ka7niq Posted April 5, 2009 Author Share Posted April 5, 2009 Dual 6 inch approx ports, on CF 4 Version 1 only. later version 2 and version 3 had dual 3 inch approx ports Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelHans Posted January 29, 2011 Share Posted January 29, 2011 This thread just might not die! I have a pair of Cf-3 with duel 4" ports. They where made on the 41st day of 1995. I know I must sound wrong on the 4" port but I can Post a picture with a Tape measure and yes the plastic ring is present. Have you ever heard of this? These are version 2s correct? Also I'm using a Pioneer Elite VSX-49TX it has an option for Bi-amping along with an option for setting the crossover frequency to 50hz, 80hz, 100hz or 200hz What is the best for these speakers? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gagelle Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 Hi, I have a pair of CF3s, first version. The serial number begins with 2464 and they have 6 in. ports. I was previously running them with a Harman Kardon AVR 20 with 50 watts as a 2 channel system and they were the best sounding speakers that I ever owned. I never had to turn the volume up even half way to get very loud output. I'm now putting together a home theater using a Harman Kardon AVR 3600 rated about 80 watts per channel with all channels driven. A few months ago I bought a pair of Forte 1 speakers for a very good price that I started using in the front of a my 5.1 channel sysyem. I was starting to despair of getting these different speakers to blend but I finally adjusted the receiver to get an excellent sound. I put the amplifier settings up all the way on the CF3s and put the volume down to less than half way on the forte speakers. I put my Academy center channel up a little higher than my Fortes. Yeaterday, I put on a Blue-Ray copy of Kubrick's 2001 and I was simply "blown away" by the sound and picture quality on my 40 in. Sharp Aquos LED TV. (At one point in the film, I thought someone was knocking on my door. I was momentarily startled until I realized it was coming from my left CF3! I recently ordered a new set of Cornwall 3s and was going to sell my CF3s because I thought the Fortes would make better rear channels. Now I'm not so sure. The Forte 1's sound is very good but lack the full bass output of the CF3s. I have a Klipsch RW12D sub which takes care of the missing bass. When I get the Cornwall 3s, I'm still debating which speakers to use in the rear. I would think the Fortes would have similar sound characteristics to the Cornwalls as they are both part of the "Heresy series." I have decided, However, not to sell the CF3s because as they say, these speakers, although less efficient than the Heresy speakers, have a wounderful, full, and balanced sound if given enough power. On another subject, the Forte upgrades I've read about on this forum: do they require soldering and other advanced skills to install? I am a complete novice in speaker repair and upgrades. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edroom Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 I had a pair of cf-3's for years, i loved them until I picked up a pair of Cornwall 2's at a sale. I A - B' ed them against each other and truthfully the cornwalls made the Epics sound like a transistor radio in comparison! I sold off the Epics right after that, sold em on e bay for 300 bucks - Doh! wish I had kept em, don't know what version they were but I hadn't realy been bitten by the Klipsch bug yet. Once I got my Klipschorns is when the the bug hit me and now I have like 10 pairs all over the place! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gagelle Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 I would love Klipschhorns but don't have a big enough room. The bug hit me when I got the Fortes. I couldn't believe the sound and efficiency of those speakers. I will probably use them as rear speakers to my new Cornwalls, although I would like to upgrade them if I am able to. I'll probably move the cf-3s into another room. One thing I noticed about them (CF-3s) is that they need a high quality amplifier or they sound kind of muddy. They always put out clean sound with my Harman Kardon equipment but when I played them with a Dennon, loss of sound quality was noticable. Everything is so much less complicated with just two music speakers. Some other suprisingly good speakers is the KG series. I had some KG-1s and couldn't believe the sound those small speakers put out. I gave them to my ex-wife and now regret it. How do those small speakers put out such expansive sound? I can only imagine how good the big ones are. But after experiencing the Fortes, I decided to stay with the "Heritage" series. Perhaps I'll get lucky one day and find a pair of used Cornwalls for a good price and use them in the rear. Prices now on Ebay are very high for used Cornwalls. The reference series seems easier to match for a home theater system. I don't know much about them, although I read that some people were very happy when the RF-7s were brought back. I'm also confused with the choices of upgrades between Crites and ALK engeneering. The ALK crossover for the Fortes comes as a kit and would seem to require some advanced skills to assemble and install. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edroom Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 anyone else compare epics to Heritage series? