Worth it to purchase 1080p?

[erickoegle]

Ok, this is a silly question, but I've been looking at this 1080p set at BB for such a long time, and I will be moving to a new place in a couple of months and would love to get rid of my rear projection Panasonic 47" ED 480p tv.

Any thoughts on this 56" JVC HD-ILA DLP projection TV?

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=7699038&type=product&productCategoryId=pcmcat95100050031&id=1138084693851

or the 61"

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=7699092&type=product&productCategoryId=pcmcat95100050031&id=1138084694149

My buddy works at BB and I can get a sweet deal on them.

How does the JVC compare to say, the Sony SXRD, etc.

I'd mainly be using it for regular TV, HD probably, I also play some Xbox360 when I can and definately watch a bunch of movies. No I do not have Blu-Ray but might be picking up an HD player.

Any opinions?

[el jopez]

For me, its about one thing in regards to 1080p:

• Do you have 1080p source material?
  
• If the answer is no, why buy?

Seems simple enough, however I can't deny the big beautiful screens. If you can get a good deal on your buddy's discount, see if he can work out a way you can test drive the 360 on the TV"s to see how they play. If your anal about image lag, this could be a service to you.

Check with the AVS forum for more info on gaming rigs.

[giddy up]

In my personal experience, I wouldn't recommend either TV. I did a part time job selling TV's at Sears so I'm no professional but I know more than most people about the topic. I would look to go plasma or LCD. The biggest default to projection TV's is their viewing angle is so much less than a plasma or LCD. Yes you may be able to see the picture but its darker and less clear. Projection TV's cost less per square inch but you can still buy a good plasma or LCD (40-42") for the same as a 50-60" projection. There is a whole laundry list of why plasma and LCD beat projection in almost every catagory but price. But personally a 42" or 50" TV is still going to look sweet. LCD's and plasma do come in 46" and larger but after the 40-42" size the price really goes up.

As far as the 1080P goes, I would hold off. Unless you got the money to burn the human eye can hardly detect the difference. Blue ray players and PS3's (built in blue ray) are the only thing that can play 1080p and if your not going to get one, your basically spending money on technology that 1) basically you can't view until you get a blue ray player & 2) is new and therefore still over priced.

I don't have any experience with the JVC TV, but I have always been a fan of Sony's TV's. In fact Sony is going to be terminating their tube, projection & plasma TV market for the LCD line in the near future to focus on just LCD technology.

[JJkizak]

1-----1080P set has over 2 million pixels and will handle 1920 x 1200 resolution

2-----720P set has 960 thousand pixels and the best one I know of will handle 1366 x 1080 resolution.

3-----I have had both models, and what it amounts too (without 1080P material) is if you have a 720p model and

go over 40 " screen you will get worse quality picture. My SONY 46" 1080P LCD is eyeball burning sharp and the sharpness is

much better than the older 36" Sony CRT 720P (1200 resolution) which I gave to my uncle.

4----The 1080P players are out there now at around 500 bucks so you will have to eventually buy a 1080P set, maybe not

now, but maybe 2 years from now. You will probably get a deluge of arguments but this is my 4 year assesment of CRT's,

LCD's, Projection, SXRD's, Rear projection, and Plasmas. It is also very difficult to make an evaluation of what you see in stores

like Best Buy, Circuit City, etc. because of incompetent setups and salesman. I do check out the local HT stores with the available

rooms all set up with TV's and the 1080P setups there were very good, increased sharpness, double the contrast and brightness on

65" rear projections which were excellent. They not only increased the sharpness but boosted the hell out of the brightness and

contrast with the 1080P's. They also doubled everything on the overhead projectors.

JJK

[T2K]

I can't give you in depth reporting on the Sony SXRD's but I did buy one a couple of weeks ago. The only thing that I have watched so far on the TV is analog cable. The picture is better than I expected considering others comments. I can hardly wait to try an Oppo DVD player. Watch CC's web site, they offer coupon discounts. I paid $1650 for my 50" SXRD. At the time the 55" was $1875 and the 60" $2100.

