Duke Spinner Posted August 17, 2006 Share Posted August 17, 2006 Saaay ... SET guy's ..... you can get 10 -12 watts outta 2- EL-84's, run Class A no PP crossover distortion..... whasss wrong with that ...??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SET12 Posted August 17, 2006 Share Posted August 17, 2006 SET12, I'm curious if you can offer insight into what dB readings actually mean in the real world. From what I can tell, they don't mean much of anything. For example, I can get close to 100dB out of my TV speakers. Sounds awful, but they'll do it. Sounds nothing like Klipschorns at the same dB level according to SPL meter. My take on it is that the TV speakers are stressed all to hell, are thin, and distorted. Khorns on the other hand at the same level are carefree, solid, and clean. You can guess which one of these extremes reminds me of SET [] Just because some SET amp can make a speaker hit some given dB level doesn't mean that it's going to sound as good as a PP amp making the speaker hit the same dB level. A good amp has authority. It controls the bass, doesn't make it disappear. It allows the dynamics to come through, doesn't act as a limiter. Your SET design may indeed be incredible, but certainly not these other amps being named in this thread. I just love Erik's excuse, that maybe the SET amps I was listening to were broken! Yeah, right. LOL! Thank you Parrot! When measuring distance is a major factor position in a room and I have heard distortion can manifest involume increases. I'm sure the TV was put to an extream my SET only produces audiable distortion when it is demonstrated by me and it takes a symphony score like the Titanic sound track to get it there gently for demo purpose to get there I have to put my CD players volume control at about 2 o'clock its range is 7 to 5 my listening is 10 to 12 with a peak sound preasure level on my meter of 90-95 it will play over 100 with no noticable clipping distortion this maybe even higher as the Radio Shack meter I have been told is some 6db lower than the actual peak. "Just because some SET amp can make a speaker hit some given dB level doesn't mean that it's going to sound as good as a PP amp making the speaker hit the same dB level. A good amp has authority. It controls the bass, doesn't make it disappear. It allows the dynamics to come through, doesn't act as a limiter." Is very true! I'm getting the impression that alot of SET's are maybe limiting their own potenial by their design most are classically designed nothing wrong with that! For basic decent sound depending on ones agenda. But if you look at Herb Riecharts designs which are classical in nature he takes the classical approach to another level which yields extoridinary results there are multiple ways to get extordinary results I think .Art Audio's method is there as well and some Cary stuff but not all. As far as my own amps I have more work to do! I have not begun to ring their potenial yet but as they are. They are more than most SETs I have heard sometimes by a large degree! I heard an 845 17 watt monoblocks that were just lame! So something special is going on with my amps maybe there are some forum members in the midwest here could get a listen! I know there is a Milwaukee WI. Klipsch crowd I wouldn't mind hooking up with if you know any of them maybe someone could steer them to me so that I have a little more creditability in some of my statements. SET12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Spinner Posted August 17, 2006 Share Posted August 17, 2006 its harmonic structure,. SET12 you mean .... Harmonic Distortion.... 3rd's 5th's exactly Why all my overdriven guitar amps ... are .....Tube [] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SET12 Posted August 17, 2006 Share Posted August 17, 2006 Saaay ... SET guy's ..... you can get 10 -12 watts outta 2- EL-84's, run Class A no PP crossover distortion..... whasss wrong with that ...??? That was my first self designed amp yes it can sing! I might add within its dynamic range its dynamics can be stunning! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Spinner Posted August 17, 2006 Share Posted August 17, 2006 see.......? now we're ..... Buddies ....[] now, SET, using a transmitting tube.. a power supply w/ some A$$ ... that could be interesting........[] i worked keeping old G.E. AM transmitters on the air, my first job back in '71 Hmmmnnnn ......Klystron, anyone ..?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazman Posted August 18, 2006 Share Posted August 18, 2006 SET12, I'm curious if you can offer insight into what dB readings actually mean in the real world. From what I can tell, they don't mean much of anything. For example, I can get close to 100dB out of my TV speakers. Sounds awful, but they'll do it. Sounds nothing like Klipschorns at the same dB level according to SPL meter. My take on it is that the TV speakers are stressed all to hell, are thin, and distorted. Khorns on the other hand at the same level are carefree, solid, and clean. You can guess which one of these extremes reminds me of SET [] Just because some SET amp can make a speaker hit some given dB level doesn't mean that it's going to sound as good as a PP amp making the speaker hit the same dB level. A good amp has authority. It controls the bass, doesn't make it disappear. It allows the dynamics to come through, doesn't act as a limiter. Your SET design may indeed be incredible, but certainly not these other amps being named in this thread. I just love Erik's excuse, that maybe the SET amps I was listening to were broken! Yeah, right. LOL! Mr. Parrot, Give it a rest. You must believe that if you continue to repeat false, and negative statements about SET amps, people will start to believe them. That continued repeating of false statements was the White House strategy for it's sale of WMD, which we all know you bought, and now all know to be mere propaganda. Your anti-SET campaign will suffer the same fate. That's why I continue to encourage individuals to educate themselves by reading and use of the internet to obtain a more balanced perspective, upon which, they can base and pursue a future purchase. Need I also remind you of a very recently posted sale of VRD amps. Yes, the amps you and others own, and think so highly of. What was the