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I should have listened to you guys


BigBusa

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Fed Ex just delivered my new super duper, wonderful, $169 Kenwood VR-407 Digital DTS reciever. I was all excited about upgrading to digital as I started to hook it up. Smile.gif The new electonic equipment smell was getting me all excited! The excitment soon turned to frustration. Mad.gif: After about 30 minutes I was finally able to get some sound to come from my cornwalls. I plugged my RCA cables from my CD player into the reciever but the input was not set to "analog" so no sound. Each set of rca plugs (phono, tape, dvd, cd etc etc) on the reciever have three different options for input ...automatic, analog and digital. Each one has to be set according to what the component you're connecting is. It's rediculously confusing or I'm getting way to old. The manual sucks as does the tiny remote.

I like a lot of BASS! My 10 year old Sony STR-D611 would push my cornwalls so well that the bass (when on full with the "loud" switch on) would "punch me in the chest" and rattle my internal organs. With the bass all the way up on the new POS Kenwood I get minimum bass. The only way I can get all the bass I like is to crank it way up but then the mids and highs are far too loud.

It's true you do get what you pay for. I think I will send this thing back and take a huge restocking fee hit to buy something different. Thanks for listening to me rant and rave.

cwm23.gif Now, I have to figure out what DTS reciever is going to live up to my standards yet not cost $1000.

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?

This message has been edited by BigBusa on 10-01-2001 at 04:59 PM

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quote:

Originally posted by Audio Flynn:

These new low line receivers have4 wimpy transformers and power supplies.

You need to Look at separates or high current stuff like the Onkyo 787 or NAD T761

Im a newbie here, what is that about high current amplifiers? are there more important things than the watts and amplifier is able to achieve?

Im thinking in two Denon models, DRA375RD for stereo and 1602 for HT, are these good?

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Denon 3802 will be the one to look for. Mail order it can be had for around $800-$900. That will make you very happy.....and your cornwalls too.

------------------

Klipsch Quartets - fronts

Klipsch Academy - center

Klipsch KG 1.5's - rear surrounds

Klipsch KG .5's - rear side surrounds

Klipsch KSW12 subwoofer

Denon AVR-4800

Denon POA-5200 THX Amp (fronts)

Sony C-67ES CD Player

JVC 36D201 36" TV

JVC HR-S3600 SVHS Player

JVC XV-M565BK DVD Player

Scientific Atlanta Explorer 2100 Digital Cable box

Playstation 2

Monster Power HTS-2000

Monster Cable M-series Speaker Cable and subwoofer cable

Monster Component, S-Video, and Optical cables

RS HT Gold Interconnects

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I highly recommend the Outlaw 1050 6.1 AV receiver at $499. It is equivalent in quality to $1000 receivers ... available at www.outlawaudio.com

HT-1 Klipsch Heritage System (music oriented)

Klipschorns w/ ALK crossover upgrades

4 Klipsch LaScalas (surround & rears)

Heresy components in custom cabinet /monitor stand (center)

Panasonic 32 Monitor W/ component video input

3 Sony CX400 CD changers

Sony CX-200 CD Changer

MSB Technology Digital Director w/ jitter reduction

Nirvis DXS digital controller (auto selection of whatever changer is playing)

Nirvis Slink-e computer interface

Nirvis jukebox software (downloads net cd info, album covers& lyrics- programs & controls changers searchable for songs, artists, albums).

Nirvis CDJ (CD Jukebox Software)

Monster 5000 Power Center

Sony Viao Laptop Computer

Sony S530D DVD Player

Sony 798HF VCR

Sony XA1ES CD player

Sherwood HX-PRO dual cassette deck

Dynaco PAS4 stereo preamp W/ Tesla Tube upgrades (also outputs to HT2)

Technics SL3300 DD Turntable w/ Shure cartridges

Outlaw 1050 6.1 A/V Receiver (Dynaco inputs directly to amp section)

Perpetual Technologies P1A Digital Correction Engine (jitter reduction, 16 to 24 bit conversion, future speaker frequency correction, and room acoustic correction )

Perpetual Technologies P3A DAC ( plus 44.1k to 96k CD upsampling)

Klipsch KSW-15 sub (for DVD LFEs )

Klipsch LF-10 sub

Phillips Pronto TS2000 Programmable Remote

Scientific American Explorer 2000 Home Communications Terminal

X10 computerized lighting controls

Radio Shack Wireless Remote Control Extender

Cables: Onix , MSB, Monster, AR., Iced Purple, RS Gold

Monster Bi-wire speaker cables.(Khorns)

HT#2 Klipsch THX System (movie oriented)

4 Klipsch KT-LCR THX Speakers

4 Klipsch RS-3s (side & rear surround)

2 Klipsch KT-DS THX Surrounds

10 Linaem Tweeters

Outlaw 1050 6.1 A/V Receiver (Dynaco inputs directly to amp section)

Monster 3000 Power Center

Sony X111 ES CD Player

Sony 775HF VCR

Sony STR-G3 (supplemental amplification for extra speakers)

