tommyboy Posted March 4, 2007 Share Posted March 4, 2007 So I was all set to re-enlist in the world's greatest Air Force. But now I have to "compete" for my job. The AF is laying off 70,000 troops, and I may be one of them. I'll find out any time between now and Feb 08. My family and I were supposed to go home in May for the month, but plans have now changed. I don't want to risk going home, then returning to work, just tofind out that I have to get out. That would be 30 days of leave, and about 2,500 bucks wasted if they give me the boot. I would like to "preach" to you forum members about something for a minute. I haven't seen my Mom, & Dad in over 2 years. I haven't seen my sister in over 5 years. Her husbands in the Navy, and with me in the AF, that makes it really difficult to be home at the same time. Especially with me being overseas. None of them have seen our baby boy yet either. (He's 6 months old now) So what I would like to preach about is don't take the people in your life for granted. Especially family. I know it's hard, when you see people everyday. But just imagine if you couldn't see your family for a long period of time. It may be another year or so until I get to finally see my family. So parents, grab your children and give them a big hug, and tell them how much you love them. And children, do the same for your parents. And NEVER forget about the sacrifices our troops make everyday to ensure that you have the freedom to listen to your Klipsch systems when and how loud you want to! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coytee Posted March 4, 2007 Share Posted March 4, 2007 I'd type a response but I'm too busy tipping my hat of respect to you. You make some good points. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators dtel's wife Posted March 4, 2007 Moderators Share Posted March 4, 2007 tommy, dtel and I were up until 4:00 this morning talking about life, family etc. Your post mentions one of the subjects we discussed.. Life is so short...enjoy your limited time here on earth, strive for personal happiness and be sure to tell the ones that matter the most how much you love them every chance you get. I know military pay isn't the greatest in the world and $2500.00 is a lot of money, but maybe you should reread your own post and reconsider your options. Our utmost respect goes out to you and your family. It is folks like you that allow us to enjoy the freedoms we have. I hope everything works out for the best for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldbuckster Posted March 4, 2007 Share Posted March 4, 2007 How can they lay-off Air Force personnel on one hand, and talk about starting the DRAFT back up on the other ? Very strange times we are living in, very strange indeed. Best of Luck to you tommyboy in whatever you decide to do...........GOD BLESS US ALL..................... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tommyboy Posted March 4, 2007 Author Share Posted March 4, 2007 tommy, dtel and I were up until 4:00 this morning talking about life, family etc. Your post mentions one of the subjects we discussed.. Life is so short...enjoy your limited time here on earth, strive for personal happiness and be sure to tell the ones that matter the most how much you love them every chance you get. I know military pay isn't the greatest in the world and $2500.00 is a lot of money, but maybe you should reread your own post and reconsider your options. Our utmost respect goes out to you and your family. It is folks like you that allow us to enjoy the freedoms we have. I hope everything works out for the best for you. It's not so much they money. In the military, if you separate, you get what's called terminal leave. Right now, I have 31 days of leave. My enlistment is up on the 7th of May, 2008. If I don't take any leave until then, I'll have about 70 days. Now terminal leave is when the military still pays you for however much time terminal you have. So it's in my best interest to not take any time now, then if I do get separated, I'll have about 70 days to find a home, job, etc, and still get paid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tommyboy Posted March 4, 2007 Author Share Posted March 4, 2007 How can they lay-off Air Force personnel on one hand, and talk about starting the DRAFT back up on the other ? Very strange times we are living in, very strange indeed. Best of Luck to you tommyboy in whatever you decide to do...........GOD BLESS US ALL..................... I don't see a draft happening. I know you hear the word "draft" sometimeson the news and all, but I don't think so. Congress sets a number of personnel each branch can have. They somehow didn't pay attention to the Air force, and realized that they had wayyyyyy too many troops. (about 100,000 too many) They can't continue to pay every troop, keep the airplanes flying, and support a war at the same time. Wars expensive I guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators dtel's wife Posted March 4, 2007 Moderators Share Posted March 4, 2007 I understand the situation a little better now. Tommyboy, things will work out for the best, it always does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldbuckster Posted March 4, 2007 Share Posted March 4, 2007 The Draft was only suspended, not eliminated................You know what's best for you tommyboy.....GOOD LUCK.!!!!!!