WPM Posted September 3, 2006 Author Share Posted September 3, 2006 http://www.roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm This made for some very interesting reading. Thanks for posting the link. I totally agree with everything that was said. In fact, I recently had an opportunity to confirm much of the information... When I was putting together the Classe Magneplanar system (which is now for sale) I did not have balanced interconnects to go between my amp and preamp. I had purchased a pair of Audioquest Panther XLR ($550.00+ retail) on Audiogon, and was awaiting delivery. In the interim I connected a pair of Radio Shack "Gold-Series" RCA interconnects that I had lying around, as a temporary fix. Well, to make a long story short, about a week later the Panther's showed up, and when I put them in the rig I heard absolutely no difference at all. In fact, I think the Gold's sounded better! Seriously. Conventional wisdom tells us that expensive cables should sound better. Well, I now know this is not the case. Expensive cables are, well, just that, expensive. Something must be said for good marketing, as I fell into the trap. Caveat emptor! William Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Robinson Posted September 3, 2006 Share Posted September 3, 2006 Yeah, read that a few weeks back as well, just before getting 250' of speaker cable for the family room remodel. Went with 16-2 brown zip cord on a spool from Home Depot for about $60. I'm sure it will sound just fine [] Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kev313 Posted September 3, 2006 Share Posted September 3, 2006 Yeah, read that a few weeks back as well, just before getting 250' of speaker cable for the family room remodel. Went with 16-2 brown zip cord on a spool from Home Depot for about $60. I'm sure it will sound just fine [] Chris I heard audible improvements with the brown cord.[] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kev313 Posted September 3, 2006 Share Posted September 3, 2006 http://www.roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm This made for some very interesting reading. Thanks for posting the link. I totally agree with everything that was said. In fact, I recently had an opportunity to confirm much of the information... When I was putting together the Classe Magneplanar system (which is now for sale) I did not have balanced interconnects to go between my amp and preamp. I had purchased a pair of Audioquest Panther XLR ($550.00+ retail) on Audiogon, and was awaiting delivery. In the interim I connected a pair of Radio Shack "Gold-Series" RCA interconnects that I had lying around, as a temporary fix. Well, to make a long story short, about a week later the Panther's showed up, and when I put them in the rig I heard absolutely no difference at all. In fact, I think the Gold's sounded better! Seriously. Conventional wisdom tells us that expensive cables should sound better. Well, I now know this is not the case. Expensive cables are, well, just that, expensive. Something must be said for good marketing, as I fell into the trap. Caveat emptor! William That article makes me long for the days when Monster was the expensive cable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tigerwoodKhorns Posted September 3, 2006 Share Posted September 3, 2006 Not scientific but I found this very informative: http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php4?t=21467&highlight=snake+oil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colterphoto1 Posted September 3, 2006 Share Posted September 3, 2006 yes, use wire- long enough to bridge the gap between amplifier and speaker is usually good. that is all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kev313 Posted September 3, 2006 Share Posted September 3, 2006 yes, use wire- long enough to bridge the gap between amplifier and speaker is usually good. that is all. Generally good advice, but I do like an "air gap" of a few inches between speaker cable and speaker. Less resistance. Only the strong swimmers make it through to the speaker. GREATLY improves sound by reducing the less inclined electrons. On a serious note, what are everybody's thoughts on IC's? I'm not talking about cheap vs. expensive, but rather cheap copper v. cheap silver. I hear a difference. Am I crazy? Am I wrong? Anyone else? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Me Loves Khorns Posted September 3, 2006 Share Posted September 3, 2006 I just won some copper ic's on Audiogon, will have to see what if any difference they make. We'll see, I kinda just wanted to dip the ole toe in the water and see, but didn't feel like spending a ton of dough on something that may not make a difference at all. Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlb945 Posted September 3, 2006 Share Posted September 3, 2006 Speaker Wire - I have 15 foot lengths of several types of wire and have concluded that 10 AWG Oxygen Free Copper gives the best results between 20 watts or more per channel tube amplifiers and my 1978 Klipschorn's with ALK xovers. My tube amplifiers include a Dynaco ST-70 with mods, a pair of Dynaco Mark III's with only an upgraded power supply, and a Conrad Johnson MV-75A1. Cycling amps and/or tube rolling, makes a greater sonic difference than speaker wire types. The URL for the wire type is: http://www.jscwire.com/jsc_ss.taf?p=2225 Next best was 12 AWG Oxygen Free Copper from the same manufacturer and 12 AWG orange colored extension cord wire from Home Depot. My Nordost speaker wire sounds fine and equal to the copper if I use solid state amplification. My solid state amps include a Dynaco ST-80 with mods, a Hafler DH-500, Marantz Model 15 with some mods, and a Sonic Impact t-amp. By the way, the Sonic Impact t-amp is the best of my small SS collection with a price of less than $50 !!! http://www.tnt-audio.com/ampli/t-amp_e.html Interconnect Wire - I have no opinion or favorite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve Posted September 4, 2006 Share Posted September 4, 2006 OK I"ll throw my two cents in..I replaced my ordinary (don't know what type it was) speaker wire years ago with Audioquest Indigo, 15 feet each. (of course, it's copper) I noticed an immediate improvement, and I had my wife give it a listen (without telling her what I did) and she stated there was a definite, noticeable improvement, that being everything was "clearer" "more defined" etc. etc. Well, you get the picture. Anyway, years later, after reading everything on this BB, I got to thinking, I probably was fooling myself. I wanted to rearrange my components, and the 15 feet wasn't going to do it. So I bought some Monster cable (yes, I too remember it when it was the "expensive" cable) to replace the Audioquest, moved all the components and hooked it up, thinking what a dope I was to have bought the Audioquest in the first place. Well, was I surprised..again. It was like someone threw a blanket over the tweeter and horn. I tried and tried to get used to it, but I went back to the current set up, and I'm glad I did! Now, is the Audioquest better, or is the Monster that bad?? I'd love to try the Home Depot wire everyone's been talking about!! I really want to rearrange my room, but I'm not giving up the sound!! If the HD lampcord would sound the same as the AQ, then I'd gladly replace it. The AQ wasn't THAT expensive, so I'm not trying to qualify my purchase. Is all copper equal? Or does solid (AQ) vs. stranded (MC) make a difference? AL? Bob?? I certainly can't comment on silver..never heard it/ have no desire..especially if it makes things brighter!! Thanx Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SET12 Posted September 4, 2006 Share Posted September 4, 2006 OK I"ll throw my two cents in..I replaced my ordinary (don't know what type it was) speaker wire years ago with Audioquest Indigo, 15 feet each. (of course, it's copper) I noticed an immediate improvement, and I had my wife give it a listen (without telling her what I did) and she stated there was a definite, noticeable improvement, that being everything was "clearer" "more defined" etc. etc. Well, you get the picture. Anyway, years later, after reading everything on this BB, I got to thinking, I probably was fooling myself. I wanted to rearrange my components, and the 15 feet wasn't going to do it. So I bought some Monster cable (yes, I too remember it when it was the "expensive" cable) to replace the Audioquest, moved all the components and hooked it up, thinking what a dope I was to have bought the Audioquest in the first place. Well, was I surprised..again. It was like someone threw a blanket over the tweeter and horn. I tried and tried to get used to it, but I went back to the current set up, and I'm glad I did! Now, is the Audioquest better, or is the Monster that bad?? I'd love to try the Home Depot wire everyone's been talking about!! I really want to rearrange my room, but I'm not giving up the sound!! If the HD lampcord would sound the same as the AQ, then I'd gladly replace it. The AQ wasn't THAT expensive, so I'm not trying to qualify my purchase. Is all copper equal? Or does solid (AQ) vs. stranded (MC) make a difference? AL? Bob?? I certainly can't comment on silver..never heard it/ have no desire..especially if it makes things brighter!! Thanx Steve Steve, I am using Idigo for my tweeter and mid-range from my outboard crossover my speaker is wired with it internally I use Midnight for my woofers internally as well and to the crossover and I use Clear from my monoblocks to my crossover I will likely never buy any real expensive stuff as it can be found used for pennys on the dollar same with interconnects, your assessment of the differences is my conclusion as well it's a matter of taste and system matching and of course highly debuted to its worth among engineers and others as you can see! SET12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott0527 Posted September 4, 2006 Share Posted September 4, 2006 OK I"ll throw my two cents in..I replaced my ordinary (don't know what type it was) speaker wire years ago with Audioquest Indigo, 15 feet each. (of course, it's copper) I noticed an immediate improvement, and I had my wife give it a listen (without telling her what I did) and she stated there was a definite, noticeable improvement, that being everything was "clearer" "more defined" etc. etc. Well, you get the picture. Anyway, years later, after reading everything on this BB, I got to thinking, I probably was fooling myself. I wanted to rearrange my components, and the 15 feet wasn't going to do it. So I bought some Monster cable (yes, I too remember it