Audible Nectar Posted March 17, 2005 Share Posted March 17, 2005 This might be more appropriate for "Updates and Mods", but I think this will get more views here. It needs to be seen. This involves an item that I never got to when updating the internal components of my 2 channel rig. As many may know/remember, I had my McIntosh MX-110 and MC-30's internally updated in preparation for long term ownership. As computer issues and other distractions in life got in the way, I never dealt with the issue of crossover updating for my AA Belle networks - until now. I missed out on DeanG's Jensen PIO offering - the aftermarket recipe that most intrigued me - and have yet to hear the ALK's in a rig that made me really want them (just too wide open in rigs I've heard so far). Admittedly, I haven't heard the ALK (original offering) with tube Mac stuff though - and the extreme slope offerings are now being offered - unheard by these ears in any case. For me, hearing is believing - and since my "jury" is still out on the ALK offerings, I put that idea on hold for future investigation. But I KNEW those old networks were 29 years old - and a safe bet they needed replacement. It seemed the prudent thing to have these redone, but I didn't want to spend the ALK $$$ without sufficient prior proof/satisfaction. So the question I asked myself was how best to deal with the issue without going broke or having to resell/respend, and avoid spending $$$ that may not yield the desired results. Furthermore, based on prior postings here, it seemed that my 29 year old networks really weren't working at spec, based on Bob Crites' postings about drifting specs in the old AA caps. So how could a REAL comparison take place amongst the latest offerings when my PWK recipe wasn't up to spec? So I called Bob Crites and inquired about rebuilding those AA's, and came to the conclusion that I first needed to start with a fresh cooked batch of PWK's recipe - and sent Bob my networks for a rebuild. 8 days later the networks returned, and I promptly installed them. The difference, folks, was not subtle. Immediately evident was a brighter and more open upper half - vocals and high frequency material was MUCH CLEANER. Not irritatingly so - as my ears tend to be sensitive to edgy, raspy, or simply too much upper frequency material - more so than the average listener, IMO. Not edgy, just much clearer, more transparent music. The oft used term "lifting the veil" certainly applies here. For all of the speaker wire swapping, tube rolling, gear replacing, room adjusting, and all other manner of system changes that many go through - I must admit I missed the obvious here. This should have been THE FIRST thing I did when I got my Belles. I must admit that I am lucky - in the respect that I love my Mac gear with the Belles even more after the recap of the networks. Because if one wants to get the best out of their gear choices and tweaks, let's make those speakers what they should be. One will be much better prepared to hear those differences, too. If you have "A" or "AA" original caps in your speakers, do this. You won't be sorry. Even if you are on the fence about other network offerings, do this in the meantime. It's cheap, effective, and can be redone again (ALK, DeanG, etc.). and you'll hear much more of your Heritage, as they were when new. 80 bux, folks (plus shipping). Best sub-$100 tweak ever on Heritage. And the type "A" network built in, taboot. Why in the hell did I wait this long??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frzninvt Posted March 17, 2005 Share Posted March 17, 2005 I have one of Dean's Jensen PIO AA's in my center La Scala, as you said BIG difference, cleaner sound across the entire spectrum. The same held true with the DHAOxer's that he built up for my '77 Klipschorns, I should have Dean's Type B/P's for my '62 Cornwalls today and I cannot wait to get them installed. Updating or upgrading the old crossover networks has yielded some tremendous improvements. Well worth the investment IMHO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fini Posted March 17, 2005 Share Posted March 17, 2005 Good report on a good deal! It appeals to the "recycler" in me. What changes does Bob make? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted March 17, 2005 Share Posted March 17, 2005 whoa, no speakers for 8 days! thanks for the post... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audible Nectar Posted March 17, 2005 Author Share Posted March 17, 2005 He makes two changes: Swaps out old motor runs for new caps Adds "A" option to "AA" unit Plus you get a complete rewire/resolder - it looks very clean. Nothing flashy, but a good clean look and ease of use/installation. Essentially you get back a fresh version of your old boards. And yes, it appeals to the "recycler" in me as well. Also, it appeals to my "bang for the buck" ethos, as this is proof to me that good quality and sensible updates do not have to be expensive. Furthermore, when one considers the cost of obtaining old Heritage, this is obvious - like changing the oil in your car. Get all of the performance you paid for! Every Heritage owner with 20+ year old speakers and original caps should be doing this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audible Nectar Posted March 17, 2005 Author Share Posted March 17, 2005 "whoa, no speakers for 8 days!" No worries. Cornwalls in the theater....and an opportunity to do "spring cleaning" in that room - waxed the Macs, cleaned the Belles, and gave the whole room a deep cleaning. I guess Bob has a "core charge"/swap program to assist those who do not want to be without tunes for that long. I wanted MY Belle boards back, however, since they appear pristine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted March 17, 2005 Share Posted March 17, 2005 Hearing is believing. Most don't realize that the stock cans are much older than the speakers themselves. I think PK loaded up on WWII surplus capacitors, and most of the cans were probably two decades old before they were used. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fini Posted March 17, 2005 Share Posted March 17, 2005 ---------------- On 3/17/2005 9:16:45 AM Audible Nectar wrote: ...waxed the Macs... ---------------- Sounds like a line from West Side Story. Does Bob have a website? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted March 17, 2005 Share Posted March 17, 2005 Just email him: bobcrites@centurytel.net Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEC Posted March 17, 2005 Share Posted March 17, 2005 Dave, Thanks for the review. PWK's design of the Type AA really does sound good. Just that in every set I have ever tested, the caps have become resistive from old age. Just getting new good caps in there is a good thing to do. Bob Crites Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
st. patrick Posted March 17, 2005 Share Posted March 17, 2005 BEC and DeanG, would this cap updating also be applicable to Forte 1's? and to Heresy's? and Kg-4's? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daddy Dee Posted March 17, 2005 Share Posted March 17, 2005 I'd just want to add that my old Klipsch networks sounded worlds better after Bob replaced the caps. That's one thing that is really WAAAy cool about PWK's designs. What he was able to squeeze out in bang for the buck is impressive indeed. There are lots of mods to "improve" on the design. I'd also hasten to add that "improvement" is often expensive. Restoring old Heritage to factory spec can be an inexpensive proposition compared to improvement. It took a while for me to figure that out and now I'm glad to know just how dang good my '73 Khorns sounded back when they were new and how they sound again. I routinely switchout my BEC A/AA's with ALK's A replacements. Fun stuff. I love my Klipsch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fini Posted March 17, 2005 Share Posted March 17, 2005 Bob, Do you sell the caps for DIYers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted March 17, 2005 Share Posted March 17, 2005 Olde Fini could reform a penny with his a$$ cheeks LOL !! I had to ribb ya there buddy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fini Posted March 17, 2005 Share Posted March 17, 2005 Thanks for all your help, Craig. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m00n Posted March 17, 2005 Share Posted March 17, 2005 Audible Nectar would those be the belles I sold you? All these little tweaks I'm hearing about LONG after I sold my belles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m00n Posted March 17, 2005 Share Posted March 17, 2005 ---------------- On 3/17/2005 11:07:10 AM fini wrote: Bob, Do you sell the caps for DIYers? ---------------- Good question, don't listen to Craig. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxg Posted March 17, 2005 Share Posted March 17, 2005 Aren't caps things you can buy at parts express and the like? Not that I want to cut into BEC's business of course.... You know, of course, Fini that as long as the specs of the caps are the same they all sound identical really.... (that should wake the modders in a hurry!!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leok Posted March 17, 2005 Share Posted March 17, 2005 Dave, Bob, What a great concept. Bring them back up to spec. Bob, I know you've gone over this before, but I never realized the significance in terms of getting back to the original before modifying. Leo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
st. patrick Posted March 17, 2005 Share Posted March 17, 2005 yo craigster, don't be bagging on our fellow left coaster fini. Fini, my man, we got your backside dude! Oh, the irony.............craig, how can you tease a guy who wants to create something with his own hands? Someone on the forum has to have an extra copy, that they can loan out, of Dale Carnigie's book "How to Win Friends and Influence People" Oh yeah, Happy St. Paddy's Day to y'all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.