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-Russian-Spy-

Upgrade path advice, k510/k402/mwm questions.

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   Hey guys, looking for a bit of advice for the upcoming months.  I've had my la scalas for a few months and have been pretty happy so far.  I started building a thtlp sub that should be done in a few weeks, and ive been considering more projects...  ive been considering a 510 for the la scalas, this would allow for me to keep my footprint in the room the same, the k402 ontop just doesnt do it aesthetically for me.  My other option is to build some mwm bins, and rehome the scalas to cover cost of the k402.  But again my room is fairly small, im sitting about 9-10 feet from my la scalas as we speak, mwm's would put that number closer to 7.5-8.5,  would being that close to the bass bin be problematic?  Im unsure if vertical polars around the crossover region would reach my listening position correctly. Suggestions?

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Would you use a single mwm per side or two (two singles would perform the same as a regular double bin)? When in regular orientation (67 inches wide and 31.5 tall) a mid horn on top of an MWM is about 8 inches higher that a La Scala, placing then right about ear level. I hve mine turned vertical due to some temporary space issues... they are huge. I sit about 10 feet back from mine.

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Here's a link to my MWM story...

 

 

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You could look as some of the zxpc horns, I am running the 17 by 10's on top of chorus II. 18 by 8 (I believe) are also popular and suppose to have polars close to the k510. He is an Ebay seller and average price is around 40 bucks a horn + shipping.

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I think the K510 is a great option, now if you know someday you are going to end up with a system that carries K402s, it may be best to deal with the aesthetics for now and save some trouble and money.  I have K402s sitting on top of Belle bass bins which fit nicely. 

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Im also curious as to if anyone has any input on a bass horn that would do 100-500hz and doesnt have as much depth as an mwm, hopefully something wide and somewhat shallow? @Marvel i waslooking at building single mwm's (one per side), i was also considering building a slanted riser (similar to the hereseys).  I'm looking at picking up a dc one locally, i found one for 300 bucks, which seems like a very reasonable price, and is one of the first steps in the process. @The Dude , have you heard both horns?  I've read the k402 makes the 510 sound like a toy, but im assuming the 510 has the same effect towards the k400?  Could you elaborate on the experiences between the two?

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11 hours ago, -Russian-Spy- said:

have you heard both horns?  I've read the k402 makes the 510 sound like a toy, but im assuming the 510 has the same effect towards the k400?  Could you elaborate on the experiences between the two?

 

I do have both and would not say like a toy.

There is no doubt the 402 sits atop the mountain but the 510 is no slouch.

With that said, I first got 402s a few years ago, never even hearing a pair before. to go atop a pair of Jub-like bass bins I built.

After dialing in the Xilica Xover, I was blown away with what I heard.

 

I made a huge mistake in selling these Jub-likes!

Later on I decided to refurbished a pair of Peavey FH-1 bins and built top hats to house a pair of 510s.

This combo sounds VERY good... but after experiencing what the 402 can do I felt myself missing just a bit.

So, I purchase  another set of K402s, as seen on pic.

 

The 510 has manny of the same virtuous of the 402, but the big horn does have a much larger sound stage, in all four directions.

It also seems to deliver the music with less effort... size does matter.

 

My room is 15ft by 20ft with speakers on the short wall with about 8ft of space between,

I sit approx. 11ft away from the centre.

 

 

 

IMG_1889_sm1.jpg

Peavey_402_sm.jpg

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On 2/28/2020 at 1:10 AM, -Russian-Spy- said:

 the k402 ontop just doesnt do it aesthetically for me.  My other option is to build some mwm bins

 

Just to clarify....  the aesthetics of the K402 don't do it for you but, you're considering MWM bins?

 

Aside from that, my comment would be you hear with your ears, not your eyes.  If you want the better sounding horn, it's 402 all the way.

 

 

11 hours ago, -Russian-Spy- said:

I've read the k402 makes the 510 sound like a toy,

 

I don't agree with this at all.  My 2-cents is, if you are sitting ON axis, it's going to be hard to tell them apart.  If however, you are sitting OFF axis, then it would be easy to tell which is which (during a side by side).  As I recall Mr. Roy once saying, he engineered them to sound the same.

