I've Changed My MInd Concerning The Heresy

[Peter P.]

I bought my Heresy IIs and initially came to realize, much like has been mentioned here and

certainly by looking at the specs, that the Heresy just doesn't play low enough. I mean, most

bookshelf speakers reach 50Hz so why can't my little beasts play deeper?!

 

So I bought a subwwoofer and it clearly delivers that last, hidden octave.

 

But then came my realization: I just don't play them loud enough. Once I reach the 70dB

level, they clearly shine but most of the time I'm running them at background levels.

 

While the floor/wall border reinforces the bass, it doesn't make them play lower. Recently,

I shut off my subwoofer and despite having the Heresies connected to an 80Hz, 12dB/octave

high pass passive crossover, they tickled the floor joists and sounded great playing jazz, live

Grateful Dead (and I HATE The Dead!), folk, and rock.

 

Yeah, if you want to run your home theater through ANY system you need a sub. Same goes if

you want to play rap/techno at car stereo jammin' levels, but otherwise I've decided the Heresy

is a fine speaker even by itself. I can only imagine the new, ported, Heresy IV is even better.

[Marvel]

Peter, you are describing what happens with the fletcher-Munson curves. At a lower level, let's say 45db, a 500hz tone will sound about 25db louder than a 100hz tone.

 

At 70db playback the 100hz tone will be about 5db lower than the 500hz tone.

 

That's why most mix engineers mix between 70-85 dB playback levels.

 

The high end also comes up at higher playback. A lot of early amps had loudness compensation built into the volume control circuit, so listening quietly in the evening, the bass an treble were audible.

[the real Duke Spinner]

2 hours ago, Marvel said:

Peter, you are describing what happens with the fletcher-Munson curves. At a lower level, let's say 45db, a 500hz tone will sound about 25db louder than a 100hz tone.

 

At 70db playback the 100hz tone will be about 5db lower than the 500hz tone.

 

That's why most mix engineers mix between 70-85 dB playback levels.

 

The high end also comes up at higher playback. A lot of early amps had loudness compensation built into the volume control circuit, so listening quietly in the evening, the bass an treble were audible.

I always mixxed at 95 dB at Ocean Way. 😀

[the real Duke Spinner]

And...

I just never got along with my BR Heresy's

They did not stay long

Now...

My KH, and KLF 30s

Are lifetime speakers

I hardly use my JBL 4430 anymore... Much more Detail ...But no impact. 🙄

[Marvel]

8 hours ago, the real Duke Spinner said:

I always mixxed at 95 dB at Ocean Way. 😀

I had a friend in Memphis who remembered some Altec 604s blowing the voice coils out in flames.

 

I think most engineers now realize you can mix at lower levels and still have your hearing when you get old.

[wuzzzer]

I DJed a dance earlier this year in a really large banquet room with my 5 Heresys.  Ran them in all channel stereo and bumped up the bass on my receiver +3 dB and they sounded absolutely fantastic.

[billybob]

My single pair of the 1s have found as quite adequate for my purpose this far.

[Peter P.]

On 10/22/2023 at 9:20 PM, Marvel said:

Peter, you are describing what happens with the fletcher-Munson curves. At a lower level, let's say 45db, a 500hz tone will sound about 25db louder than a 100hz tone.

 

At 70db playback the 100hz tone will be about 5db lower than the 500hz tone.

 

That's why most mix engineers mix between 70-85 dB playback levels.

 

The high end also comes up at higher playback. A lot of early amps had loudness compensation built into the volume control circuit, so listening quietly in the evening, the bass an treble were audible.

I should have clarified-my interest is in how LOW the Heresy plays and not the level, if that makes sense. The Heresy has NO PROBLEM with bass level!

I like to call it "grunt" or "muscle". It's clean, and it's strong.

It's pretty easy to design a bookshelf sized speaker to reach 50Hz and many are offered for sale.

You would expect a speaker of the Heresy's size and woofer size to play LOWER, yet the specs and the comments and reviews of many others say otherwise.

While true just looking at the numbers, it's clear to me music at many if not most genres doesn't go below 50Hz, and the Heresies DO acquit themselves of

that 50Hz shortcoming once the volume comes up to maybe 70-80dB.

Interestingly enough, both my Yamaha amp and my Yamaha receiver do have the variable loudness control you mention. I can't really say it brings up the below 50Hz

bass; it more sounds like it reduces the midrange instead. As a result of this thread I'm playing with it again, just for kicks.

[Marvel]

And to be clear, they do play below 50Hz, but it's dropping off. My JBL 4311 monitors, about the same size as the Heresy models, are only rated to 45Hz. Four string bass on both is fine.

[82 Cornwalls]

15 hours ago, Peter P. said:

It's pretty easy to design a bookshelf sized speaker to reach 50Hz and many are offered for sale.

You would expect a speaker of the Heresy's size and woofer size to play LOWER, yet the specs and the comments and reviews of many others say otherwise.

 

 

Compare the sensitivity and find the answer. 

Hofmann's Iron Law

[82 Cornwalls]

On 10/24/2023 at 6:26 AM, Peter P. said:

While true just looking at the numbers, it's clear to me music at many if not most genres doesn't go below 50Hz, and the Heresies DO acquit themselves of that 50Hz shortcoming once the volume comes up to maybe 70-80dB.

 

Just about everything I listen to goes below 50hz.

 

Sealed rolls off @ 12dBs/oct; ported rolls off @ 24dBs/oct

So it's not like they produce no sound below 50 hz and then room gain adds some back.

 

I think La Scalas are a good example of people preferring light bass done right vs strong bass done badly.

The lower our speakers go the more the room likes to do nasty things to the sound.