mas Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 Hahahaha.... One submission, an "oops" error message, and 3 posts! Well, in this case, the posts are worth repeating. So, what is the list of "bad" major brand amplifiers that we must avoid? Acoustics are definately not worth worrying about. Its a known fact that all of the best studios ONLY worry about what amplifiers they have, and they always have them modified with exotic kapacitators. That's what keeps Russ Berger busy...changing out kaps... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mas Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 been there done that, get off solid state stuff (great for other speakers, not Klipsch) and move into tubes. (you can leave cdp solid-state no problems). Miracles do happen. (forget about acoustics...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 In my limited experience it is possible to minimize the effect of the room by going nearfield. Try placing the speakers about 4 feet apart and then sit a similar distance from the centre line between the 2 - you can play a little with the height of your chair. You can also play with the toe-in angles to see if there is any position that sounds better in that configuration. I agree that going nearfield will certainly reduce the effects of the room, but you can't sit closer than the covergance point of the drivers....otherwise you end up with a very disconnected sound that I would describe as having no bass and unclear mids. With the Refrence lineup, you need to be about 10 feet back in order to get full convergance from their floorstanders. Somewhere around 5 feet for their bookshelf speakers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 I've dealt with countless different rooms with varying acoustic problems and have never had to resort to acoustic treatments to get acceptable sound. This "accetable sound" was the opinion of many people hearing the systems in question sometimes in the hundreds count. I do however play with speaker/system placement for all of about 30 minutes or so. Now with that said I'm sure that the sound could of been improved in some of these rooms no denying that. My point here is if the system is putting out acceptable sound and placement is optimized the room will not and can not take it to the point of a person wanting to "cut his ears off". What about your booth at AK Fest last summer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garymd Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 I've dealt with countless different rooms with varying acoustic problems and have never had to resort to acoustic treatments to get acceptable sound. This "accetable sound" was the opinion of many people hearing the systems in question sometimes in the hundreds count. I do however play with speaker/system placement for all of about 30 minutes or so. Now with that said I'm sure that the sound could of been improved in some of these rooms no denying that. My point here is if the system is putting out acceptable sound and placement is optimized the room will not and can not take it to the point of a person wanting to "cut his ears off". What about your booth at AK Fest last summer? I think that is the room to which he is referring. One of those "fests" anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryC Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joshnich Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 I agree with Gary before he said he was joking. A while back, my brother in law who would always go gaga listening to my stereo bought a pair of RF 7s on my recommendation. Took them home and hooked them up to his very expensive Denon receiver and was immediately on the phone mad at me because the speakers sounded so crappy. I took over a NOS Valves 299 and problem solved. End of story. Josh I was joking about joking. Well said Dean. My basement system is proof that good gear can sound good in a bad room. I remember replacing my trusty Kenwood KR-9600 receiver I'd used with my Cornwalls for over 20 years with a Sony ES HT receiver and couldn't believe how bad it sounded. I ended up with tubes not long after that but there's no way I would have been able to live with the Sony in 2-channel after all those years with a good SS amp (in a really good room too!). I guess what I'm saying is there's no way that setup will sound good IMO unless you're used to really crappy 2-channel sound. Been there, done that. For the record I knew you were joking. However, I am not sure others here are! Josh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prego Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 mas, great reference. 1. The guy's budget doesn't probably apply paul klipsch's solid-state amp level. 2. paul is doing a wierd deduction, using the analogy between ss vs. tubes applied to capciators, while the latter is included in the former. But of course, no doubts whatsoever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mas Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 mas, great reference. 1. The guy's budget doesn't probably apply paul klipsch's solid-state amp level. 