Greatest Rock Drummers!

[Bonzo]

Imagine Led Zep with a different lead singer! The story goes the job was offered to Steve Marriott, RIP, of The Small Faces and later Humble Pie. He turned down the job to form H.P. I guess because he thought Led Zep would go over like a "lead balloon". How things would have been different as then Bonham probably wouldn't have joined without Plant and Jim McCarty, Yardbirds, would have likely been the drummer. Don't know if this is actual history or just legend but it's interesting to me to ponder it, Led Zeppelin without Plant and Bonham, I need to wake up from this nightmare!

[TBrennan]

"John Bonham is a household name for most people. "

I talked to my father today, he never heard of him. I talked to one of my sons today too, he never heard of him either. And my son can name every player in the majors.

Actually aside from the small group of people that are total pop music freaks about the only people who pay attention to drummers are other drummers, just as with bassplayers.

[rockbobmel]

"John Bonham is a household name for most people. "

Actually aside from the small group of people that are total pop music freaks about the only people who pay attention to drummers are other drummers, just as with bassplayers.

And not enough of them either!! Bass players are true unsung hereos.

[Zealot125]

I dont know how old this thread is and whether I have said this before

(If so I apologise) but Dream Theater's Mike Portnoy is a Drum god!!!

[TBrennan]

Melnik---I play my bass just as though it were a drumset.

We can turn this into a bassplayer thread.

I'll start with Duck Dunn, Bill Black, James Jamerson and Noel Redding. And whoever the guy was on "Nobody but Me" by the Human Beingz.

[Bonzo]

It is true that the unsung heros are the guys who drive the band. It is our lot in life! Some lead singers and lead guitar players will say the drummers and the bass players can easily be replaced! What I say is Led Zep is not Led Zep without Bonham and/or Jones! The Beatles could have never been The Beatles without Starr and/or McCartney! And, it's my humble opinion that The Stones have not been the same since Bill Wyman left! Were The Who ever the same after Moon died? Certainly not when Entwhistle died! Etc., Etc., Etc.........

Where I live, "lead" guitar players are a dime a dozen, good drummers and bass players are like gold!

Donald "Duck" Dunn, A Bass GOD!!!

[Joe Shmoe]

OK, I agree with most of what has been said here "BUT" Peter Criss from KISS, is not that great of a drummer, I know you said flamboyant or something, but I still disagree on that... I am a KISS fan & think Pete's a little boring, reminds me of Charlie Watts from the Stones.. (snoozefest!)

Also a question was asked about the drummer from Blue Murder & that is also Carmine Appice.

BUT what I really wanted to add are Anton Fig from David Letterman, and he also played for KISS a few times in place of Peter! I saw him at a drum clinic & he was outstanding!

Also talked about in another thread was Scott Rockenfield from Queensryche... that dude can jam! He also had some of the sweetest drum kits out there.. not to take anything away from Eric Carr's huge kit.

And last but not least, anyone that is into a kick A$$ drum solo, needs to check out Godsmack "Changes" DVD... it has one of the best Solo's I've seen yet.. called "Batalla de los Tambores" It features dual drum kits with the lead singer Sully Erna on one side & on the other side Shannon Larkin ... this dude is unfriggin believable... a good analogy that I have heard people compare him to "Animal" the muppet... he is just crazy! I wish I could post the whole solo here for you to see... but you will definitley need it played through some Klipsch speakers...cranked way up!

[Fish]

I'm with you on the unsung hero thing but...without Jimmy,Keith,Pete,etc...you may well never have heard of the rest of the band.Zepp is the ONLY band I consider finished without all four members.If the Beatles lost Ringo I could have come up with a long list of replacements(no offense to Ringo).Also "good"musicians aren't a dime a dozen anywhere I've ever been,mediocre ones are.

[Bonzo]

Point taken but I was trying to illustrate that GREAT bands are a whole unto themselveves. When you chip away at the key parts, all that remains is a shell of it's former self. Some lesser bands can thrive but the real innovators are a whole, a unit if you will. The only great band I can think of that breaks that mold is The Yardbirds. I actually liked them better with Jeff Beck out front. Just my opinion.

