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dwilawyer

KMHA Class by Chief Bone Head Oct. 18 & 19 (

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On 9/4/2019 at 12:06 PM, mark1101 said:

So remind us.............How do you pay?

Looking forward to seeing you there!

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And one more reason to join.

 

 

 

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I am in and anyone wanting to split a room and trip expenses by sharing a ride if you happen to be close by PM me.

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11 hours ago, Dave A said:

I am in and anyone wanting to split a room and trip expenses by sharing a ride if you happen to be close by PM me.

Glad it worked out and you will make it.

 

I sent you a PM about something else.

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On 9/5/2019 at 7:26 PM, Edgar said:

Anybody from the Saint Louis, MO area need a ride down and/or back?

Glad you made your schedule work!

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I'd love this but work schedule is packed this fall, and flying in twice to Hope in a year is a hard sell with all the other speaker related stuff I've acquired this year.

 

What I would easily shell out a few hundred bucks towards the museum funding is an afternoon of quality time with a set of Jubes on the Saturday or Thursday of Pilgrimage..

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18 hours ago, MenloBob said:

I'd love this but work schedule is packed this fall, and flying in twice to Hope in a year is a hard sell with all the other speaker related stuff I've acquired this year.

 

What I would easily shell out a few hundred bucks towards the museum funding is an afternoon of quality time with a set of Jubes on the Saturday or Thursday of Pilgrimage..

You are about the 5th person who has mentioned that, not everyone has the same speaker in mind, but the same general concept.  Remind me early next year.

 

Travis

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Four more signed up today, three new members.

 

Travis

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4 hours ago, dwilawyer said:

Four more signed up today, three new members.

 

Travis

It would be nice to know how close you are getting to the number 50. 

 

Also, I kinda wondered if some kind of a listening comparison to the evolutionary progress of the Heresy and Cornwall speakers' technical improvements evolution might be something interesting to do sometime.  I have pair of Heresy I  and Heresy II in excellent ORIGINAL functional condition that I could bring for that but I need a second pair of boxes to pack one pair for hauling to Hope.

 

I kinda think that a presentation showing the performance evolution of the production versions of the speakers would possibly highlight the presentation of "Why PWK did what he did...and why Chief Bonehead is continuing to do what PWK would have liked to do", myself.  Between what the museum has in functional production speakers and what some of the attendees MIGHT be able to bring to fill in the voids, we could probably make something like this happen, doncha think?  Actually HEARING the differences would highlight everything being said, IMHO!  It would MAINLY just require the speakers being hooked up to a switching box between the amp source so that all the upstream components remain the same....and, of course, the positioning of the speakers...but for smaller models, that wouldn't be so much of an issue.

 

Just a thought... 

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30 minutes ago, HDBRbuilder said:

It would be nice to know how close you are getting to the number 50. 

Great questions all.  Last I checked we were at about 20, but I had 2 or 3 yesterday.

30 minutes ago, HDBRbuilder said:

 

Also, I kinda wondered if some kind of a listening comparison to the evolutionary progress of the Heresy and Cornwall speakers' technical improvements evolution might be something interesting to do sometime. 

Absolutely it would be.  We are.going to cover history and evolution of CW, from the museum pieces and archives, but at some point would like to see how they shound.

30 minutes ago, HDBRbuilder said:

 

I have pair of Heresy I  and Heresy II in excellent ORIGINAL functional condition that I could bring for that but I need a second pair of boxes to pack one pair for hauling to Hope.

Ooooooh, cool.  

30 minutes ago, HDBRbuilder said:

 

I kinda think that a presentation showing the performance evolution of the production versions of the speakers would possibly highlight the presentation of "Why PWK did what he did...and why Chief Bonehead is continuing to do what PWK would have liked to do", myself.

Absolutely, 

30 minutes ago, HDBRbuilder said:

 

  Between what the museum has in functional production speakers and what some of the attendees MIGHT be able to bring to fill in the voids, we could probably make something like this happen, doncha think? 