reason for sale? The owner discovered the sonics of low powered SET amps and was not looking back. Bye bye VRD's. OOOOPS!!!!!!!!!! That blows all the anti-SET smoke right back up your a$$. It clearly demonstrates that there are people who have different tastes and opinions than yours. Accept the fact that not everyone thinks as you do, and should not be intimidated to feel their choice of amp topology is inferior, regardless of what it may be. Klipsch out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seti Posted August 18, 2006 Share Posted August 18, 2006 The topology is not as important as long as the amps are built with the ears and high quality parts and iron. Group hug Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cut-Throat Posted August 18, 2006 Share Posted August 18, 2006 Need I also remind you of a very recently posted sale of VRD amps. Yes, the amps you and others own, and think so highly of. What was the reason for sale? The owner discovered the sonics of low powered SET amps and was not looking back. Bye bye VRD's. Klipsch out. Yup! - You don't see too many people 'upgrading' from SET to Push-Pull amps. In fact, I can't recall any. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Spinner Posted August 18, 2006 Share Posted August 18, 2006 Cool ... SET guy has some VRD's for sale I can use them for a while ... then sell them when I'm ready for a Wheelchair, Too ...[] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Spinner Posted August 18, 2006 Share Posted August 18, 2006 I hope Ya can take it ...SET guy's ....[] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnyholiday Posted August 18, 2006 Share Posted August 18, 2006 SET Hermeneutics, seem to be like, Large Quart Size ,Melted Ice,Brass Steel Wool,Martian Geology,Straight Onion Rings, & Rubber Corks......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazman Posted August 18, 2006 Share Posted August 18, 2006 I hope Ya can take it ...SET guy's ....[] You seem to be the one having trouble with the reality of VRD amps being replaced with SET amps. It would make more sense to respect someone's opinion other your own, rather than pretend there's a negative like "age" factor. So buy them and be happy. I'm certainly not standing in your way. Can you take it? Klipsch out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazman Posted August 18, 2006 Share Posted August 18, 2006 SET Hermeneutics, seem to be like, Large Quart Size ,Melted Ice,Brass Steel Wool,Martian Geology,Straight Onion Rings, & Rubber Corks......... And your point is.......................? Please tell us how many SET amps you have auditioned, along with where, when, and made by whom? Klipsch out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cut-Throat Posted August 18, 2006 Share Posted August 18, 2006 SET guy has some VRD's for sale ...[] No you misread the post. That was a VRD guy that was upgrading to SET amplifiers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldbuckster Posted August 18, 2006 Share Posted August 18, 2006 Well this experiment has turned to CRAP............Why don't you guys have a DUEL and the winner gets to pick what's best.......................Keep Your SETS, if you cannot make a point with out the BS, insults, and NON-facts, why would anyone believe SET is best......Information is better than insults............Boy, I'm Glad I'm Dumb.........SS RULES Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marvel Posted August 18, 2006 Share Posted August 18, 2006 OB, I think the point is that different people like different things. SS can be great, PP tubes can be great, SET tubes can be great. Trashing ALL SET amps (as parrot continues to do) doesn't really help anyone... as it is just his opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnyholiday Posted August 18, 2006 Share Posted August 18, 2006 SET Hermeneutics, seem to be like, Large Quart Size ,Melted Ice,Brass Steel Wool,Martian Geology,Straight Onion Rings, & Rubber Corks......... And your point is.......................? Please tell us how many SET amps you have auditioned, along with where, when, and made by whom? Klipsch out. My mind is made up .don't confuse me with the facts ,Absolute Miniumum,Real Image,More Perfect,Audible Pause,"The Cubic Circular",Copper Soldering Iron.......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Spinner Posted August 18, 2006 Share Posted August 18, 2006 I hope Ya can take it ...SET guy's ....[] You seem to be the one having trouble with the reality of VRD amps being replaced with SET amps. It would make more sense to respect someone's opinion other your own, rather than pretend there's a negative like "age" factor. So buy them and be happy. I'm certainly not standing in your way. Can you take it? Klipsch out. Said with a sense of Humor, SET guy .....[] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldbuckster Posted August 18, 2006 Share Posted August 18, 2006 OB, I think the point is that different people like different things. SS can be great, PP tubes can be great, SET tubes can be great. Trashing ALL SET amps (as parrot continues to do) doesn't really help anyone... as it is just his opinion. It's not just one person...................14 pages..........What is the thread heading?........1 piece of equipment experimented with................this really isn't fun to me at all........I don't need to learn new ways to insult people...........I'm good at it when I want...........What I want is good information.............not muscle flexing.............Marvel, your one of the most respectful guys on this forum, no way were any of my comments directed at you........I guess I expected more then I got from this thread..........I have got to learn to read better..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverSport Posted August 18, 2006 Share Posted August 18, 2006 ...I was hoping for more too...it seems that some take this too personally (I am guilty of this too at times) and that muddies the waters...when we get glib answers to "use the search" instead of trying to understand that some of us are really wanting to learn or just falling into the mine is bigger than yours argument...we slide into this...sad... ...[] []... Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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