American Idol Winners bomb, A mystery?

[Islander]

"Just look at the charts for the last 10 years....Yeah look at em... Britney and Mariah will out sell 99% of them all.....MANY times over."

Like he said: The dumbing down of America.......

Pop music can be great or really not great, but why a song's a hit can be a mystery.

Remember 1988? Song of the Year: Don't Worry, Be Happy

There was lots of great music released that year, but it was all ranked behind that cheery ditty.

[Bill Cain]

Pop music can be great or really not great, but why a song's a hit can be a mystery.

True.

What I would use as a litmus test is the value of collectable vinyl, not the crap that made the top 40.

Top 40 music was never played at teen dances in Pittsburgh. It was just crap.

We searched junkpiles and old record stores for our music. Today, that stuff is worth much more than anything from American Bandstand.

AI is just a new version AB.

[skonopa]

I must say there is something to be liked from every musical genre. There is good to be found everywhere but sometimes you have to really dig. Personally I like bands with sparks of passion and originality. I try to explore other cultures for new music as well. Lately it has been African High Life jazz influenced music and Italian space age bachelor pad music like the transistors.

It would be nice if there was more diversity. This is one reason satalite radio is so cool. You just pick a genre and it plays any song from any album wether it is a "hit" or not. I have found new bands in genres I thought I knew too well.

At least there is enough good music out there to find : ) Nothing better than finding a new sound that just makes you happy.

Oh yes! There is indeed quite a bit of good music out there, but you do indeed have to find it. Thank God for the internet and satellite radio! I can't even begin to count how many awesome new bands that I've never even heard about simply from surfing the internet or hearing something on satellite radio. For example, I have an account on eMusic, with which I've found an downloaded a ton of stuff. Also love listening to internet radio (friggan AOL of all things has this totally kick-@$$ power metal station on thier "AOL Radio" service that I love to listen to!)

Unfortunatly, my experience is that I am not finding the good music on the so-called "mainstream" media, such as terrestrial FM radio, nor on TV, including "American Idol". I just find myself not enjoying any of that pop tripe they keep parading out on that Godforsaken show. I think I barely managed to sit through one episode and vowed that I'd never do that again! Another example was that New Years Eve countdown thing they have with D ick Clark (edit - seems our naughty word bannisher is getting a bit over zealous here). This past one, I found myself muting it out on nearly every song that was played on there. As soon as the ball dropped, I killed the TV and went to bed - enough of that tripe!

To find an "Idol" artist that I actually cared about, I ended having to watch, via internet, a version of "Idol" from another country! "Finnish Idol", that is, to see Ari Koivunen belt out some pretty kick-@$$ heavy metal songs, including "Fullmoon" by Sonata Arctica (video of Sonata Arctica themselves performing this - can you imagine THAT being done on "American Idol"? BTW, thier most recent album, Unia, friggan totally kicks some serious @$$!) and "Hunting High and Low" by Stratovarious (

). Despite getting negative reviews from all the judges, due to constantly picking heavy metal songs, the public disagreed and kept voting him on to continue. He ultimately managed to win the entire thing! There used to be a YouTube video of his performance singing the Sonata Arctica song, which was in the finals, but alas, can't seem to find it anymore (probably has since been taken down). I've even managed to get ahold of a copy of his album Fuel For The Fire, which was not easy as it has never been released in the US, which I found to be pretty darn good. Somehow, I don't think he would make it past the first round in "American Idol", simply due to the different culture of the whole thing. I don't know how the American public would take to something like that! Agast! Heavy Metal on an 'Idol" show - the horrors! Who would've thunk? [6] I doubt Simon Cowell would even know what to do with himself if somebody got up there and started belting out some Iron Maiden (which Ari also did BTW!), for example, let alone a lesser known band such as Sonata Arctica. Says something about my taste in music, though! Will buy an album from an "Idol" artist from another country, which was never released in this country, yet I would not even give two nickels nor the time of day for any of the artists nor thier albums that came from the "Idol" show in this country! Heck, I won't even waste the bandwidth and harddrive space to download any of them off a pirate torrent site, either!