I also just bought a Samsung HDTV. The Sony kicks the Samsungs a$$.

[fini]

Keith, you TV-buyin' nut!!

[erickoegle]

For me, its about one thing in regards to 1080p:

Do you have 1080p source material?

If the answer is no, why buy?

Seems simple enough, however I can't deny the big beautiful screens. If you can get a good deal on your buddy's discount, see if he can work out a way you can test drive the 360 on the TV"s to see how they play. If your anal about image lag, this could be a service to you.

Check with the AVS forum for more info on gaming rigs.

Image lag isn't really of concern, the sets im looking at had a 2.5ms response time. But that is a good idea, I do want to check which TV would look best with the 360, also knowing which inputs are truely 1080p are important as well.

Yes, a 1080p set might not be practical today, but who knows what the future would bring? I am not about to replace a TV every few years, I at least want to hold on to one that would embrace the future. Sure when I bought my 480p set they did refer it to HD, its not the case now.

Thanks for the comments

[wuzzzer]

I can give first hand experience to the JVC HD-56FN97 1080p that I bought from Best Buy.

It uses a technology called HD-ILA which is JVC's version of LCoS (Liquid crystal on silicon). Sony's SXRD is apparently their version of LCoS, so the technology is similar.

JVC uses the Genessa processor which according to magazine testing is the only TV on the market to properly de-interlace a 1080p signal. Everything inputted into the TV is automatically converted to 1080p.

Standard definiton (SD) looks very, very good on the JVC. HD looks out of this world.

I have mine hooked up to an Oppo DV-981HD 1080p upconverting player and it is incredible. There is no macro-blocking (good idea to research that term if you're not familiar with it), the picture is incredibly dynamic and detailed and the TV keeps up perfectly with fast-moving video games and movies.

[Professor.Ham.Slap]

In my personal experience, I wouldn't recommend either TV. I did a part time job selling TV's at Sears so I'm no professional but I know more than most people about the topic. I would look to go plasma or LCD. The biggest default to projection TV's is their viewing angle is so much less than a plasma or LCD. Yes you may be able to see the picture but its darker and less clear. Projection TV's cost less per square inch but you can still buy a good plasma or LCD (40-42") for the same as a 50-60" projection. There is a whole laundry list of why plasma and LCD beat projection in almost every catagory but price. But personally a 42" or 50" TV is still going to look sweet. LCD's and plasma do come in 46" and larger but after the 40-42" size the price really goes up.

As far as the 1080P goes, I would hold off. Unless you got the money to burn the human eye can hardly detect the difference. Blue ray players and PS3's (built in blue ray) are the only thing that can play 1080p and if your not going to get one, your basically spending money on technology that 1) basically you can't view until you get a blue ray player & 2) is new and therefore still over priced.

I don't have any experience with the JVC TV, but I have always been a fan of Sony's TV's. In fact Sony is going to be terminating their tube, projection & plasma TV market for the LCD line in the near future to focus on just LCD technology.

That is not quite correct. Todays RPTVs have very good viewing angles (right around 130-145 degrees on most models, which is more than most people will ever use). It is definitely worth 1080p as well due to the fact that TVs can convert 1080i to 1080p when proper deinterlacing technologies are used (which all current generations use in some form and the JVC's Genessa processing suite really does well). That and besides Blu-Ray, HD DVD also has 1080p content on the disc at generally half the cost of Blu-Ray, so 1080p is certainly more than worth it. Besides, do you really want to buy a new TV in two to three years when 1080p sources become widely available?

And as far as the JVC TVs are concerned, quite a few people on the board own the HD-ILA sets and they all seem to be very happy (I being one of them). One final note, Sony already did cancel their plasma project about two years ago, but the SXRD rear projection is still moving and moving fast with no plans of removal. And while the tube production has been reduced, it is also still very much alive.

Edit: Also gaming on the JVCs do not exhibit any gaming lag what-so-ever, so feel free to hook up even your NES without a hitch.