2. paul is doing a wierd deduction, using the analogy between ss vs. tubes applied to capciators, while the latter is included in the former. But of course, no doubts whatsoever. Crown D75A. 35W/channel. It should cost no more than $175 in pristine condition. List $973 If you want ridculous power levels and a no fault 3year/6 year warranty for $500 delivered, Crown XTi 1000: Crown XTi 1000 Power Amplifier Refurb 700W/ch @ 2 ohms, 500W/ch @ 4 ohms, 275W/ch @ 8 ohms, 1,400W bridged mono @ 4 ohms, 1,000W bridged mono @ 8 ohms. Price: $379.99 Crown XTi 1000 Power Amplifier 700W/ch @ 2 ohms, 500W/ch @ 4 ohms, 275W/ch @ 8 ohms, 1,400W bridged mono @ 4 ohms, 1,000W bridged mono @ 8 ohms. Price: $499.99 Item Ships Free! List Price: $818.00 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaspr Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 Nice amps...even has EQ built in...now if we just had a thread on how to use EQ...[] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 Mmmmm XTi...I must confess that I'm rather surprised how nice they sound (especially considering the price and the huge feature set). Time-alignment anyone? [A] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators dtel Posted October 4, 2007 Moderators Share Posted October 4, 2007 I think you may have been right from the beginning, cut off your ears and see if that helps with the high frequencies, let us know how it works ? But whatever you do keep the RF's and the Denon, we want pic's though for proof ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaspr Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 Mmmmm XTi...I must confess that I'm rather surprised how nice they sound (especially considering the price and the huge feature set). Time-alignment anyone? [A] Not enough time alignment for a k-horn...only 5mS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted October 5, 2007 Share Posted October 5, 2007 I'm reading up to 50ms of delay in the manual... http://www.crownaudio.com/pdf/amps/139548.pdf (page 24) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnyholiday Posted October 5, 2007 Share Posted October 5, 2007 which mode? direct mode ? stereo mode?,...distances,levels.... whats the set up menu have the speakers set as, small or large {if using stereo mode},....is the sub output set on or off{if using stereo mode},....room pix?......total dimensions?... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxg Posted October 5, 2007 Share Posted October 5, 2007 In my limited experience it is possible to minimize the effect of the room by going nearfield. Try placing the speakers about 4 feet apart and then sit a similar distance from the centre line between the 2 - you can play a little with the height of your chair. You can also play with the toe-in angles to see if there is any position that sounds better in that configuration. I agree that going nearfield will certainly reduce the effects of the room, but you can't sit closer than the covergance point of the drivers....otherwise you end up with a very disconnected sound that I would describe as having no bass and unclear mids. With the Refrence lineup, you need to be about 10 feet back in order to get full convergance from their floorstanders. Somewhere around 5 feet for their bookshelf speakers. 10 feet is more than I would have expected (means no near field listening option) but I am not that familiar with the reference line. The heresy's I used to have worked fine at around 4 feet in an equilateral triangle with the listener. I recently did something not dissimilar with a pair of large Maggie's and they were fine at around 4 or 5 feet in a dreadful room. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cjgeraci Posted October 5, 2007 Share Posted October 5, 2007 Uh oh........[:$] ................[*-)] (Edit: either the long arm of the law (e.g. - moderators) swooped in to pull Craig's post or he pulled it himself) No offense, Max, but I would not put emoticons in response to your comments. The truth hurts. Carl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damonrpayne Posted October 5, 2007 Share Posted October 5, 2007 mas, great reference. 1. The guy's budget doesn't probably apply paul klipsch's solid-state amp level. 2. paul is doing a wierd deduction, using the analogy between ss vs. tubes applied to capciators, while the latter is included in the former. But of course, no doubts whatsoever. Crown D75A. 35W/channel. It should cost no more than $175 in pristine condition. List $973 If you want ridculous power levels and a no fault 3year/6 year warranty for $500 delivered, Crown XTi 1000: Crown XTi 1000 Power Amplifier Refurb 700W/ch @ 2 ohms, 500W/ch @ 4 ohms, 275W/ch @ 8 ohms, 1,400W bridged mono @ 4 ohms, 1,000W bridged mono @ 8 ohms. Price: $379.99 Crown XTi 1000 Power Amplifier 700W/ch @ 2 ohms, 500W/ch @ 4 ohms, 275W/ch @ 8 ohms, 1,400W bridged mono @ 4 ohms, 1,000W bridged mono @ 8 ohms. Price: $499.99 Item Ships Free! List Price: $818.00 Oooh, I want one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted October 6, 2007 Share Posted October 6, 2007 Uh oh........[:$] ................[*-)] (Edit: either the long arm of the law (e.g. - moderators) swooped in to pull Craig's post or he pulled it himself) No offense, Max, but I would not put emoticons in response to your comments. The truth hurts. Carl. Yea it does LOL!! but evidently I'm not allowed to speak the truth if it hurts [] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cjgeraci Posted October 6, 2007 Share Posted October 6, 2007 No, not when the teacher's pet is involved .................................. Carl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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