As far as the big numbers of albums sold that was quoted above, I still go by the old adage - because something is popular, does not mean it is also good. Look at Bose! Need I say more?

[Bill Cain]

As far as the big numbers of albums sold that was quoted above, I still go by the old adage - because something is popular, does not mean it is also good. Look at Bose! Need I say more?

Great analogy.

[seti]

OH YES!!!

I love the auditions too. Now that's entertainment! LMAO (I stop watching after the first few weeks when the comp starts to get........... good(?))

You see, I was a big Gong Show fan. There were some great "out take" tapes around. I remember the hard R rated tape. Man, what some people will do on a stage. Too much.

Oh now you've mentioned the gong show.

There was a band called Mystic Knights of the Oingo Boing later known as Oingo Boingo. I was more a fan of the early material. They tried to recreate European street circus and had an amazing time. Check out this rare clip on youtube. It is crazed.

[seti]

The show seems to be about wannabe performers imitating actual artists/performers, without any of the originals' scary (to the mainstream culture) creativity and willingness to be different.

I don't think Crosby or Sinatra necessarily wanted to be different. They just wanted to be good.

To be "different" soley to be different is a waste of time.

Your examples were "different" in that they were themselves, not clones of formerly successful artists.

Does AI embrace unique talent or clones? The answer is obvious.

Different for different sake is rarely good it is like trying to make a cult film. You don't set out to make a cult film.

Did Thelonious Monk or Frank Zappa or Captain Beefheart set out to be different or weird? No they just were different and weird. They didn't have to try. I think that is the difference you either are or original or your a poser. Too many posers today.

[Invidiosulus]

I must say there is something to be liked from every musical genre. There is good to be found everywhere but sometimes you have to really dig. Personally I like bands with sparks of passion and originality. I try to explore other cultures for new music as well. Lately it has been African High Life jazz influenced music and Italian space age bachelor pad music like the transistors.

It would be nice if there was more diversity. This is one reason satalite radio is so cool. You just pick a genre and it plays any song from any album wether it is a "hit" or not. I have found new bands in genres I thought I knew too well.

At least there is enough good music out there to find : ) Nothing better than finding a new sound that just makes you happy.

Oh yes! There is indeed quite a bit of good music out there, but you do indeed have to find it. Thank God for the internet and satellite radio! I can't even begin to count how many awesome new bands that I've never even heard about simply from surfing the internet or hearing something on satellite radio. For example, I have an account on eMusic, with which I've found an downloaded a ton of stuff. Also love listening to internet radio (friggan AOL of all things has this totally kick-@$$ power metal station on thier "AOL Radio" service that I love to listen to!)

Unfortunatly, my experience is that I am not finding the good music on the so-called "mainstream" media, such as terrestrial FM radio, nor on TV, including "American Idol". I just find myself not enjoying any of that pop tripe they keep parading out on that Godforsaken show. I think I barely managed to sit through one episode and vowed that I'd never do that again! Another example was that New Years Eve countdown thing they have with D ick Clark (edit - seems our naughty word bannisher is getting a bit over zealous here). This past one, I found myself muting it out on nearly every song that was played on there. As soon as the ball dropped, I killed the TV and went to bed - enough of that tripe!

