mkane Posted October 9, 2016 Share Posted October 9, 2016 Tinkering, as usual. I have some AP12xxx & Universals. On AL's website it says I can use the 6000hz section of the Universals in place of his ES5800's by connecting to it's bi-amp input??????????????????? No pictures in his user manual for this and my understanding all this is far above my pay grade. Could somebody explain this in a way a 1/2 idiot can understand. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Budman Posted October 9, 2016 Share Posted October 9, 2016 i'm sure Dean can give you some answers when he reads your post Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mboxler Posted October 9, 2016 Share Posted October 9, 2016 Can you provide a picture of the Universal from the top? Al's instructions were meant for the original universal, and may not work with the economy version. Hopefully there is a screw down post on the back side of the 33uF capacitor. You would connect the + wire from the AP12-xxx mid out to that post instead of the front terminal strip. Have you contacted Al? Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schu Posted October 9, 2016 Share Posted October 9, 2016 Which half OP? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mkane Posted October 10, 2016 Author Share Posted October 10, 2016 6000hz half Schu. I have not contacted Al. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mboxler Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 Here is a picture of the ALK Universal that I pulled off his website. In order to wire for bi-amping, you want to bypass the 1.3 mH inductor and the two paralleled 24 uF capacitors (basically, cutting off the right third of the network). As I remember, to do this, you need to remove the two terminal jumpers, connect the negative speaker cable to the fourth screw from the right, and connect the positive speaker cable to the screw that is to the immediate left of the two large capacitors. In your case, there is no easy way to bypass these components, unless you want to do a lot of cutting, rewiring, and soldering. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mkane Posted October 11, 2016 Author Share Posted October 11, 2016 Thats for that. IIf thats the case I'll just put these in the Heresy's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muel Posted October 11, 2016 Share Posted October 11, 2016 Heresy's crossover at 700hz and these Cornscala-wall universals crossover at 600 I believe unless Al made these different. The slope is so gradual it might not matter much anyway. I'd give it a try. Just my thought Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mkane Posted October 11, 2016 Author Share Posted October 11, 2016 I'll give these to my son and let his ears decide, they're young. Or. I could keep these on the shelf just to look at. Either way I will get the AP 600 installed even if I have to buy the different section to make it work. Question is do I go with a ES or a GS. We rarely turn the volume up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muel Posted October 11, 2016 Share Posted October 11, 2016 I find that I prefer the more gentle slope. The steep slope gets better when going louder in a bigger room imho. It's fun to experiment. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted October 11, 2016 Share Posted October 11, 2016 Sell that thing and buy the AP15-6000. What's with the 33uF Al? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mkane Posted October 11, 2016 Author Share Posted October 11, 2016 Our room is 17x26. Loud, not often. And loud with 45's is a bit distorted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mkane Posted October 11, 2016 Author Share Posted October 11, 2016 And yes, fun to experiment if you don't mind the wait and expense. Haven't got a clue why I'm even thinking about this as the crossovers I bought from Schu are real smooth for lack of a better description. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted October 12, 2016 Share Posted October 12, 2016 I did a nice job on those filters, I'm glad you're enjoying them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honeybadger Posted October 12, 2016 Share Posted October 12, 2016 On 10/11/2016 at 7:44 AM, Deang said: What's with the 33uF Al? My guess is this is a 600/6000 network 33uf seems about right for an 8 ohm impedance at 600hz. If that is the question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted October 13, 2016 Share Posted October 13, 2016 Right, that's what the value indicates, so why is he selling this to Klipschorn owners. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honeybadger Posted October 13, 2016 Share Posted October 13, 2016 I missed that, I assumed the OP had Cornwalls. I didn't see mention of KHorns. On 10/11/2016 at 2:55 PM, mkane said: Our room is 17x26. Loud, not often. And loud with 45's is a bit distorted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted October 13, 2016 Share Posted October 13, 2016 I simply meant that this particular network is marketed as "Universal", and is sold to support all of the Heritage loudspeakers. The first Universal used 40uF and 2.4mH. He then went to 48uF and 1.3mH. Now we have 33uF and 1.3mH. In the case of his Super AA rebuild, he's using 33uF, but leaving the stock 2.5mH in place. The reasoning that is used is that low order filters are "sloppy" and that since the horns determine the real crossover points - it doesn't really matter. I've built and listened to all of these iterations, and I can tell you that it does matter. The electrical and acoustical combine - and changing these values around impacts the sound. When I built the Universal, I adjusted the values for the loudspeaker they were being used for. I also applied this to the Super AA, which is why I changed the name from "Super AA" to "SuperX" (when I realized that the high pass value should be adjusted depending on the loudspeaker the network was being used for). I'm tired of looking at electical simulations that tell you absolutely nothing about what the loudspeaker is actually doing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honeybadger Posted October 13, 2016 Share Posted October 13, 2016 5 hours ago, Deang said: I simply meant that this particular network is marketed as "Universal", and is sold to support all of the Heritage loudspeakers. When I ordered mine from Al, I was given different options for the Cornscala-wall crossover. I remember 400/600 might have been on option for 500 on the lf, and 4000/6000 on the top end. I have the 600/6000 in my Cornscala's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honeybadger Posted October 13, 2016 Share Posted October 13, 2016 My mistake, its 400/600 an 4000/5000/or6000 I new there was a 5 in there somewhere. Found it on ALK page A true 3-way network including a full crossover from squawker to tweeter at 4000, 5000 or 6000 Hz (bandpass) allowing the use of any quality squawker driver or the Klipsch K55. The low frequency crossover is 1st order at roughly 400 or 600 Hz. The actual crossover frequency is acoustic and determined by the woofer and squawker driver and horn making it truly "Universal". It is compatible with the stock Cornwall, Heresy or virtually any Cornscala configuration. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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