Weak Bass out of Klipsch

[eanderson]

I have some Klipsch KG4 WO RV speakers coming off a Denon AVR-1513 amp.

I have 2 rear speakers in the ceiling, once center in the wall, and the 2 Klipsch. I'm not getting anywhere near the bass I was getting off my old sony amp. I have set the Klipsch speakers to large and turned the subwoofer to off. Does anybody have any ideas on how I can get the wall shaking bass I know these speakers are capable of? I've kept these speakers for so long because on my old setup when a plane landed or something on a movie you could literally feel it. I love these speakers and don't want to give them up for a sub with a pre out.

any help would be greatly appreciated.

[ryanm84]

Assume you didn't move the KG4 that need to be in the corner to maximize the bass?

I've KG4s and due to my room, they are not in corners. Bass is less than I would expect too.

I run mine off a denon as well and they do pretty well when properly placed.

[eanderson]

Correct. I've had these in our family for a long time. I just don't understand why it seems to just not have enough power to push these...i'm stumped

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Edited March 29, 2014 by eanderson

[wheelman]

Can you go back to the Sony? Might be just better for your liking.

[eanderson]

I still have the sony, however, the reason I got the Denon is that I needed HDMI switching. The Sony is so old it doesn't have HDMI

[wheelman]

Yeah I understand that. I was in the same boat at one time I decided on better sound ( to my ears and budget) over convenience. Some things I do need though like second room sound, DTS, good bass management, pre outs. It can be tough to get the right sound once your used to it a certain way. I don't use any video switching now. I probably would though if I could. My Sony tv ruined it for me it has a weird delay in input selections. So now my programable remote can't do it's job. Oh well not gonna get a new tv for awhile wasn't expecting that little quirk. Next time around that is a feature I will look into on a tv set. Good luck sorry I wasn't any help. Maybe you could boost it with an eq or something so you get the sense that its pushing more bass. But judging from the back of your receiver you would have to give up HDMI to do that. I run a sub with my speakers set to large all the time. I like it that way thats where good bass management comes in.

Make sure your speaker levels are matched as well for surround. I doubt by default they would be lower than normal, but its good to check the test tones get them even for a nice surround effect. Also I noticed from your manual that you have a source level function maybe you could set that higher to give you a sense of a hotter sounding amp. Something to fiddle with but check to see its not in the minus range anyways. Make sure D.Comp is off for more dynamic range. Also set DRC OFF. Ok I see you have tone which is nice you can add some more bass or treble if you desire. Turn that on select to your liking. If needed set the levels first and make sure you are getting all the dynamic range in the soundtrack. I don't see much on bass management my computer is acting up tonight.

[derrickdj1]

If the main speakers can't be optimally placed, that is a good reason to use a sub.or two. Most people have more flexibility with sub placement.

[beeker]

I have some Klipsch KG4 WO RV speakers coming off a Denon AVR-1513 amp.

I have 2 rear speakers in the ceiling, once center in the wall, and the 2 Klipsch. I'm not getting anywhere near the bass I was getting off my old sony amp. I have set the Klipsch speakers to large and turned the subwoofer to off. Does anybody have any ideas on how I can get the wall shaking bass I know these speakers are capable of? I've kept these speakers for so long because on my old setup when a plane landed or something on a movie you could literally feel it. I love these speakers and don't want to give them up for a sub with a pre out.

any help would be greatly appreciated.

im always up for subs but have 2 great options as well. get yourself an eq to bring the low tone into grasp always works for me. next is a more powerful quality amp. kg4's will provide fine bass on there own in the center of a room with either of these 2 options. best of luck

[Ceptorman]

Can could connect your Sony temporarily to see if the bass comes back?

[Heritage_Head]

I have some Klipsch KG4 WO RV speakers coming off a Denon AVR-1513 amp.

I have 2 rear speakers in the ceiling, once center in the wall, and the 2 Klipsch. I'm not getting anywhere near the bass I was getting off my old sony amp. I have set the Klipsch speakers to large and turned the subwoofer to off. Does anybody have any ideas on how I can get the wall shaking bass I know these speakers are capable of? I've kept these speakers for so long because on my old setup when a plane landed or something on a movie you could literally feel it. I love these speakers and don't want to give them up for a sub with a pre out.

any help would be greatly appreciated.

im always up for subs but have 2 great options as well. get yourself an eq to bring the low tone into grasp always works for me. next is a more powerful quality amp. kg4's will provide fine bass on there own in the center of a room with either of these 2 options. best of luck

This is what I would do. Eq will get you what you want I think. Most avr auto programs will eq to a flat response (or try too). Flat is not for everyone's tastes. And usually not the bass that will shake the walls.

This seems to be a big topic that pops up a lot. Getting the bass they want from their big speakers from a ht avr. Most of the avrs out there have an on board eq in the settings. But I think most people run the auto eq (like audyssey) and leave it. And that in my experience will give very thin bass to the fronts with no sub. Go in and beef up the bass tell its what you want.

