How could speakers like these ...

[BigBusa]

...put out any real bass? Sure, they're pretty and very artsy-fartsy but how can they possibly produce any real bass? And, to be a real audiophile do I have to have guitars near my stereo system? If yes ...do I have to know how to play them?

[Allan Songer]

Horn loaded full range speakers are pretty magical with the right material. Just not the material YOU like!!

[TBrennan]

They don't. Those are Voight pipes; a form of resonant pipe which can make a nice boomy sound. Better than nothing but hardly the way to go.

I find the crowd that does this single-driver in an undersized rear horn or Voight pipe kind of amusing. They load these bassless drivers into these weird enclosures in an attempt to get some bass; their effort would be much better spent using the drivers in simple boxes or even simpler open baffles and augmenting them with a Parts Express subwoofer.

[arj]

Arent those Cain & Cain Speakers..

You must hear them with a SE tube amp to believe them...Amazing for Vocals and decent for Jazz .

The Bass is there BUT not the chest thumping kind ie you can hear the musinc but not feel the SPL!!. I do not believe this was even designed with a Rock Music Fan in mind !!

Only other speaker range I have heard with the same quality for vocals is the LothX range...another speaker with a Lowther Driver !!!

[Deang]

They use the guitars and play along with the music to get some dynamics.

[James RD]

The fellow's next upgrade should be for some furniture.

[bdc]

"They use the guitars and play along with the music to get some dynamics."

That has to be one of the funniest comments I've ever read.

[D-MAN]

You guys are right on the money...

They physically cannot move enough air to reproduce what I would consider "USEFUL" bass, although the drivers are rated to mid-thirties (they look like Lowthers). Might present a reasonably clean soundstage although quite compressed compared to horns.

Typical of most British/Euro designs, the good points are:

1) no crossover

2) somewhat boosted "bass" although not what a horn owner would call "bass" ; its a modified reflex-type enclosure

3) single point-source, that is, no time-delay problems in the upper end

The bad points:

1) Little capability of LOUD output (i.e., can't ROCK)

2) limited BASS response

3) Little power-handling capability

4) apt to compress dynamics and soundstage

5) expensive

6) demands placement towards center of listening space

The benefits do not seem to balance against the drawbacks as far as I can see.

DM

[garymd]

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On 2/11/2004 8:50:02 PM bdc wrote:

"They use the guitars and play along with the music to get some dynamics."

That has to be one of the funniest comments I've ever read.

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I have to admit that was funny, but for some real laughs, go back and read Fini's last 1,500 posts.

No offense Dean.

[TBrennan]

Those are Fostex drivers, those particular ones are damn near a clone of the famous JBL-LE8. Pal of mine uses those Fostexes as dipoles, mounted to clear Lucite panels. Looks cool and sounds good, needs a sub of course.

Madisound sells the Fostex line, some of them sound pretty decent and some are wretched. But a fella can put a nice little rig together with them for not too much dough. They make a 4" driver that sounds good mounted as a dipole to a sheet of corrugated cardboard, use a sub.

[LOADEDTUNES]

Notice the neck size and lack of scratch pads on those guitars ??

Come on guy's you must know something about the music you listen to , there classical guitars and by the look of what he listens to i'd say bass is not an issue to this guy.

Is that not a relief port on the bottom ? Fullrange driver delivers sound from the front and rear of the driver, the rear sound is channel down in a progressive chamber and amplified out the bottom ( well thats sort of how it works )

[TBrennan]

Here's a picture of that little Fostex in a cardboard baffle. Kurt Chang did this. Note the JBL Pro cardboard, improves power handling.

[BackBurner]

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On 2/11/2004 9:43:17 PM TBrennan wrote:

Here's a picture of that little Fostex in a cardboard baffle. Kurt Chang did this. Note the JBL Pro cardboard, improves power handling.

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LOL !!!!! great picture .

I could just see trying to slip a pair of those past the spouse and into the living room .

Sure they'd sound awesome watching junkyard wars

[TBrennan]

BB---You notice the speaker behind it? :-)

[WMcD]

Tom B. (High Knower of all things in the speaker worlds, matter and anti-matter) beat me to it.

That does look like a Voight tapered pipe. As a young lad he (Voight) invented the tractrix horn and used a tapered pipe for bass reinforcement. Therefore there is a brain behind the design not to be dismissed. But I agree with Tom that there are better ways of doing things.

Gil

[BackBurner]

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On 2/11/2004 9:52:53 PM TBrennan wrote:

BB---You notice the speaker behind it? :-)

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Ya i'm not blind , it's just funny thats all.

GIL: There's always better ways of doing things but " hey " maybe this works for the guy ? We don't know .

Not everyone's into bass that knocks you off the couch or purist tube amps that let you tap your feet to the beat of your neighbours mixmaster.

[kohill]

Is that a subwoofer behind the guitar on the right side?

[tillmbil]

Forget the speakers, what is all the tube gear this guy has? Seems to me he has some great gear and one nice TT.

[sheltie dave]

Man, BigBusa, you had me going for a minute. First, I thought you might have changed your paradigms regarding stereo amplification, speakers, and musical tastes, but no. Then I figured you took photos of your alter-ego, L'ilMe BigBusa, but no. Then I thought it might be a friend's setup, but no. Yew!

These systems are the province of either poseurs or people who know exactly what they want. Looking at the musical selections and the choice classical geeetars, this person is very serious about their music. The system probably is the result of dedicated effort.

Too bad the speakers often sound like two kumquats farting, with a discrete sheep bleat mewing in the background. Aggressive and upfront are not in these speakers' vocabulary. Very low grades for the interior decorating as well, for the scene is one of cluttered busy-busy, rather than tranquil harmony that is the reflection of good fung-shei.

[JBryan]

The speakers are Cain & Cain Abbeys http://www.cain-cain.com/audio/abby/index.html. They are beautifully built cabinets with Fostex drivers that sound very nice with 8+ watt SET amps. They don't do bass especially well but then again, that's not what the single-driver crowd is going for. Where SD speakers shine is in detail, dynamics and above all else, coherence.

All speakers are compromised and all sound "colored" so it boils down to which poison you prefer. The SD crowd will sacrifice frequency extension for some of best imaging and coherence available. Us Hornies have to put up with system-matching headaches (read: noise) as well as extension to get the dynamics and transients we want and the ability to use flea-powered amps. The Cone crowd gets the bass extension and quiet operation but needs more power and loses some of the detail and speed of horns and the coherence of SDs.

Which is the best approach to sound reproduction? Whichever one that best emphasizes those qualities you're listening for. Cut Throat had a pr of Auris IIs that have been embraced by the SD crowd as one of the best SD speakers available but he decided he liked his Belles better - go figure. I like the theory behind SDs and would love to put a nice SD Like the Auris in my system so I can hear the difference between it and the Khorn. I think it would be a very interesting comparison. Have Fun -Bryan