming they do such repairs), but I'm worried that after shipping, that might end up costing me close to what a brand new pair of Heresy III's would have cost.

 

Does Klipsch still make replacement parts for this?  Or would they at least sell me parts for the Heresy III?  I can't even figure out how to go about ordering what I need.

 

So if you were in my shoes, what would you do?  Where would you start?

[dtr20]

This isn't much help, but could you post pictures of the unit? As far as the heresy's goes, maybe bad woofers or crossovers need to be recapped?

[Analytics]

This isn't much help, but could you post pictures of the unit? As far as the heresy's goes, maybe bad woofers or crossovers need to be recapped?

 

It's a unique setup; I'll post some photos tonight.

 

So, if the woofers are bad, does that mean they need to be replaced?  And by "recapping" the crossovers, does that mean replacing the capacitors?  I apologize for my ignorance here--I've never messed with speakers before.  I'm quite happy to roll my sleeves up and learn.

 

Thanks!

[CECAA850]

At low volumes there isn't quite enough bass, and once you crank it up to about a medium volume, they get an awful distortion and vibration.

 

Heresy's have little bass compared to some of their siblings but they shouldn't sound distorted.  Can you better describe what you're hearing?  Is it both speakers?  have you tried the speakers with different electronics?

[willland]

Analytics,

 

Welcome to the forum.

 

Where is your location?  Maybe one of our very kind and helpful members can meet up with you and help diagnose the problem.

 

Heresy's have little bass compared to some of their siblings but they shouldn't sound distorted.

 

Here we go again.    

 

Heresys have plenty of tight and accurate midbass just not much deep bass, IMO.

 

Bill

[CECAA850]

Heresys have plenty of tight and accurate midbass just not much deep bass, IMO

 

I would agree with you there.  Mid bass is what, 80-150 Hz? 

 

Regardless, there should be no funny noises going on.

[willland]

I would agree with you there.  Mid bass is what, 80-150 Hz? 

 

I am just playing.  I just like to clarify when many folks say that Heresys have little bass when there is more bass in the frequency band than the lowest octive.

 

Regardless, there should be no funny noises going on.

 

 

You got that right.

 

Bill

[Analytics]

 

At low volumes there isn't quite enough bass, and once you crank it up to about a medium volume, they get an awful distortion and vibration.

 

Heresy's have little bass compared to some of their siblings but they shouldn't sound distorted.  Can you better describe what you're hearing?  Is it both speakers?  have you tried the speakers with different electronics?

 

 

It's a very loud, vibrating distortion.  When you begin to turn up the volume, there is no distortion at all, but the bass does seem to be a bit weak.  With regards to power, the Mac-1700 puts out 40 watts per channel.  When the dial starts to approach 50% up, the bass breaks down into a thumpy distortion.  The distortion comes out very loud and distinct in waves--something on the order of 5 hissing thumps per second.  Originally I thought the issue was only one speaker, but the same effect hits both of them--just not in unison.  What's interesting is that if you then turn the volume down, the vibration and distortion continues, lower than the volume it was at when it started.  It seems that once the harmonic causes it to start vibrating, it wants to continue.  As you continue decreasing the volume, it eventually goes away.

 

I haven't tried the Heresies in another amp, but I have tried other speakers in the Mac, and they work fine.

[Analytics]

Analytics,

 

Welcome to the forum.

 

Where is your location?  Maybe one of our very kind and helpful members can meet up with you and help diagnose the problem.

 

 

 

Heresy's have little bass compared to some of their siblings but they shouldn't sound distorted.

 

Here we go again.  

 

Heresys have plenty of tight and accurate midbass just not much deep bass, IMO.

 

Bill

 

I'm in Overland Park Kansas, near Kansas City.  If anybody would like to stop by, dinner and beer is on me.

 

Thanks!

[willland]

I'm in Overland Park Kansas, near Kansas City.  If anybody would like to stop by, dinner and beer is on me.

 

I think Scrappy is not too far from there.