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelHans Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 I have heard so many good things about the Cornwalls, maybe I will pick up a pair down the road. I picked up my Epic CF3 (found out they are version 2s) fairly cheap for $250. So I started down the Epic path and pickup a pair of CF-1s cheap as well for my rear. Then RV-4 for the center (on its way right now) and a RSW-15 as Sub. Music sounds pretty good, these epic speakers are picky about everything placement, amp used, wiring you name it these speakers ***** about it. As far as surround I like this set even more. Although I feel the RSW-15 works better for Music than Movies. What is a Fair price for Cornwalls??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelHans Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 As far as the KG line I wasn't that impressed with the KG 5.2s I owned I didn't really like them no matter what I hooked them up too.They where clean sounding but lacked for me. But I have a pair of KG-2.5 for my Computer and I love those. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cnguyen Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 I recently bought a pair of CF3 and what I hear so far are the most well-balanced speakers in the Klipsch line. I'm driving these speakers with either Mc7100 solid state or MC275 ver V tube amps and the both sound great. Actuall the cf3 beat out the Forte II that I have as far as dynamics and clarities.The bass is also fuller and more articulated than the Forte II. Definitely the cf3s are more detailed than any K speakers I've heard so far. I also didn't hear any overwhelming/hot mid range like original poster stated. I'd check the xover over in your case. Happy listening!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cubdog Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 I bought my third pair of CF3s today and my first pair of version 1. My other two pair see HT duty. After I sold my RF7IIs I started searching for replacements for them in my 2 channel rig. I decided that I liked the CF3s so much that if I found a pair of 3s or 4s version 1 and somewhat local I'd buy them. That's what happened this week and I just got them set up. So far so good. They do sound different than version 2s but I can't say anything definative yet as I'm just one album in. More later. Does anyone else own three pair of CF3s or am I just crazy? cubdog Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moray james Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 good on you for keeping this thread alive. So do you have three different crossovers? There were some cap value changes to smooth the horn out. Check them out when you can and jot down the board number and the cap values and we can compare notes. There are three versions of the network as far as I know. Best regards Moray James. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cubdog Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 good on you for keeping this thread alive. So do you have three different crossovers? There were some cap value changes to smooth the horn out. Check them out when you can and jot down the board number and the cap values and we can compare notes. There are three versions of the network as far as I know. Best regards Moray James. My guess is that I only have 2 crossovers. Without checking I believe my two version 2s have the same crossover. They are not far apart in their serial numbers. cubdog Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ka7niq Posted November 2, 2012 Author Share Posted November 2, 2012 The BEST way I have found to use the CF Series speakers is in a passive bi amp setup, using a tweeter amplifier with level controls, so u can adjust the level of the horn, relative to the midrange woofers. Te small Parasound HCA 500 is a great little amp to use on the horns. It has level controls, and is w/o glare. No, it is not tubes, but I actually prefer it to many tube amplifiers, on the CF series horn/driver combination. The little Parasound HCA 500 is a real sleeper of an amplifier for many horn speakers. Plus, they can be found for under 150.00 all day long! My Tech (also a horn owning audiophile) increases the Bias of the small Parasound a little, so it is nearly pure class a when driving just the tweeters. It is Oh So Sweet! I have also played with Capacitor changes (type NOT Value) and like Blue Clarity Caps, but only IF the speakers are not run with a tweeter amp with level controls. The Blue Clarity Caps act to smooth and mellow out the horn. But, if you are running a separate tweeter horn amp with level controls ( THE Best Way), then go to the Red Clarity Cap on the tweeter circuit. The Red Clarity Caps add "Air" on top, and helps the speakers image even better. It is so EASY to run your CF series speakers with 2 amplifiers, one for the horns, and one for the woofers. All you need to do is come out of your preamp with a one into 2 Y Connector. The "problem" with the CF series speakers is this. The Horn is run just a little bit on the Hot side. With the speakers placed up against the back wall, in an acoustically dead room, this is ok. But, when you place the speakers out from the back wall so they image properly, the Horn is a little too aggressive for much of the music we like. Only the very best recordings sound really good, and much music is almost unlistenable. Being able to control the horns level makes a HUGE difference. The "problem" with the CF series speakers is a LEVEL problem, and all the rope caulk in the world, and better caps are not gonna fix a level problem! To get the most out of the CF 3 and CF 4 speakers, the (KA7NIQ Mod) is what you need