As far as Ringo. Which of The Beatles, besides McCartney, had the most successful solo career up until John Lennon's death and after???

Answer: Ringo Starr

[Agent Eagle]

Neil Peart for sure, but what about the drummer for the Dave Matthews Band... I know they probably aren't classified as 'rock', but he is freakin' awesome... Buford something ??

[Olorin]

I think you mean Carter Beauford.

[oldtimer]

Point taken but I was trying to illustrate that GREAT bands are a whole unto themselveves. When you chip away at the key parts, all that remains is a shell of it's former self. Some lesser bands can thrive but the real innovators are a whole, a unit if you will. The only great band I can think of that breaks that mold is The Yardbirds. I actually liked them better with Jeff Beck out front. Just my opinion. As far as Ringo. Which of The Beatles, besides McCartney, had the most successful solo career up until John Lennon's death and after??? Answer: Ringo Starr

Of course! I agree with you totally. Jeff Beck wipes the floor with the guy he replaced.

(That should ruffle some feathers)(It was Clapton, right?)

[dragonfyr]

Point taken but I was trying to illustrate that GREAT bands are a whole unto themselves. When you chip away at the key parts, all that remains is a shell of it's former self. Some lesser bands can thrive but the real innovators are a whole, a unit if you will. 1.)The only great band I can think of that breaks that mold is The Yardbirds. I actually liked them better with Jeff Beck out front. Just my opinion. As far as Ringo. 2.) Which of The Beatles, besides McCartney, had the most successful solo career up until John Lennon's death and after??? Answer: Ringo Starr

Of course! I agree with you totally. 3.) Jeff Beck wipes the floor with the guy he replaced.

(That should ruffle some feathers)(It was Clapton, right?)

Ruffle feathers!? In the spirit of fun, Let's stomp on the ant hill!

1.) The Stones survived Brian Jones' death. If I am not mistaken they continued and made another record or two!

2.) Both John Lennon and George Harrison had more substantial solo careers then Ringo!

The Ringo fest that seems to be occurring here is fascinating! A charismatic socialite, sure! He was a reliable drummer in a band who was in the right place at the right time and constituted a social significance that perhaps overshadows their music. But one of the best drummers for the sake of drumming!? Whatever!

And if you subscribe to the 'Ringo is one of the greatest drummers' school, you surely don't want to overlook Desi from Dino, Desi & Billy!

And so many of these same folks that think Ringo is "IT", question Keith Moon's abilities!? I think that in itself summarizes the problem very well!

3.) And to sidetrack the "Clapton is God" nonsense before it gets started...It is just that! He was fine in the Yardbirds and Cream. Derek & the Dominoes was as much, if not more, Bobby Whitlock! And ever since the smack, the best Eric has done is to become a JJCale clone, of which the original JJCale performances are distinctly superior!

And regarding Jeff... talented?, sure! But when even he admitted in interviews that he literally had trouble remaining awake while playing...well...inspiring...

Also - I think we are at the point where all the new additions have already been mentioned several times before!

[theryugobuddy]

Point taken but I was trying to illustrate that GREAT bands are a whole unto themselves. When you chip away at the key parts, all that remains is a shell of it's former self. Some lesser bands can thrive but the real innovators are a whole, a unit if you will. 1.)The only great band I can think of that breaks that mold is The Yardbirds. I actually liked them better with Jeff Beck out front. Just my opinion. As far as Ringo. 2.) Which of The Beatles, besides McCartney, had the most successful solo career up until John Lennon's death and after??? Answer: Ringo Starr

Of course! I agree with you totally. 3.) Jeff Beck wipes the floor with the guy he replaced.

(That should ruffle some feathers)(It was Clapton, right?)

Ruffle feathers!? In the spirit of fun, Let's stomp on the ant hill!

1.) The Stones survived Brian Jones' death. If I am not mistaken they continued and made another record or two!