Toshiba 61 High Definition TV

Sony NS700 Progressive Scan DVD

Toshiba 4205 DVD/ CD Changer

Klipsch SW-12II Sub

Klipsch LF-10 sub

Sony AV2100 remote

Scientific American Explorer 2000 Home Communications Terminal

X10 Computerized Lighting

Vibrapods (vibration isolation)

RS Gold , Monster, Iced Purple, AR Cables

This message has been edited by soundog on 10-01-2001 at 07:27 PM

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Mr Big :-)

All DTS receivers have some sort of bass management. I don't know if you have a sub hooked up or not. If you don't have a sub then make sure that your speakers are set to large and that the subwoofer output is set to off or none. Most receivers will set the speaker size to small and subwoofer output on or yes by default. This could explain your lack of bass as the receiver could be routing all the bass to a non existant sub. I know it is a long shot but I thought I would mention it.

Laters,cwm9.gif

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FOR SALE OR TRADE COMPLETE R*3 SYSTEM FOR 3 HERESY'S

Main System -

Cornwalls (L/R main)

RC-3

RS-3's (white)

SVS 20-39CS

Harman Kardon AVR 510

Hafler P505 (running sub)

ProMedia 4.2 v400 for PC

This message has been edited by eq_shadimar on 10-01-2001 at 09:04 PM

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Ed makes a lot of good points.

This might be a matter of bass management.

They might re occur with another, new for you, unit.

HT units are complex and deserve careful reading of the manuals.

Like it or not, this is not like the old days with simple inputs and outputs in the hardware.

I don't like the gripes by my fellow old guys. We've got half a century of technology under our belt. Unfortunately, we still have to read the instructions. I say that in good spirits.

Gil

This message has been edited by William F. Gil McDermott on 10-01-2001 at 09:26 PM

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Well now you see(heard)what I try to explain to most here.A low bro reciever no matter who made it has a whimpy amplifier.The whimpy amp will have to be boosted and boosted and even then the bass is anemic at best.

Even your much better Sony reciever had to be BOOSTED with loudness and bass knobs all the way to the max to give you a bass punch.

A great amp can give you all this and way more on a flat setting!And again I have to bring up Bryston and Krell and Kraft(no not Kraft macaroni N cheese LOL) Symponic line the absolute reference in bass.No other amps can match the bass these bass meisters kick.Any speaker,even the Klipsch SB-2 wake up and dish tight and awesome bass,a thing they will never do on any reciever.

Ok this said its time to get a good reciever,the Outlaw around $500 is a great inbexpensive reciever.After you may get a deal on a Denon 3801,great deals can still be had,great reciever!

And if you can stretch your budget a bit(LOL)get a Denon 4800(disco also!)and you may say WOW.

Oh I cant wait my RF-7's are coming this week! YESSS

LOL

RF-7's with FPB600 = EFORTLESS POWER

With 102dB with 1 W at 1 meter these can punch a hole in the drywall! Smile.gif

And bass will be plenty I can guarantee this. Smile.gif

TheEAR(s) Now theears

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ditto what eq-s. said...check your speaker setup settings-no sub, speakers-large, and check for an equalizer built-in, and 'pump up the bass'.avman.

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1-pair klf 30's

c-7 center

ksps-6 surrounds

sony strda-777ES receiver

sony playstation 2

dishnetwork model 7200 dishplayer satellite receiver/digital bitstream recorder

pioneer dvd player

sharp 35"tv

panamax max dbs+5 surge protector/power conditioner

monster cable interconnects/12 gua.speaker wire

a 'teens' sub coming!(RSW-15 LOOKIN'GOOD!)

KLIPSCH-So Good It Hz!

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I did check all the things you guys spoke of and still lame bass. It's just a weakly powered 100 watt per channel reciever. Do not bother trying the Kenwood vr-407!

Thanks for the advice.

I found a local audiophile who has an Outlaw 1050. He's invited me to his house to listen to it. Excuse Me ...I mean audition it. cwm1.gifcwm1.gif I may end up getting one of these if I like it.

-Don

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?

This message has been edited by BigBusa on 10-03-2001 at 06:31 AM

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bigbusa,

Let us know how you like that outlaw. Are you going to bring your speakers over there?

T-man

------------------

KG 5.5 (mains)

KG 2.2v (center)

KLF-C7 (center in storage)

KG 1 (rears)

KSW-12 (sub)

Denon AVR 681/1601

Toshiba SD-3109 DVD

Kenwood LVD700 LD

Sony CD changer

Sony 27" Trinitron

Sony PLX I

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Ok, I have to stand up for Kenwood, I was recently forced to upgrade my receiver (I blew my Dolby channel in my old one) since my whole system was already Kenwood and didn't have the money to upgrade my whole system to what I would have wanted, I ended up with the vr-409 I must say, I was very impressed with it, for the cost. But that was after I figured out that my speakers, were not suppose to be set on large (no bass from the Sub came out). Now I have stuff falling off the walls in the back of the house, and no matter where you are in the house, it would seem like the mother ship is landing on your house, from the shakes and rattles.