to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cubdog Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 Can this passive biamping be acomplished with a simple chip integrated amp. I have a 45 wpc T amp, a very niced one, with only a volume control. It was designed to work with a preamp although it functions as a stand alone as well. As far as changing caps I doubt this will happen. I'm not a DIYer and don't think I will start anytime soon. cubdog Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ka7niq Posted November 2, 2012 Author Share Posted November 2, 2012 Sure, your amp will work, although it would be best to have just an amplifier, instead of an integrated amplifier. The integrated amp has a pre amp in it, and in this instance, it is not needed. Go and get a pair of Y connectors at Radio Shack. Hook the single end of the Y Connector to your preamp, and then hook one of the 2 outputs of the Y to your Chip amp, and one end to your main amp. Remove the metal jumpers from the back of your speakers, then hook the outputs of the chip amp to the tweeters (horns), and the main amp will drive the woofers. Then, sit back, listen and enjoy! The volume control on your chip amp will allow you to adjust the level of the Horns! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cubdog Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 Sure, your amp will work, although it would be best to have just an amplifier, instead of an integrated amplifier. The integrated amp has a pre amp in it, and in this instance, it is not needed. Go and get a pair of Y connectors at Radio Shack. Hook the single end of the Y Connector to your preamp, and then hook one of the 2 outputs of the Y to your Chip amp, and one end to your main amp. Remove the metal jumpers from the back of your speakers, then hook the outputs of the chip amp to the tweeters (horns), and the main amp will drive the woofers. Then, sit back, listen and enjoy! The volume control on your chip amp will allow you to adjust the level of the Horns! Would these connections be the same for an amp with level controls like the Parasound? cubdog Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ka7niq Posted November 2, 2012 Author Share Posted November 2, 2012 Yes, the preamp you have sends a signal to 2 amplifiers, one for the horns, one for the woofers. The level controls on the amplifier allows you to control the level of the horns. Once you have your speakers set up this way, you will love it! Then, you will be able to adjust the level of the horns. This means that shitty bright recordings will suddenly sound good, or at least tolerable. The amp you use to power the Horns will act as a sort of "Tone Control" or Room Equalizer. Many recordings are made intentionally Bright, so they will sound good in a car. Many recording engineers feel their job is to make their recordings sound good in a car, so you will buy them. They could care less that some of us guys have systems at home the recordings will sound crappy on! Roy Delgado designed the CF Series speakers to be as flat and revealing as possible. When you play these shit recordings on speakers as good as the CF 3 and CF 4, they get revealed to be the shit recordings they are. I think, no better yet, I KNOW, it is "cruel and unusual punishment" to own CF 3 or CF 4's, and have no ability to compensate for these shit recordings. Most recordings made in the last 20 years have their entire range from 1000 hz up boosted, to overcome speaker placement in a car! Thus, conventional tone controls have limited ability to compensate. Of course, you could always use an Equalizer. The CF 3 and CF 4 speakers are ideally suited to compensate for these bad recordings, because they cross over between 1000hz and 2000hz! With the ability to control the horns level, you will be able for the first time to "un do" what the recording engineer did, and all w/o the phase shift, and other nasty things that tone controls and equalizers do to a recording! LOL, I listen to a lot of Classic Rock. I was playing Tom Petty and REO Speedwagon for a friend on bi amped CF 4 version 1's, and got accused of having a "special Telarc Recording" by him! He said "No Way can that music sound so good". He about crapped his pants when he saw it was just a regular CD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cubdog Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 I listen primarily to jazz and thankfully the recording quality is much better than alot of classic rock. There is one of the Parasounds you talk about currently available on Audiogon. My main amps are Bel Canto mono blocks. If these, the Bel Canto and Parasound, are a good combination what would be a reasonable price to pay for the Parasound? cubdog Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ka7niq Posted November 2, 2012 Author Share Posted November 2, 2012 No more then 150.00 used. I got mine used on Craigslist for 100.00, and it was so clean you could eat off of it. It is not a John Curl design, like some other Parasound amps. It was designed by the founder of Parasound himself, years ago. It has a warm, musical character overall, with great bass, for such a small amp. It was "The winner" overall, of all my many amplifiers, for driving the CF 3 and CF 4's, when I ran them full range. I have had it nearly 6 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cubdog Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 Do you still have the CFs or have you you moved on to the Von Schweikerts? cubdog Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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