2.) Both John Lennon and George Harrison had more substantial solo careers then Ringo!

The Ringo fest that seems to be occurring here is fascinating! A charismatic socialite, sure! He was a reliable drummer in a band who was in the right place at the right time and constituted a social significance that perhaps overshadows their music. But one of the best drummers for the sake of drumming!? Whatever!

And if you subscribe to the 'Ringo is one of the greatest drummers' school, you surely don't want to overlook Desi from Dino, Desi & Billy!

And so many of these same folks that think Ringo is "IT", question Keith Moon's abilities!? I think that in itself summarizes the problem very well!

3.) And to sidetrack the "Clapton is God" nonsense before it gets started...It is just that! He was fine in the Yardbirds and Cream. Derek & the Dominoes was as much, if not more, Bobby Whitlock! And ever since the smack, the best Eric has done is to become a JJCale clone, of which the original JJCale performances are distinctly superior!

And regarding Jeff... talented?, sure! But when even he admitted in interviews that he literally had trouble remaining awake while playing...well...inspiring...

Also - I think we are at the point where all the new additions have already been mentioned several times before!

Don't stomp on my dinosaurs!![][]

Shoot, Ringo was more successful than ALL the other boys for a summer or two--Beaucoup of Blues, It Don't Come Easy, Sweet Sixteen, Back Off Boogaloo, etc. And he's proved to be more a personality and showman than technical, buzzsaw tye drummer. That's got to figure into this post--

Keith Moon was the most distinctively sloppy yet technical drummer ever (?) To hear him go through that whole show in Live at Leeds is amazing. He and Entwistle played an incredible din that Townsend layed chords over.

Bonzo was simple yet powerful--that was his style--Thank god--

And Eric Clapton, despite his occasional dreck output, has improved as a guitarist peformer since the smack. Watch his Crossroads Guitar Festival DVD for evidence, just out a couple years ago. He even plays with JJ Cale. I never thought he deserved "Clapton is God" then, but damn he's a survivor!

And I had forgotten to mention before--I named one of my boys Carter after Carter Buford--my wife wouldn't agree to Buford--

[dragonfyr]

Don't stomp on my dinosaurs!![][]

Shoot, Ringo was more successful than ALL the other boys for a summer or two--Beaucoup of Blues, It Don't Come Easy, Sweet Sixteen, Back Off Boogaloo, etc. And he's proved to be more a personality and showman than technical, buzzsaw tye drummer. That's got to figure into this post--

Keith Moon was the most distinctively sloppy yet technical drummer ever (?) To hear him go through that whole show in Live at Leeds is amazing. He and Entwistle played an incredible din that Townsend layed chords over.

Bonzo was simple yet powerful--that was his style--Thank god--

And Eric Clapton, despite his occasional dreck output, has improved as a guitarist peformer since the smack. Watch his Crossroads Guitar Festival DVD for evidence, just out a couple years ago. He even plays with JJ Cale. I never thought he deserved "Clapton is God" then, but damn he's a survivor!

And I had forgotten to mention before--I named one of my boys Carter after Carter Buford--my wife wouldn't agree to Buford--

...Just to bounce off a few of your observations and to ramble a bit...[]

I will try to tread lightly on some of our dinosaurs, but....

Survivors who have actually come back to surpass their former glory? Not Clapton, but certainly Joe Cocker!!!

And regarding the Dallas Clapton guitar festival! KERA broadcast it locally, and if the broadcast was any indication of the production, the bass was pantomime!!!, and even ZZ Top was ludicrous with only Billy Gibbons producing sound as the rest moved in unison without being recorded!! That wasn't Eric's fault, but geesh! A terribly produced show! Still, JJCale is a delight....

And debating which of the solo Beatles is most successful is rather a moot point for me. I MUCH preferred the Kinks, Stones, Animals, Who, and by '68, Traffic, Fleetwood Mac, Procol Harum & Moody Blues & Tull, as well as the Byrds, Airplane, Hendrix, Buffalo Springfield, (pre-Freiberg) QuicksilverMS, and a million other more obscure 1-3 hit wonders, to the Beatles prior to 1968-9. In other words, BEFORE so many of the 'newer' bands mentioned began to emerge. The Beatles were primarily cute pop stars. (I could appreciate them, but can you tell I wasn't a Beatles nut!?)