But the two down falls are I think it has a bad capacitor, because sometimes it takes awhile for the center channel to come on (like 5 to 15 min.) but it doesn't happen often enough to take it in yet. It would be the case of "it worked fine for me" I've discussed this already with Kenwood, and the say it's my Klipsch KV2 "yeah right". I have a five year warranty, so I'll wait.

The second thing, was the fact I just bought a new cd player 2 years ago, but the system control on the new receiver is not compatible with the old cd player, not allowing the remote control to be used with the cd player. So I ended up buying a 200 disk player, the more expensive one, that can be hooked up to a computer, to download all the info on the cd to the player. (more Money GRRRR) But that is a mistake. I keep taking the cds out to listen to in my car, and end up not putting them back into the player, when I'm done.

I'm I sticking up for Kenwood? Or putting them down? Hehe

But I am impressed with the great separation out of the speakers when watching a movie. Some movies, you think someone is in your house. Because of the sound coming from behind you, on one side. Freaky, if your watching a scary movie by yourself. You almost have to duck from the bullets wizzing past your head, in Private Ryan

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Ok, I'm sorry if I piss anyone off, but I'm gonna have to disagree with the Denon and Outlaw comments. I have the Denon 2800 and the KG4. With the sub set off, the front speakers to large and the bass all the way up, there's hardly any thump in my system at all. Same with my father's Outlaw 1050, it also has no low end compared to his old Kenwood separates and was pretty disappointed when I suggested to him it was time to upgrade and he did. Now I'm not bashing either receiver in the HT area, because both rock, but both need a good powered subwoofer to give that missing punch. IMHO.

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Denon AVR-2800

KG-4 mains

Polk C-175 center

Infintiy RS-10 Surrounds

Audiosource SW-15 subwoofer

All in a 12x12 apartment bedroom.

"What?! I can't hear you!"

This message has been edited by Diggs on 10-08-2001 at 09:00 PM

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i'm returning to stock an energy 12" sub i've been 'field testing' (read that borrowing-he he).it is the first experience i've had w/my receiver's bass management system, and a rsw-15 will find a home in the right rear corner of my ht room! the 12 did well at low to medium loud volume, but at high vol, it can't keep up w/the legends.i've got to say though that it, along w/my legends, 'fixed' a spotlight out in the back of my house-by ratteling the room so much-it must have shook loose the rust on the contacts or something! anyway, it's only a taste of things to come when the rsw-15 comes home! the bass management in the 777 allows for a 40Hz crossover from mains-to-sub, perfect for my '30's, and my c-7 and s-6's are crossed at 70 Hz. bump no problem here!! avman.

------------------

1-pair klf 30's

c-7 center

ksps-6 surrounds

sony strda-777ES receiver upgraded to v.2.02 including virtual matrix 6.1

sony playstation 2

dishnetwork model 7200 dishplayer satellite receiver/digital bitstream recorder

pioneer dvd player

sharp 35"tv

panamax max dbs+5 surge protector/power conditioner

monster cable interconnects/12 gua.speaker wire

a 'teens' sub coming!(RSW-15 LOOKIN'GOOD!)

KLIPSCH-So Good It Hz!

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quote:

Originally posted by BigBusa:

Maybe I'll just stick with my 9 year old sony ...It thumps the bass from my cornwalls like I want to hear.

Call me cheap but I refuse to spend $700 or more on a damn reciever.
cwm43.gif


Mine only cost me $300 brand new.

------------------

Denon AVR-2800

KG-4 mains

Polk C-175 center

Infintiy RS-10 Surrounds

Audiosource SW-15 subwoofer

All in a 12x12 apartment bedroom.

"What?! I can't hear you!"

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Never scrimp on the reciever.The Kenwood should do better than that.

I have no problem with my Cornwalls and bass.They sit on 2 foot high end tables about a foot away from the rear wall.Denon 2800 set large and in Direct(defeats tone controls),sub set to off.

Basscwm35.gifsounds very natural.

You would think sitting off the floor would hurt the bass.Not.

Hey soundog,would you please turn your signature off when you post,you are making me jealouscwm35.gif

Just kidding,don't take me serious,love looking at all those goodies.Too bad we live so far away.

------------------

Main HT:'77 Klipschorns w/ALKs,

'75 Heresy center,modified with,K-Horn sqauwker & AA network.

KSP-S6 at sides

2 KSP-S6's rear.

Denon AVR-3801

2 Denon POA-2800 200X2

1 driving the Horns

1 driving the bi-wired Heresy center.

2 DIY 12"4ohm subs,Carver A500x 400 watts per ch.feed.

1 12" powered sub(behind the couch)feed from the surrounds pre-outs.

Sony DVP-C650D.

Dishnetwork Echostar 4700 w/DD

JVC S7600U S-VHS

Pioneer CDL-D501 laser

Music in "Direct"only!

DH Labs T-14 speaker wire to the front 3.

Room size;15.5 X 25' opening into dining room.

Old RCA 52"RPTV w/matching cabinets

Bed room HT:

KSB 2.1 mains,SC-1,SS-1's,2 SW 8 II subs.

Cornwall Is for music only

Denon AVR-2800,

Dishnetwork,Sony SLV-975HF VCR,Panasonic DVD-RV31.

27"RCA

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