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arky Posted March 4, 2007 Share Posted March 4, 2007 Tommy I appreciate your comments & your service. Thank You. If i'm honest it's a job I do not want but had I been drafted I would have served proudly. My dad was in Korea & decorated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverSport Posted March 4, 2007 Share Posted March 4, 2007 Thank you for your Service...come home safe, My cousin is near retirement and an F-16 Mecahnic. My Aunt told me he is getting redeployed to the Sandbox. Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tommyboy Posted March 4, 2007 Author Share Posted March 4, 2007 Hey, thanks for all ya'lls support. Life sometimes throws obstacles right in your way, and this is one of those times. I guess just an example of life not being fair. My biggest concern is Health insurance. I never had any until I joined, so Id on't even know how any of that works. But I have a wife and son to look after now, so I'm in a little different ball game now. It will all work out though. Gotta stay optimistic right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbsl Posted March 4, 2007 Share Posted March 4, 2007 If you do have to get out remember family and friends are what can help get you thru the hard times. I did 4 years in the AF from 1983-87 and after I got out without my family and close friends I don't know if I would have made it. I hope everything works out for you and the family!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators dtel's wife Posted March 4, 2007 Moderators Share Posted March 4, 2007 Hey, thanks for all ya'lls support. Life sometimes throws obstacles right in your way, and this is one of those times. I guess just an example of life not being fair. My biggest concern is Health insurance. I never had any until I joined, so Id on't even know how any of that works. But I have a wife and son to look after now, so I'm in a little different ball game now. It will all work out though. Gotta stay optimistic right? Hey Tommyboy, Maybe this will give you a little boost. Our neighbor was forced to retire (Army) two years ago. He is now in a "civillian contracting" position with the Army. He makes almost twice as much as he did while in the service. It will all work out. What do you have if you don't have hope????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg928gts Posted March 4, 2007 Share Posted March 4, 2007 Thank you Tommyboy. Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bodcaw boy Posted March 4, 2007 Share Posted March 4, 2007 God bless you tommyboy! and thank you for your service from me and all those that support you and our military. have a blessed day, roy delgado Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaleR Posted March 5, 2007 Share Posted March 5, 2007 Tommyboy, As a member of our beloved Air Force for the past 22 years, I have "survived" my share of drawdowns, and I can empathize with you to a certain degree. However, even though it appears you might be "layed off" from the service, you do still have a lot of control over your destiny. I do not know your specific situation, but I'll assume that you are coming to the end of your first enlistment and you are trying to secure a career job reservation in your field. I'll spare the "AF-speak" for the rest of the folks, but as you mentioned the Air Force, like the other services, has a Congressionally-mandated "cap" on the number of personnel who can serve on active duty at any one time. The need for people to perform certain types of jobs ebbs and flows with mission changes, and therefore the Air Force must make adjustments to stay under our cap. This has happened several times since the 70's. The Air Force is currently looking to "right-size" about 40,000 people from the force. I don't know where you got your 70,000 figure from. Because of the cap, the Air Force can only retain so many personnel per year in each field, and I understand you might feel like you're "competing" for your job. I went through the same process during my first enlistment. Unfortunately, the sad fact is not everyone can stay in the Air Force who wants to. Sometimes we have to let good people go. If that happens to you, I hope you take your experience, coupled with your G.I. Bill, and chart a positive course for your family's future. Having said that, you still can control your situation. If you are in an "over-manned" field, you might consider retraining into another field that is under-manned. The Air Force is critically under-manned in several fields, and retraining may be a way to prevent being forced out, as well as ensure you continue to receive the benefits you've come to depend on to support your family. I would ask you to harken back and consider why you joined the Air Force in the first place. If you joined to do a "job" then it's understandable you might feel the Air Force is pulling the rug out from under you. However, if you joined to serve your country, then being open to the needs of the Air