And I will not forget the roe caused by Robert Fripp when in the '74/'75 Guitar Player Hendrix special issue he said that he thought Hendrix's non-linear style of play was "inefficient"!!!!!

And now, listening to those who would complain of Moon's playing the criticism sounds much the same! Just as Hendrix did to the guitar, Moon expanded the role of the drum and did not play the classic back beat for simple time keeping! He played percussive melody lines and became yet another voice 'up front' in the band, not a utilitarian metronome with an occasional flourish! Sloppy!?!? Yeah, right!...and Hendrix was "inefficient"!!! Sloppy to me connotes mistakes and errors, and I defy anyone to correct Moon's non-linear style of play! Or, if you want to hear it 'corrected', just listen to the proficient but sterile Kenny Jones versions of the Who classics! Technically fine, but devoid of the soul and spirit of Moon AND the original Who!

Much like what Casady ('God") would do to bass by emerging from the supportive background to play melody lines on bass while driving the process forward!, likewise Entwistle ('Thunderfingers') cannot be ignored as several have done previously in saying that it was Daltry and Townshend who made the Who! I suspect these same folks still mistake allot of what Entwistle did for Townshend's licks, as his playing so emphasized the upper harmonic registers - to the point that he utilized Bob Heil's Troffs, as well did the band for their PA.

But whatever. As is usual, so many use so many measuring sticks, some accurate, some wildly inaccurate, some technical, some social, etc. to form the basis for their evaluations. Heck, if we mention the "'60's", 90% of what 90% will refer to as the '60's was actually early-mid seventies anyway!

So - have fun! And while I would definately invite Ringo to a celebrity social function where his charming charisma shines, I would not invite him to a technical drum clinic unless folks needed a speaker to provide stories about the social or historical aspects of the Beatles and their experiences!

[baseballfan]

The guy I think is the most interesting drummer out

there right now is Rodney Holmes of the Steve Kimock Band, he does

stuff with the kick drum that seems entirely impossible. (He also

played with Santana for several years, as well as playing with a number

of well known jazz artists including Wayne Shorter and the Brecker

Brothers).

There are a ton of excellent sounding Steve Kimock Band shows available

on the Live Music Archive (

http://www.archive.org/audio/etreelisting-browse.php ).

Personally my favorite stuff is from 2002 when the great Alphonso

Johnson was playing bass. The 1st set from 2/22/02 is one of my

all time favorite music sets (the 2nd set ain't too shabby either),

simply wonderful music with amazing drum work from Rodney, and a great recording from an on-stage rig that

makes it like sitting in the front row.

[Bonzo]

When I first posed the question of who are/were the greatest rock drummers, I was looking at it in several different ways. The question is, how does one define greatness? Is it technical skill, virtuossity, popularity, influence, personality, showmanship, inspiration or a dozen other adjectives that don't come to mind? I tried to look at the big picture from my perspective as a 45 year old garage musician who grew up dreaming of being Ringo Starr, Charlie Watts, John Bonham...... and playing to thousands of adoring fans who could care less if you stunk up the stage with that particular performance!!! They would cheer even if you played half the song in the wrong time or in the wrong key! If you look at this from a musician point of view, you will come up with technically adept, fast, pounding drummers who don't miss a lick. Even the sweat pouring off their brow stays in time! But if you are looking for greatness, look beyond the technical and look to those who inspired millions with their playing and yet were the perfect fit for the best bands to ever hit the stage! I will go out on a limb and say that Ringo Starr inspired more people, mainly kids, to take up playing the drums and who, more than anything else, wanted to be the next Ringo! Call it timing, call it fate, call it what you want, but the fact of the matter is, he was the inspiration of an entire generation of drummers, maybe not pros, but drummers! If that is not greatness than I don't what is!