[InVeNtOr]

this is why i am not upgrading to an 1080p tv...yet...

to get all the quality you need:

1080p tv

blue ray player (around $1000)

blue ray disks

blue ray processor (if you use the hdmi)

all equals way toooooo much $ if you got it, go ahead. wait a few years and it will all be much cheaper. there is a difference in quality. if you have a sony store near you go there and see the difference. there is a difference, but is it worth the cost to have to upgrade EVERYTHING.

good luck in your decision.

[JJkizak]

In the last few days Sony has introduced a new Bluray player for $500.00 to compete with the Toshiba player ($499.00). Unfortunately the TV business is becoming like the computer business---upgrade every year. It seems after 3 or 4 months you are 2 generations behind. What do we do when the holographic discs are introduced?

JJK

[tastyratz]

1080p is hype, dont bother.

I think it was cnet, but they did a thing where they hooked up like 6 hdtvs and ran them in different modes to see if they could see the difference in the most intensive movies. they watched mission impossible 3 and they said (from memory dont quote me) the difference between 1080i and 1080p could be seen if you looked at the photo frame on the distant wall in the back ground in a fast moving shot while watching side by side and straining your eyes up close.

does that sound worth it to you?

dont waste your money on a useless technology. 1080p is overkill and a placebo in many cases. You might see the difference on an extremely high end 72" tv. The likelyhood of seeing 1080p signals on anything through a cable or over the air is nilch for an EXTREMELY long time. We dont have the capacity to send the signal its enormous, and even if we did it would be so compressed you would do better with a 1080i image thats less compressed.

Signals dont look that different on lcd or plasmas, dont forget they are progressive by nature and all images are converted as such. You are better off getting a higher quality 1080i or 720p set than wasting your money on a 1080p set unless you want to get into the really big money tv's. A low end 1080p set that costs as much as a mid end 1080i or 720p set will look like trash in comparison.

If you go plasma I highly recommend getting a panasonic. I picked one up myself a few months ago after seeing so many rant reviews and people saying that basically its second only to pioneer tvs but not by far. I agree, does not appear anyone makes a set that comes close for the money.

[JJkizak]

tastyratz:

My experience with my eyes says you are totally incorrect.

JJK

[erickoegle]

Viewing angle isn't really that much of a problem because the places to sit are at least 12 ft away. While it would be nice to go LCD or Plasma, keep in mind I want at least 50", it just is not really practical since I will be spending probably less than 1800$ tax included.

[tastyratz]

http://reviews.cnet.com/4520-6449_7-6661274-1.html

"Ultimately, we agree with the Imaging Science Foundation (ISF), a group
that consults for home-theater manufacturers and trains professional
video calibrators, when it says that the most important aspect of
picture quality is contrast ratio, the second-most important is color saturation,
and the third is color accuracy. Though resolution may be the most
talked-about spec these days, it comes in fourth on the ISF list, and
after you sit watching five TVs lined up side by side, you understand why"

------

It also largely depends on the source.
If you want to compare a comcast 720p signal to a blueray 1080p theres
no contest. Blueray has alot more bandwith for the signal and being
much less compressed you will see a much better picture regardless. HDtv through satellite or cable providers is compressed so much its barely still HD.

When you have done your comparison you used different things, there were many variables.

Blind studies have proved that people also perceive a tv thats larger as being higher quality even if its not.

Try sitting a decent distance away from your tv. Use the same source blueray player but tell the device to output a max resolution of 1080i instead of 1080p. You should have an extremely hard time seeing the difference if your even able to spot it at all. Dont forget since you have an lcd its a progressive display regardless of input, and if your stare at a still image you should NOT see ANY difference. If its a fast moving image you MIGHT be able to detect SOME clarity differences mainly on edges.

Its up to the person buying the tv of course, and it really depends alot on what youll be feeding the device. I doubt we will be seeing any 1080p signals broadcast over the air because of the bandwidth it requires and the fcc bandwith limit assigned to stations for the current HDTV standard.

as far as the xbox 360 goes 1080p has been a bumpy road, and you wont see very many games that do well in 1080p so with gaming 720p is more likely to be the signal (or closer to the actual output resolution)

As far as hdtv broadcast OTA or via pay feed you wont be seeing a 1080p channel anytime soon.