 

Bill 

[CECAA850]

If these were heresy I's I'd say the backs were loose.

[CECAA850]

Dinner and beer, crap.  I'm always too far away.  You're certain they're H2's and not 1's?

[Analytics]

Dinner and beer, crap.  I'm always too far away.  You're certain they're H2's and not 1's?

 

Road trips are always fun though.  If you know what you're doing, I'll throw in some Royal tickets and let you spend the night, lol.

 

Yes, they are H2's, H#WO, born the 6th week of 1985.

[CECAA850]

Be sure all screws are tight on all the drivers and terminal cup to start with.

[moray james]

pull the mid horns and make sure the drivers are snugly attached to the horn then have a good look inside and make sure that nothing is out of order. Also check the woofer dust caps that they are secure that the glue joint is solid all the way around. Not likely by start crossing things off the list and you will get there.

Edited April 27, 2016 by moray james

[BusaDude]

Dinner and beer, crap. I'm always too far away. You're certain they're H2's and not 1's?

Road trips are always fun though. If you know what you're doing, I'll throw in some Royal tickets and let you spend the night, lol.

Yes, they are H2's, H#WO, born the 6th week of 1985.

1985 was the switchover year between the Heresy I and II... Pictures would confirm, but the Heresy I has the woofer and horns screwed to the back of the motorboard from inside the cabinet. And the back of the cabinet is removable and screwed down.

Heresy II has a fixed, non-removable back and the woofer and horns are screwed onto the front of the motorboard.

[djk]

"The distortion comes out very loud and distinct in waves--something on the order of 5 hissing thumps per second."

 

Replace all the electrolytics in the 50 year old McIntoshSo((

from 1967-1973ld from 1967-1973Sold from 1967-1973Sold fro

(the sound is called motorboating)

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motorboating_%28electronics%29

 

The 1700 was made from 1967~1973.

Edited April 28, 2016 by djk

[babadono]

Come on Carl. I know ya wanna.

I mean comment on "motor boating"

Edited April 28, 2016 by babadono

[WMcD]

 

 

At low volumes there isn't quite enough bass, and once you crank it up to about a medium volume, they get an awful distortion and vibration.

 

Heresy's have little bass compared to some of their siblings but they shouldn't sound distorted.  Can you better describe what you're hearing?  Is it both speakers?  have you tried the speakers with different electronics?

 

 

It's a very loud, vibrating distortion.  When you begin to turn up the volume, there is no distortion at all, but the bass does seem to be a bit weak.  With regards to power, the Mac-1700 puts out 40 watts per channel.  When the dial starts to approach 50% up, the bass breaks down into a thumpy distortion.  The distortion comes out very loud and distinct in waves--something on the order of 5 hissing thumps per second.  Originally I thought the issue was only one speaker, but the same effect hits both of them--just not in unison.  What's interesting is that if you then turn the volume down, the vibration and distortion continues, lower than the volume it was at when it started.  It seems that once the harmonic causes it to start vibrating, it wants to continue.  As you continue decreasing the volume, it eventually goes away.

 

I haven't tried the Heresies in another amp, but I have tried other speakers in the Mac, and they work fine.

 

 

Speakers just can't behave like that on their own.  So I would not worry about them.  It has to be the amp feeding them that signal.

 

Could it be that the amp is microphonic and the HII are mechanically coupled to the amp in the cabinet?

 

Another issue:  I don't know if the HII uses a low impedance woofer (4 ohms) which the amp might not like.  It could explain why other speakers work okay.

 

Edit: Bob Crites reports that the bass driver voice coil resistance is pretty much the same from the H to H11.  So I'm wrong.

 

I like djk's reference to motorboating.  The one time I heard it, it was like a purring.  But I do think that overall the amp is going to weird oscillations.  It might eventually hurt the speakers.  So be careful.

 

WMcD

Edited April 28, 2016 by WMcD

[Marvel]

I think Dennis nailed it with the amp. Have you connected other speakers to it to rule out the Heresy speaks?

Bruce

Edited April 28, 2016 by Marvel