when it was the "expensive" cable) to replace the Audioquest, moved all the components and hooked it up, thinking what a dope I was to have bought the Audioquest in the first place. Well, was I surprised..again. It was like someone threw a blanket over the tweeter and horn. I tried and tried to get used to it, but I went back to the current set up, and I'm glad I did! Now, is the Audioquest better, or is the Monster that bad?? I'd love to try the Home Depot wire everyone's been talking about!! I really want to rearrange my room, but I'm not giving up the sound!! If the HD lampcord would sound the same as the AQ, then I'd gladly replace it. The AQ wasn't THAT expensive, so I'm not trying to qualify my purchase. Is all copper equal? Or does solid (AQ) vs. stranded (MC) make a difference? AL? Bob?? I certainly can't comment on silver..never heard it/ have no desire..especially if it makes things brighter!! Thanx Steve Steve, Perhaps it was the new room arrangement making the difference and not the wire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldenough Posted September 4, 2006 Share Posted September 4, 2006 Hi all, just two things constantly amaze me, one of them being the ss/ tube debate, and the other being this question. Now the first one i can understand there is something to debate, tubes and ss are different. This question to my mind is just plain obvious, 'there ain't no difference'. Of course this is only my opinion so it counts for nothing, but it seems to my very untechnical mind that there must be some sort of scientific way to to measure if there are any differences. This would at least give a starting point to debate, and if any differences are found/not found would that not give sway to one side or the other? Please remember my under the hood knowledge of electronics is minimal (ican put a plug into a socket) so be easy on me if my approach is a little too simplistic, i'm here to learn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldbuckster Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 The only difference in sound that I hear.........................is the sound of more dollars leaving my wallet for the cost of expensive wires......or maybe that's too simplistic, also...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrestonTom Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 I really hope you folks are not spending a lot of money on wire and inter-connects. If you are then you are simply making the bad guys rich. If you are worried about the connection, then every couple of years you may want to clean the contact surfaces. This may have an effect, and it will not reward the bad guys. Good Luck, -Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay481985 Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 I really hope you folks are not spending a lot of money on wire and inter-connects. If you are then you are simply making the bad guys rich. If you are worried about the connection, then every couple of years you may want to clean the contact surfaces. This may have an effect, and it will not reward the bad guys. Good Luck, -Tom unless if you buy the bad guy connection cleaner that is an arm and a leg. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilMays Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 Guess I'll chime in now. I could not tell a big enough (if any) audible diference once I got to 12 guage speaker wire. I have the Kimber 8tc bi-wired yadda yadda.... Interconnects are different. I can put on different interconnects and tell a difference. Ususally the difference is being bright or muted. I have more interconnects lying around than makes sence. The SILVER (Kimber) is brighter and looses bass to me. I personally like the silver as I have plenty of other ways to make up the bass difference. However the high end detail on the two way RF-7's are lacking. I used to have 3 way KLF-20's that, to me, had more high Freq. detail. Unfortunantly I have never heard any of the heratage stuff. I can only imagine . The price for silver though...I have one .5 meter pair...used...... Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seti Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 Do not use silver speaker cables with horns. Consider yourself warned. Use this: http://www.madisound.com/cgi-bin/index.cgi?cart_id=3141720.22015&pid=1514 In spite of the BS in the description -- it's great stuff. Ok what is the scoop on silver with horns ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilMays Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 I am going to assume...very bright Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorcilantro Posted December 10, 2006 Share Posted December 10, 2006 DEAN - What IS the scoop on silver w/ horns...? You never posted anything regarding this just an ominous ultimatum : ) Some solid core silver in Teflon 18AWG can be had for under 30$ for about 6-7 feet. For such a short run it would be a cheap experiment. A lot of the Triode clan swear by a simple 18-20 awg wire which seems to be well with the limits of lenght for a short run (18awg up to 6ft.?) The wire you linked to would also be a n economic experiment. So what will happen to my horns? I can only assume you were "tongue in cheek". [:|] DC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.