Force and retraining into a critical field will show that you are a team player; someone we can count on when the chips are down. As for being separated from family, I have been separated from my family more times than I care to admit, including long overseas tours, remote assignments where I couldn't take family along, and, most recently, serving in Iraq. At the risk of "preaching", that's what you signed up for, bud! Remember our core values, the second one being "Service Before Self." The needs of the Air Force come first. If you can't abide by that principle, I submit that it may be time you do seek a career change. You hit the nail on the head when you talked about not taking loved ones for granted. Money is a large consideration, to be sure, but I'm not sure I would forgo seeing my family on the chance I might be leaving the service. Some things in life are worth more than the money they cost. I want to close by saying a heartfelt "Thank You!" to you, and your family, for your service and the sacrifices you've made and will make in the future. It takes a special kind of person to serve our country. Whether you do get out of the Air Force, or serve an entire career, I hope you continue to serve our country honorably, and always be mindful of the reason we wear the uniform, to keep America strong and free. Dale Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tommyboy Posted March 5, 2007 Author Share Posted March 5, 2007 Tommyboy, As a member of our beloved Air Force for the past 22 years, I have "survived" my share of drawdowns, and I can empathize with you to a certain degree. However, even though it appears you might be "layed off" from the service, you do still have a lot of control over your destiny. I do not know your specific situation, but I'll assume that you are coming to the end of your first enlistment and you are trying to secure a career job reservation in your field. I'll spare the "AF-speak" for the rest of the folks, but as you mentioned the Air Force, like the other services, has a Congressionally-mandated "cap" on the number of personnel who can serve on active duty at any one time. The need for people to perform certain types of jobs ebbs and flows with mission changes, and therefore the Air Force must make adjustments to stay under our cap. This has happened several times since the 70's. The Air Force is currently looking to "right-size" about 40,000 people from the force. I don't know where you got your 70,000 figure from. Because of the cap, the Air Force can only retain so many personnel per year in each field, and I understand you might feel like you're "competing" for your job. I went through the same process during my first enlistment. Unfortunately, the sad fact is not everyone can stay in the Air Force who wants to. Sometimes we have to let good people go. If that happens to you, I hope you take your experience, coupled with your G.I. Bill, and chart a positive course for your family's future. Having said that, you still can control your situation. If you are in an "over-manned" field, you might consider retraining into another field that is under-manned. The Air Force is critically under-manned in several fields, and retraining may be a way to prevent being forced out, as well as ensure you continue to receive the benefits you've come to depend on to support your family. I would ask you to harken back and consider why you joined the Air Force in the first place. If you joined to do a "job" then it's understandable you might feel the Air Force is pulling the rug out from under you. However, if you joined to serve your country, then being open to the needs of the Air Force and retraining into a critical field will show that you are a team player; someone we can count on when the chips are down. As for being separated from family, I have been separated from my family more times than I care to admit, including long overseas tours, remote assignments where I couldn't take family along, and, most recently, serving in Iraq. At the risk of "preaching", that's what you signed up for, bud! Remember our core values, the second one being "Service Before Self." The needs of the Air Force come first. If you can't abide by that principle, I submit that it may be time you do seek a career change. You hit the nail on the head when you talked about not taking loved ones for granted. Money is a large consideration, to be sure, but I'm not sure I would forgo seeing my family on the chance I might be leaving the service. Some things in life are worth more than the money they cost. I want to close by saying a heartfelt "Thank You!" to you, and your family, for your service and the sacrifices you've made and will make in the future. It takes a special kind of person to serve our country. Whether you do get out of the Air Force, or serve an entire career, I hope you continue to serve our country honorably, and always be mindful of the reason we wear the uniform, to keep America strong and free. Dale Yes, I am trying to get a CJR. They are cutting about 1/3 of my career field (survival equipment)/ parachute rigger. As far as cross training goes, I was originally disqualified to join the service due to my eyesight. I failed