The main question erick is if you want to go 1080p for hddvd or blueray alone. Right now in this instance I cant see it being worth spending the money. Comparing the displays in the store is always very hard to do because they use wildly in-accurate calibrations from the manufacturer to make them stand out on the floor. Keep up on reviews, maybe see if anyone you know nearby is sporting specific technologies where you can see it first hand and use it as a baseline for comparison?

Ive recently picked up my whole klipsch synergy from a friend at best buy for about half cost, the markdown is phenominal.

The 42" plasma I have is this one which has unbelievable rant rave reviews online, and gets a definite thumbs up from me

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=7679185&type=product&productCategoryId=pcmcat95100050005&id=1134703131623

they also have a 50" version

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=7679238&type=product&productCategoryId=pcmcat95100050005&id=1134702980410

Price is 2000 on sale for the 50", im sure that with your friends discount you may be able to get it very reasonably within your range.

P.S. dont mind my ADD structure, Ive posted this from work and added to it in pieces

[Darien]

You can pick up a Panasonic Plasma for that Money here http://6ave.com/product.jsp?x=TH50PX60U. I also bought the panasonic and just like everyone else says about them, they are second only to Pioneer and its a close second. Actually from all my experience only the Sony LCD flat panels look better! And the Pioneer Elite models.

Check prices on the Plasmas, Here is an authorized reseller online (retains factory warrenty)

www.plasmaplanet.com (where I bought my plasma 2 years ago.)

www.6ave.com (watch thier sale fliers, always end up with amazing deals on TV's)

www.abesofmaine.com These guys now have a retail store in NJ, Great prices on select TV's

[klipschaholik]

I purchased the JVC pro model HD-P61R1U from Tiger Direct in January. They had them on sale for $1,899 I believe with free shipping. Living in FL I had to pay taxes which brought the delivered price to right at 2 grand. This is my first big screen and I'm satisfied with the set. You will not get as good a quality in analogue as a regular set because the big screen's resolution. But man the HD will blow you away. I've stopped watching almost anything but HD channels now. What really burns me up though is that our cable company can't get FOX in HD because they say FOX is owned by Direct TV and won't negotiate a deal with Cox cable. I do recieve the other three networks in HD.

Hhttp://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=618408&page=117&pp=30ere's a forum link you may want to view. It covers the JVC's and other sets.

This set is 1080p display so it upgrades the signal. It won't accept 1080p though. Everything I've read though is that for the distance your viewing and the sceen size you won't see the difference. Tiger is sold out again but they may get more so you may watch their site or search for one on the net.

Good luck, It's tough making the decision; it was for me but I'm happy with what I got.

gk

[Arky]

I got my Samsung plasma from tigerdirect also. Great price & came on a pallet via ABF freightline.

[erickoegle]

Allright, taken into consideration. I think I may just wait out until it gets into this summer before I make a decision. It seems like any DLP tv has come down in price substantially. I would really like to get an LCD or Plasma, but Ill just do a bit more research. I just checked the ads this morning and noticed a few SXRD's on sale. I know of a couple of placed near me that would let me demo whatever I want, so Ill check into that. Thanks a bunch for all the suggestions.

[el jopez]

For gaming go with a LCD, they are the best for that medium with Plasma coming in dead last. Something with plasma having burn in issues still... its a waste of money.

DLP is a mixed bag of goodness. Great picture at great price point, but my god did they lag. The current new gen of DLP's should have less image lag than last years models, and trust me they were bad! nothing like playing Halo 2 on Live or Tekken and have no idea what your doing since your sense of timing is all off [:@]. However, my friend just bought a new 46" Samsung DLP, piano "sex" black gloss and it plays games pretty well. I was able to get through with Gears thinking I was on either a CRT or LCD. Moral of story, do your research on specific DLP models!

Gaming is so expensive.