Yes, except, do 60 year old caps make a difference?  

30 minutes ago, HDBRbuilder said:

 

 

Actually HEARING the differences would highlight everything being said, IMHO!  It would MAINLY just require the speakers being hooked up to a switching box between the amp source so that all the upstream components remain the same....and, of course, the positioning of the speakers...but for smaller models, that wouldn't be so much of an issue.

I have a 400 seat Auditorium we can set that up in, or the Education Center

30 minutes ago, HDBRbuilder said:

 

Just a thought... 

You have a PM

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2 hours ago, dwilawyer said:

Yes, except, do 60 year old caps make a difference?  

 

The can caps in my Heresy I speakers are still good to go, since they are ONLY about 40 years old!  LOL! The age of "Can-type"caps in Heresys are not that big of a deal, as long as they have NOT dried out.  Since the HERESY is fully enclosed in a more-or-less sealed box (until NOW with the Heresy IV, which is ported!), they tend to remain good for much longer than in other speakers in the line, due to not having a tendency to be adversely affected by environmental crud and moisture...due to the "sealed" cabinet.  As long as they HAVE NOT been leaking (normally caused by the solder seal loosening on the oil-filler hole, or the metal getting rusted-through, or leakage can be identified around the crimping of the can top and bottom elements), which is very easy to notice, they tend to remain good for the Heresy speakers.  Make sense?  The crossovers in the Heresys have always had the least issues due to the cabinet being "sealed-off" from the environmental issues outside of the cabinet.  Generally-speaking, the MOST COMMON issue with Heresys with the old-style rear terminals is directly due to rear panel SHRINKAGE in its thickness over the years...which causes the terminals to loosen-up from those panels, allowing a weak electrical connection to the inside wiring from terminal to the crossover network connections....along with crud build-up on the OUTSIDE THE CABINET portion of those terminals (most often caused by copper oxidation transfer to the outside terminals when using bare wire connections.  All it takes to fix that is to remove the terminals, clean them well and re-attach them, insuring the screws are very snugly attached so that the inner wiring from the terminals TO THE CROSSOVER NETWORK make a better electrical connection.  The other issue is where the connectors on the network board are...also due to thickness-shrinkage of the network board itself.  Keeping the connections clean and ti8ght is the key....not really any rocket science involved in this issue....just common-sense maintenance, IMHO!

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1 hour ago, HDBRbuilder said:

The can caps in my Heresy I speakers are still good to go, since they are ONLY about 40 years old!  LOL! The age of "Can-type"caps in Heresys are not that big of a deal, as long as they have NOT dried out.  Since the HERESY is fully enclosed in a more-or-less sealed box (until NOW with the Heresy IV, which is ported!), they tend to remain good for much longer than in other speakers in the line, due to not having a tendency to be adversely affected by environmental crud and moisture...due to the "sealed" cabinet.  As long as they HAVE NOT been leaking (normally caused by the solder seal loosening on the oil-filler hole, or the metal getting rusted-through, or leakage can be identified around the crimping of the can top and bottom elements), which is very easy to notice, they tend to remain good for the Heresy speakers.  Make sense?  The crossovers in the Heresys have always had the least issues due to the cabinet being "sealed-off" from the environmental issues outside of the cabinet.

I have to disagree with you on good to go. Leaking or not ALL the old cans and Mylars I have measured with a B&K 885 meter clearly show high ESR even if the capacitance is in spec. I have no idea what manufacturing specs were back then regarding ESR but compared to todays caps, even the cheapo ones, the old ones are much higher. They may still sound good but not as good as with new caps.

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22 minutes ago, Dave A said:

I have to disagree with you on good to go. Leaking or not ALL the old cans and Mylars I have measured with a B&K 885 meter clearly show high ESR even if the capacitance is in spec. I have no idea what manufacturing specs were back then regarding ESR but compared to todays caps, even the cheapo ones, the old ones are much higher. They may still sound good but not as good as with new caps.