[Scrappydue]

Have you ran audyssey? If so, turn it off and set your mains to large and see how that sounds. That's when mine have the most bass as there is no eq applied as well as all the room gain from being set as large. Soon as I turn audyssey on bass goes down and then once set to small hardly any bass. But then add the sub and boom. There it is again and much cleaner than what most towers are capable of.

[eanderson]

When I power the speakers off the Sony, all is back to normal. The sony is a old STR-D965. I've tried multiple sources HDMI, RCA, Component, all with the same weak results on the Denon. I'm assuming this amp just isn't powerful enough, i've messed with settings for a while and nothing makes a significant difference. I think it's time to return the Denon, any suggestions on a replacement?

Edited March 29, 2014 by eanderson

[Heritage_Head]

So you tried to eq the bass up?

[eanderson]

Yea, the bass was all the way up +6 and treble +2

Then I took my Denon AVR-E300 from upstairs and plugged it in down here. It delivers a little more power than the 1513, so i'm thinking I need to return the 1513 and get something else.

Edited March 30, 2014 by eanderson

[garyrc]

Yea, the bass was all the way up +6 and treble +2

Then I took my Denon AVR-E300 from upstairs and plugged it in down here. It delivers a little more power than the AVR, so i'm thinking I need to return the 1513 and get something else.

Did you use a tone control when you set the bass for +6? Don't use virtual onscreen sliders, or they will turn Audyssey off. Make sure the Audyssey light is still on when you have finished all adjustments.

Audyssey and other auto-EQs try to remove room peaks, and many people get used to peaky bass, and value it. IMO, the solution is to replace the peaky bass with a gradual, but smooth, bass rise, so that the bottom end of the curve is higher than the top. Some research (Harmon?) has indicated that most people like the bottom of the bass to be 10 dB higher than the top of the treble, and they perceive it as "flat," even though it's not. I achieved that here by running Audyssey, then turning up the sub by a few dB, and also using a tone control (not a virtual slider) to boost the LF and RF bass by 6 dB.

As far as the plane landing, etc., if you decide to use a "sub out" to feed a sub, a great deal of the energy of the plane landing will, as LFE, be sent directly to the sub, and the power -- or the lack of it -- from your AVR won't be a factor.

Edited March 29, 2014 by Garyrc

[Scrappydue]

Audyssey and other auto-EQs try to remove room peaks, and many people get used to peaky bass, and value it.

i believe this is the exact problem! older receivers had no such room eq or setting speakers small or large. if you are used to that and change then new stuff that is designed to be very flat is going to sound thin for a while until getting used to it.

[JJkizak]

I had the same problem with a new Denon 7.1 versus and old Denon 2 channel. Huge output power difference even though the old Denon rated at 55 watts versus the 110 watts from the 7.1. So I eneded up driving the old Denon with the new Denon, the old powering the K horns and the new powering the Cornwall center channel and sub. I was happy again.

JJK

[eanderson]

Yea, the bass was all the way up +6 and treble +2

Then I took my Denon AVR-E300 from upstairs and plugged it in down here. It delivers a little more power than the AVR, so i'm thinking I need to return the 1513 and get something else.

Did you use a tone control when you set the bass for +6? Don't use virtual onscreen sliders, or they will turn Audyssey off. Make sure the Audyssey light is still on when you have finished all adjustments.

Audyssey and other auto-EQs try to remove room peaks, and many people get used to peaky bass, and value it. IMO, the solution is to replace the peaky bass with a gradual, but smooth, bass rise, so that the bottom end of the curve is higher than the top. Some research (Harmon?) has indicated that most people like the bottom of the bass to be 10 dB higher than the top of the treble, and they perceive it as "flat," even though it's not. I achieved that here by running Audyssey, then turning up the sub by a few dB, and also using a tone control (not a virtual slider) to boost the LF and RF bass by 6 dB.

As far as the plane landing, etc., if you decide to use a "sub out" to feed a sub, a great deal of the energy of the plane landing will, as LFE, be sent directly to the sub, and the power -- or the lack of it -- from your AVR won't be a factor.

The 1513 doesn't have audyseey feature. It didn't come with the microphone

Could this be the issue?

AVR-1513

Power Output; Watts Per Channel 75

AVR-E300

Power Output 75 W (20 Hz - 20 kHz, 0.08% THD @ 8 ohms) per channel

120 W (1 kHz, 0.7% THD @ 6 ohms) per channel

175 W (max power output) per channel

Edited March 30, 2014 by eanderson

[derrickdj1]

Sounds like that avr is not delivering the goods.

[eanderson]

With that being said, should I get a 7.1 receiver just for the higher power output? Should I get another E300? Or get this

Onkyo HT-R791

Power Output - Front L/R 130 W/Channel (6 ohms, 1 kHz, 1%, 1 channel driven, FTC) Center 130 W (6 ohms, 1 kHz, 1%, 1 channel driven, FTC) Surround L/R 130 W/Channel (6 ohms, 1 kHz, 1%, 1 channel driven, FTC) Surround Back L/R 130 W/Channel (6 ohms, 1 kHz, 1%, 1 channel driven, FTC) Dynamic Power (front) 180 W (3 ohms)
160 W (4 ohms)
100 W (8 ohms)