[TBrennan]

Well said Bonzo, well said indeed.

[dgb]

Really surprised to see Phil Collins mentioned on so few lists.

Listen to the 1973 Genesis Live LP or the Genesis Archives 1 with the

entire Lamb Lies Down on Broadway live. Phil is just smoking the

skins. In his youth his speed was amazing and his odd time

signatures really took Genesis songs in interesting directions.

After he took over vox and some songwriting duties his drumming was

always the core of the band IMO. Many of their songs were written

starting only with a drum loop as a starting point. He and

Chester Thompson playing together is truly a treat and even in their

90s tours, the 70s style Drum Duet was the highlight of the show, as

were the instrumental sections of the longer songs where Phil would run

behind the kit. And of course their is the signature Phil Collins

sound most widely heard on In the Air Tonight. I'm sure he didn't

invent it (I know he didn't) but he certainly put it to the best use.

Pert, love him or hate him, is an amazing techinical drummer although I

don't feel as much "intangibles" coming from him as others. But

it works for Rush and their oddly technocratic style.

Bonham is a great drummer, but really I don't think he's the greatest

ever. I am huge Zep fan, but I enjoy a lot of other drummer more

than him. I find his live Moby Dick solos a bit tedious.

Moon, well, as someone mentioned, Quadrophenia is his shining

moment. He simply kicks *** on "the Rock" which is one of

my all time "Crank it Up in the Dark" songs.

Dave Grohl drove Nirvana into stardom IMO. Of course Cobain's

lyrics were the essence of the band, but musically the addition of

Grohl on Nevermind gelled the musical portion of the band. Much

of the stuff off of Bleach and other early releases is really lacking

focus. Is it any coincidence that the CD Grohl played drums on

for Queens of the Stone Age was far and away their best? The Foo

Fighters current drummer, Taylor Hawkins is also tremendous. Foo

Fighters are, I think, the last hope for Rock and Roll.

Chad Smith of the Red Hot Chili Peppers is often overlooked because he is so overshadowed by Flea.

Good to see Don Brewer mentioned. Talk about a huge band that time has forgot! GFRR LIve albums are the bomb.

Chicago is another band that mostly due to their progression into

writing songs for 12 year old girls, has got the short shrift in

Classic Rock annals. Chicago Transit Authority and Chicago at

Carnige Hall are must owns for any true rock enthusiast. Is Terry

Kath the most unappreiciated guitarist in rock annals?

Bill Bruford. Any coincidence the best Yes and King Crimson

releases feature him on drums? Thought not. Surviving

recording of his 1976 tour with Genesis are treasures. He and

Phil both brought their A-Games on that tour.

John Stainer (ex-)of Helmet. Rolling Stone quote. "Helmet makes

Metalica sound like The Archies". The guys are fast, tight and

heavy as hell. Plus they were cool enough to play at a free

Residence Hall concert at PSU while they were on the charts! How

cool is that?

The 80s seem to have lost the drums. Any 80s bands with great

drummers? Duran Duran had a pretty decent rythym section, but I

mostly remember John Taylor's bass, not Roger Taylor's drums.

[lovedrummin]

Here's a few of my favorites, some whom have been listed before.

Ringo Starr: Maybe not the most technically proficient, but certainly the one who first caught my

attention and inspired me to play drums in the first place. I've seen him in concert and

there's just something about the way he does fills on the toms.

Carl Palmer: Just a fantastic all around percussionist.

Myron Grombacher: Played with Rick Derringer and Pat Benatar. Very good rock chops and a

visually captivating drummer to watch.

John Densmore: The Doors drummer and a very good percussionist. He added alot of color to the

palate of The Doors music. Another very inspirational drummer in my life.

Max Weinberg: Mighty Max of the E-Street Band. Very powerful and tasteful drummer.

Bernard "Pretty" Purdie: Purdie has influenced alot of drummers over the years. Just check out those

old interviews in Modern Drummer. He's played with everyone from Aretha

Franklin to Steely Dan.