 

 

Edited to add:  I've seen comments where some of the speakers that USE the K402 make the OTHER speakers sound more like toys.  As an owner of stock LaScalas, I think I can say that without disrespecting them.  K402 on top of LaScala bass bin will easily outdo a stock LaScala using the K401/77

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10 minutes ago, Coytee said:

Just to clarify....  the aesthetics of the K402 don't do it for you but, you're considering MWM bins?

 

Aside from that, my comment would be you hear with your ears, not your eyes.

function over form. I see beauty in function

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3 minutes ago, grasshopper said:

You buy a fancy Ferrari... How often do you see the outside, when in operation? If it gobbles road faster than any other wheeled vehicle, does the exterior really matter?

 

I would drive mine reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeealy slow so I could see my reflection in store windows, someone's license plate... reflected off their eye-glasses.....

 

 

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On 2/27/2020 at 11:10 PM, -Russian-Spy- said:

But again my room is fairly small, im sitting about 9-10 feet from my la scalas as we speak, mwm's would put that number closer to 7.5-8.5, 

 

that would be about how far I am from my LS

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@Coytee

 

You got those mwms bin packed in there... I would like a pair. Where to put them? I can't squeeze another foot of floor space. The thought of mounting them vertically/on the wall crept in.

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On 2/28/2020 at 1:10 AM, -Russian-Spy- said:

But again my room is fairly small, im sitting about 9-10 feet from my la scalas as we speak, mwm's would put that number closer to 7.5-8.5,  would being that close to the bass bin be problematic? 

 

I would (like to) think if you used an active crossover, you could adjust the timing of each half.  Still, with the Jubilee's, I think they require something like 7-10 feet from their mouth to coalesce into a single sound bubble......

 

Another thing....  go to your corners with a tape measure.  Put the tape to the corner and measure out (what I recall to be) 48 inches or, 4 feet.  This is where the FRONT of the MWM will be, or very close to it.

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6 minutes ago, grasshopper said:

@Coytee

 

You got those mwms bin packed in there... I would like a pair. Where to put them? I can't squeeze another foot of floor space. The thought of mounting them vertically/on the wall crept in.

 

I think you refer to Marvel's speakers.  I never had mine like that.  Mine were stuck in the garage for most of their life here.

 

Do you have some space where you could mount them INTO the wall like I did my LaScalas??

 

 

 

 

No grills.jpg

Grills 1.jpg

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6 hours ago, Coytee said:

Put the tape to the corner and measure out (what I recall to be) 48 inches or, 4 feet.  This is where the FRONT of the MWM will be, or very close to it.

 

The MWMs are 45 inches deep. Pushed into a corner, the front would be closer to 5 feet. Since I don't have mine positioned that way I'm not sure. I'll look at a scale drawing and confirm.

 

6 hours ago, grasshopper said:

The thought of mounting them vertically/on the wall crept in.

 

I thought of getting mine more upright, and have sketched up some ideas. For singles, you would need something to keep them from going over sideways. The way I have mine the will not move unless theee is an earthquake.

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just ideas i've toyed around with.  Doubt I'll get around to it. The LS in the house is , I dare say it, overkill. The room they're in is 300sq/ft ....12 X 25.

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1 hour ago, grasshopper said:

The room they're in is 300sq/ft ....12 X 25.

 

in our old house, the living room was 13x21, just a little smaller. My LS sounded wonderful in that room.

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6 hours ago, Marvel said:

The MWMs are 45 inches deep. Pushed into a corner, the front would be closer to 5 feet. Since I don't have mine positioned that way I'm not sure. I'll look at a scale drawing and confirm.

This is a 10 plus year old picture and the other speakers are not like that anymore, or the 402 horn positioned like that. But you can see the toe in and I just measured and that door frame to the left of the MWM is 5' from the back wall. If more toe in is needed it would be past 5' depending on amount of toe needed.

mwm-1.jpg

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