To find an "Idol" artist that I actually cared about, I ended having to watch, via internet, a version of "Idol" from another country! "Finnish Idol", that is, to see Ari Koivunen belt out some pretty kick-@$$ heavy metal songs, including "Fullmoon" by Sonata Arctica (video of Sonata Arctica themselves performing this - can you imagine THAT being done on "American Idol"? BTW, thier most recent album, Unia, friggan totally kicks some serious @$$!) and "Hunting High and Low" by Stratovarious (

). Despite getting negative reviews from all the judges, due to constantly picking heavy metal songs, the public disagreed and kept voting him on to continue. He ultimately managed to win the entire thing! There used to be a YouTube video of his performance singing the Sonata Arctica song, which was in the finals, but alas, can't seem to find it anymore (probably has since been taken down). I've even managed to get ahold of a copy of his album Fuel For The Fire, which was not easy as it has never been released in the US, which I found to be pretty darn good. Somehow, I don't think he would make it past the first round in "American Idol", simply due to the different culture of the whole thing. I don't know how the American public would take to something like that! Agast! Heavy Metal on an 'Idol" show - the horrors! Who would've thunk? I doubt Simon Cowell would even know what to do with himself if somebody got up there and started belting out some Iron Maiden (which Ari also did BTW!), for example, let alone a lesser known band such as Sonata Arctica. Says something about my taste in music, though! Will buy an album from an "Idol" artist from another country, which was never released in this country, yet I would not even give two nickels nor the time of day for any of the artists nor thier albums that came from the "Idol" show in this country! Heck, I won't even waste the bandwidth and harddrive space to download any of them off a pirate torrent site, either!

As far as the big numbers of albums sold that was quoted above, I still go by the old adage - because something is popular, does not mean it is also good. Look at Bose! Need I say more?

I'll have to check out Ari's album.

Sonata Arctica is one of my fav scandinavian metal bands.

It would be fun to see some real metal on an american idol show.

[Islander]

There was a band called Mystic Knights of the Oingo Boing later known as Oingo Boingo. I was more a fan of the early material. They tried to recreate European street circus and had an amazing time. Check out this rare clip on youtube. It is crazed.

The leader of Oingo Boingo for some time was Danny Elfman, who does the music for the Simpsons and has done lots of movie and TV scores. He seems to be very prolific.

[IB Slammin]

................Frank Zappa or Captain Beefheart ...........I couldn't agree more.

Ian,

As a matter of fact, I listened to Beefheart's Click Clack last night!

AND, your Gong Show link was well recieved here. Dead Mans Party was simply enchanting.[]

tc

[Daddy Dee]

This thread is alot better than watching Idol.

[seti]

................Frank Zappa or Captain Beefheart ...........I couldn't agree more.

Ian,

As a matter of fact, I listened to Beefheart's Click Clack last night!

AND, your Gong Show link was well recieved here. Dead Mans Party was simply enchanting.

tc

In the bundle of CDs that I sent was their a Magic Band CD? The version of Abba Zabba on there is too cool. The instrumental tracks are priceless because you can really hear the complexity and magical time sliding shifts. Just stunning. I like Click Clack as well.

Glad you liked the link it cracks me up. A friend got to see them do the street circus type show and said it was just insanity. When they were Mystic Knights they did shows of Cab Calloway covers. You can really tell they loved the music.

Music Map http://www.music-map.com/ is a great way to find new music as well. Just enter the band and it generates bands closely related influenced by or bands also liked by fans.

[IndyKlipschFan]

David Cook won... Thank GOD!

OK next!! hehehehehehe

[IndyKlipschFan]

Thebes started this story by CBS... Call me crazy, It is ok I am... LOL.... but I (IndyKlipschFan) usually ask myself in times of slanted news stories one side against another.... follow the money trail on a lot of issues...then bang out today....

"The national news outlets must be getting desperate for stories. CBS
News closed it's broadcast this evening by scratching it's head over
why American Idol winners professional careers bomb. They actually
labeled it a "mystery"."

=================

Well...... Check this out... hot off the press..... Led by American Idol, Fox took Wednesday with typical ease,
outdelivering second-place CBS by a considerable 3.67 million viewers
and 93 percent among adults 18-49. Third overall was NBC, followed by
ABC and the CW.

Fox to win prime-time TV ratings race

The network will end the season No. 1 in all key demographic groups.

