Moderators dtel Posted January 5, 2011 Moderators Share Posted January 5, 2011 For someone saying they have little woodworking experience you did a fine job ! [Y] Also that's a great looking room, I hope you are happy with the new subs and can't wait to hear you thoughts on how they sound. I am happy with the one for now and would think two should vibrate your room pretty well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted January 5, 2011 Author Share Posted January 5, 2011 dtel, thank you. I really am a novice to the speaker building and woodworking. I am learning as fast as I can. This build was easier than the DBB build which started all this. One they are up and running I'll be posting more on the subject. BTW, thanks for all the help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 One they are up and running I'll be posting more on the subject. What are you waiting for????? Inquiring minds want impressions!!!! I would have fired it up before the glue dried[] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators dtel Posted January 5, 2011 Moderators Share Posted January 5, 2011 What are you waiting for????? Inquiring minds want impressions!!!! I would have fired it up before the glue dried I thought that was what the screws were for, to hold it together while playing as the glue dries ? [] I had a bad first day with mine, I accidentally wired the two drivers wrong and had them fighting each other. When you look at the drawing the - sign I read wrong and had them wired in phase, not good. I let them play all night and no change in the morning, then after checking everything the last thing I did was to go back and look at the plans again ! [:$] Then I felt stupid and happy at the same time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted January 5, 2011 Author Share Posted January 5, 2011 I fired them up before sealing the top in order to take the FR plots. Worked just fine. I then had to finish the glue and screw job...so to speak. Then, paint and then lug the behemoths to the second floor listening room. I since have had to leave town on business and will not be able to get to them until late next week. I have totally finished them and double checked all the wiring. I used a battery to ensure the drivers are firing in unison in the same direction when mounted vs. fighting each other. My access panel has 10 screws and is a pain to open and close, so I wanted to make darn sure I didn't mess up the wiring since it is rather uncoventional. I can't wait either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psg Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 I can't wait either. I'll bet! Keep in touch with this!!! Please!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted January 6, 2011 Author Share Posted January 6, 2011 Oh, yes. More to follow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 For what it's worth, I would recommend EQ'ing the subs outside before putting them in the room. If you put the mic on the ground, then you can also put the mouth closer to tbe ground and get a true anechoic ground plane (no dip from the mic height). I'm curious if that 120Hz dip actually goes away because tapped horns should have that... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris A Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 Nevermind... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted January 6, 2011 Author Share Posted January 6, 2011 Nevermind... Did I miss something important? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted January 6, 2011 Author Share Posted January 6, 2011 For what it's worth, I would recommend EQ'ing the subs outside before putting them in the room. If you put the mic on the ground, then you can also put the mouth closer to tbe ground and get a true anechoic ground plane (no dip from the mic height). I'm curious if that 120Hz dip actually goes away because tapped horns should have that... Dr.Who, that's a great idea, and I had contemplated it, but it is not practical for me to do that for various reasons. Biggest one is lugging that woofer back outside. That dip is part of what is expected from the TH, from what I have resarched. I plan on using the readings I took outside to create a basic EQ for the sub. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted January 6, 2011 Author Share Posted January 6, 2011 Chris, I just got the e-mail of your original post before you edited it. You are correct in what I was planning to do. My plan is first to take some REW readings after I hook them up with no EQ for pure comparisson with the outside readings. Then, apply some EQ based on the outside readings. Eventually, run Audyssey Pro and let it set up the subs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris A Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 Rudy, I just misread what Mike B. was saying. He might have updated his post just after I read it, or I just missed it altogether. When I reread his post, I edited ou my post since I thought it was off-target. The real point that I was trying to make was that even though the half-space FR plots on the SPUD are very flat taken outside, there are two large response peaks (mid-20 Hz and upper 30 Hz) in-room that Hornresp correctly predicts in corner loading. I was surprised when I measured those peaks until I finally modeled the horns in Hornresp - and there they were despite the very flat half-space performance of the horn design. That was the point I was trying to make. Chris [:S] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris A Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 oops again... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted January 6, 2011 Author Share Posted January 6, 2011 Rudy, The real point that I was trying to make was that even though the half-space FR plots on the SPUD are very flat taken outside, there are two large response peaks (mid-20 Hz and upper 30 Hz) in-room that Hornresp correctly predicts in corner loading. I was surprised when I measured those peaks until I finally modeled the horns in Hornresp - and there they were despite the very flat half-space performance of the horn design. Chris Chris, I really appreciate you taking the time for that write up. I have read several posts in various locations about the TH design, but missed the comments about the room response change at those frequencies. I will certainly take some unmodified REW measurements before doing anything to the crossover. I am very interested to see what effects the room will have in the response. As per Mike Hurd's advise, I plan on putting the subs along the front wall of the room, around my center La Scala. So, corner loading will only apply to the 90 degree corner made by the floor and front wall. It should be interesting to see what response I get. I will be really interested to see what Audyssey does with the subs since I will be able to get plots from Audyssey before and after. Looking forward to finishing the project. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 Rudy, I just misread what Mike B. was saying. He might have updated his post just after I read it, or I just missed it altogether. When I reread his post, I edited ou my post since I thought it was off-target. The real point that I was trying to make was that even though the half-space FR plots on the SPUD are very flat taken outside, there are two large response peaks (mid-20 Hz and upper 30 Hz) in-room that Hornresp correctly predicts in corner loading. I was surprised when I measured those peaks until I finally modeled the horns in Hornresp - and there they were despite the very flat half-space performance of the horn design. That was the point I was trying to make. Chris Ya know, right after I wrote that I was wondering what the boundary gain and mutual coupling effects might be...I was mostly considering the "HF" passband because it'll be too hard to see with an in-room measurement and the size of Rudy's room is such that those frequencies aren't going to be "strongly modal", which is my way of saying that the EQ won't be minimum phase...though I wonder how minimum phase the speaker is at those frequencies anyway... On a slightly different, but similar, topic, I'm of the belief that you don't necessarily want to fully compensate for the room gain (as defined by pressure loading of the room) since it takes time for that acoustic loading to generate the extra gain. No compensation may be perceived as too much for long sustained passages, but EQ'ing it flat may be perceived as too thin and weak for shorter transient type sounds. A more practical example would be a sound where the frequency shifts with time... Anyways, just something to think about when playing with the final voicing of the system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted January 6, 2011 Author Share Posted January 6, 2011 I agree with most of your observations guys. I don't have my room set to flat, since I too found that it sounds rather 'thin' if I set it to flat. I had read some papers on 'house curves' and find that allowing about +3dB at 20Hz and then slowly reducing the boost from there works very well. I will post lots of stuff when I get into it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete H Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Hi Rudy! I've been out of the loop for a while but I'm getting ready to do a sub build for a friend and just went through this entire thread. GREAT JOB!!!! You are getting to be quite the wood worker. The template idea was great for the routing. Hope all is well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted January 13, 2011 Author Share Posted January 13, 2011 Pete, I'd love to take credit for the idea, but it wasn't mine. I found the idea on a TH build thread on another forum. It is a fantastic idea and worked extremely well. I am back, so will begin hookup and testing tomorrow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete H Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Do you want to sell and ship your jig? I may be building a couple sets of these and rather than have it sit in your garage or get scrapped, it might make sense for both of us. I was thinking today back to some comments you made in your DBB build regarding the Khorn and the bass response that wasn't the chest pounding bass that you were wanting and now you've built a horn loaded sub so I'm very curious to hear what you think about it compared to your RSW's and the other sub that your replacing. I know why I tried to stay away from this forum for a while, it's like walking into a tool store and I just want to have one of everything.[] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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