the depth perception test, and am legally color blind, and this was the ONLY job they would let me do at that time. So I don't even know if retraining is an option for me or not. I did join to serve my country, but I was single then. I like the military lifestyle, and at the same time, would like to secure our family's future. As far as the 70,000 people goes, that's just what they told us at a briefing one day. You are right about sometimes the good people have to go, I have seen many leave in the 4.5 years that I've been in. When I went to MPF to start my CJR process, they looked it up in their computers. They printed me off a "RIP" that said my CJR would start automatically, and I would have to compete for it. Literally, that's what it said. I will get a rip every month saying what # I am on the list, and how good or bad I did in the prior month. For a little minute there, it sounded like maybe you thought I was disgruntal or something. Believe me, I'm not. They have been talkin this "force shaping" stuff since I came in, so it's no surprise to me or anything like that. It takes a lot to get me down, especially things like this. It's totally out of my hands, and there's nothing I can do, so why be upset right? I totally understand that these things happen. I have served my time so far to the absolute best of my ability. On a brighter note, I feel like I might be OK though. All my EPR'S so far have been 5's, and I made staff in the short time that Ive been in. I have NEVER had any kind of negative paperwork, have never failed a fitness test, or anything like that. But if they do separate me, please don't think that I"m going to be disgruntal or anything like that. People get layed off everyday. I will definitely use my GI bill, and go from there. I didn't pay into it for nothing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tommyboy Posted March 5, 2007 Author Share Posted March 5, 2007 I forgot to mention what they're evaluating on for the competition. Date of rank, assignment history, top 3 EPR's, and age. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flannj Posted March 5, 2007 Share Posted March 5, 2007 Hey, thanks for all ya'lls support. Life sometimes throws obstacles right in your way, and this is one of those times. I guess just an example of life not being fair. My biggest concern is Health insurance. I never had any until I joined, so Id on't even know how any of that works. But I have a wife and son to look after now, so I'm in a little different ball game now. It will all work out though. Gotta stay optimistic right? Hey Tommyboy, Maybe this will give you a little boost. Our neighbor was forced to retire (Army) two years ago. He is now in a "civillian contracting" position with the Army. He makes almost twice as much as he did while in the service. It will all work out. What do you have if you don't have hope????? Similar situation for my best friend from college. He is / was a Chief Warrant Officer in the Army. Interrogator and interpreter have been his main duties. I don't know exactly how many years he has been in the service but he went to college on the GI Bill in the seventies and is currently 50 years old. Given the nature of his work he would "disappear" for 6 months to a couple of years at a time. No one knew where he was and he wasn't allowed to tell us. All of a sudden he would reappear and we would be happy to have him in our life again for a couple of weeks. My kids adore him and he is a terrific example for them. After 3 tours in Iraq (including the first Gulf War) he has ended his Army career and believes he is in the clear and won't be called back (although he has been wrong about that before). He is now a private contractor trying to straighten out the mess at Guantanamo and making a lot more money, which he deserves. His wife has just been sent to Iraq for her second tour... they haven't seen each other for more than 2 years. My wife and I worry about him constantly, he has told us about some rather close calls (while sleeping blown out of his bunk and buried by a wall from a bomb explosion just outside of his quarters). It seems stupid, but I am getting emotional just typing this. I can't thank him enough for the service he provides his country and to you Tommyboy I say thank you in the same way. Good luck to you. - Jim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigStewMan Posted March 6, 2007 Share Posted March 6, 2007 good luck to you man. here's a little advice, it's never to early to start preparing for the next phase of your life. there is peace in preparation. i retired from the coast guard a few years ago. they told us to start preparing two years before our retirement date. if you don't have your college degree, start working on it now. i didn't and it's quite humbling having to start from the bottom all over again in a new organization. you can make. don't give up hope and take advantage of the time and opportunities that you still have available to you. if you get to stay in the air force, that's great; if not, you'll be better prepared to start anew. best wishes to you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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