By Meg James, Los Angeles Times Staff Writer

May 21, 2008

For the first time in its 21-year history, Fox Broadcasting will win
the television season by netting the largest audience in prime time and
should collect blue ribbons in every major demographic category.

The
regular TV season ends tonight, but Fox's destiny was determined, in
large part, by the continued strength of "American Idol," even though
the show's ratings have declined about 10% this year. The singing
competition remains the No. 1 show on TV and wraps up its seventh
season tonight with a new champion.


Fox also was not as damaged by the Hollywood writers strike as its
rivals, which are more dependent on scripted shows. Fox was the only
major broadcaster to increase its ratings this season. They jumped 5%
from the 2006-07 season.

Through
Sunday night, Fox had averaged 11.1 million viewers in prime time each
week for the season, compared with 10.5 million viewers for
second-place CBS, according to Nielsen Media Research ratings.

CBS
typically boasts TV's largest audience, but its ratings skidded during
the strike when it was forced to air weeks of reruns of "CSI: Crime
Scene Investigation" and other programs. CBS has since returned to
original episodes and had the largest prime-time audience during the
May sweeps, which also end tonight.


This would be the fourth straight season that Fox finished first among
18- to 49-year-old viewers, the demographic used to calculate
prime-time advertising rates.

"For
us, it's all about 18- to 49-year-olds. That's who we service our
advertisers with," said Peter Liguori, Fox's entertainment chairman,
adding that the challenge is for the network to claim the prize for a
fifth time next season. "We have strength across the board, and we are
going to build on it."

Fox benefited by airing the Super Bowl in
February, although executives noted that the network would have won the
season even without the game. Fox also boosted its ratings last fall by
running fewer early-round Major League Baseball playoff games, which
typically generate low ratings and bring down the average.

The
network, part of Rupert Murdoch's News Corp., said it would be the
first time in 10 years that a network ended the season in first place
in all key demographic categories, including men, women, young men,
young women, teenagers and households.

"This was a long time in
coming," television historian Tim Brooks said. "Their business model --
programming only 15 hours a week in prime time -- has given them an
advantage. They can concentrate on fewer hours at a time when NBC, CBS
and ABC are still trying to fill 22 hours. I wouldn't be surprised to
see the others eventually scale back."

Fox programs one fewer
hour each evening than ABC, CBS and NBC because Fox turns over its 10
p.m. slot to TV stations for local newscasts. Brooks said that Fox's
first stab at programming, a talk show in 1986 with Joan Rivers, was a
flop. But Fox established itself as a player when it began televising
National Football League games in 1994.

As measured by 18- to
49-year-old viewers, it will be a photo finish for second place.
Through Sunday, ABC was about 40,000 viewers ahead of CBS in the
demographic. NBC is expected to come in fourth, Spanish-language
Univision fifth, and the CW, a joint venture between CBS Corp. and
Warner Bros., a distant sixth.

meg.james@latimes.com

[anarchist]

A true talent is a songwriter, their own person, can sing, and here's
the kicker...Has their own artistic vision, writes their lyrics and
arranges their own compositions.

Sounds like David Cook this year... or Daughtry last year. The best person doesn't win every year. The best voice doesn't win each year. But the best talent did win this year... and Daughtry's numbers demonstrate he should have won last year. Archuleta wasn't the best talent but he has a helluva voice and with the right management could have a blockbuster sales numbers.

This thread demonstrates people don't actually have to be informed, educated or even have first-hand knowledge to give an opinion. Read someone elses opinion, watch 30 secs of something and be secure you know everything; kind of reminds me of political opinions. I love it.

[Hifi jim]

Thank God American Idol wasn't around forty years ago. I could imagine Simon tearing Bob Dylan apart for lousy stage presence and Randy calling his performance "pitchy". America probably would have voted for Pat Boone instead. I'm convinced that marketing has ruined America. Drink Coke!