Bring your measurement stuff and the crossover network specs for my old crossovers with you to the class, and you can measure all you want on my old Heresy I networks for me.  Sweeping generalizations aside, If your measurements on my networks denote requirement of new caps, or even a complete network re-build, I'll "get-er-done" after I return home with the "flame twins".  You can even do your measurements on my late 1990's "almost un-used, seldom out of the boxes (for now)" Heresy II's....same thing for them...if they are needing something, then  I can get it fixed.  I'll even donate a "taste or two" of some very old Glenfiddich to your efforts...sound like a DEAL??

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3 hours ago, dwilawyer said:

I have a 400 seat Auditorium we can set that up in, or the Education Center

An auditorium would be an "OVERKILL environment" for a comparison for speakers NOT designed as stage speakers, IMHO....but the interior size of the Education Center might be much more suited...even though the ceiling is extremely high and the brick walls will most likely be overkill in reflections during the comparisons...I'll be down there at least a day early, though and we can see if that will work better or worse.  I'll just bring an old H/K 430 and some speaker wire with me to play around with while checking things out for that....using my laptop for music downloads for testing out the environment comparison.

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@Chief bonehead OVERKILLS 3 DRs with one horn loaded speaker every day.  Roy's forte (see what I did there) is auditoriums in the evening, especially ginormus baseball/football stadiums in Houston where you can hear every word of the announcer with crystal clarity.  

 

I can get you a "living room" in the hotel, but I think we are going to be done and over by 9 p.m. at the latest for that.

 

Working on the scheduling with the Chief.

 

 

 

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9 minutes ago, dwilawyer said:

@Chief bonehead OVERKILLS 3 DRs with one horn loaded speaker every day.  Roy's forte (see what I did there) is auditoriums in the evening, especially ginormus baseball/football stadiums in Houston where you can hear every word of the announcer with crystal clarity.  

 

I can get you a "living room" in the hotel, but I think we are going to be done and over by 9 p.m. at the latest for that.

 

Working on the scheduling with the Chief.

BTW, exactly WHICH HOTEL is "the hotel", anyway?  We all need to make reservations pretty soon...I can only do a drunken low-crawl to my room for certain short distances, ya'know??

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Just now, HDBRbuilder said:

BTW, exactly WHICH HOTEL is "the hotel", anyway?  We all need to make reservations pretty soon...I can only do a drunken low-crawl to my room for certain short distances, ya'know??

Therein lies the problem with Hope, suites and conference rooms.  I should know tonight, and then can post tonight or tomorrow morning.

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7 minutes ago, dwilawyer said:

Therein lies the problem with Hope, suites and conference rooms.  I should know tonight, and then can post tonight or tomorrow morning.

Keep in mind that if the hotel conference/listening room is directly UNDER or ADJACENT to adjoining sleeping rooms, we will be severely limited to the volume speakers are played at and how late we can be doing it. That should be a major decision-point.

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1 hour ago, HDBRbuilder said:

Keep in mind that if the hotel conference/listening room is directly UNDER or ADJACENT to adjoining sleeping rooms, we will be severely limited to the volume speakers are played at and how late we can be doing it. That should be a major decision-point.

I been thrown out of worse places.

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5 hours ago, HDBRbuilder said:

Bring your measurement stuff and the crossover network specs for my old crossovers with you to the class, and you can measure all you want on my old Heresy I networks for me.  Sweeping generalizations aside, If your measurements on my networks denote requirement of new caps, or even a complete network re-build, I'll "get-er-done" after I return home with the "flame twins".  You can even do your measurements on my late 1990's "almost un-used, seldom out of the boxes (for now)" Heresy II's....same thing for them...if they are needing something, then  I can get it fixed.  I'll even donate a "taste or two" of some very old Glenfiddich to your efforts...sound like a DEAL??

Will do. One thing I have never seen is ESR specs for caps on these old crossovers. I assume with manufacturing improving over time today's tolerances are better and I have no way of knowing what those old Mylars values were new. I will take a nice cup of coffee though and you can keep that other stuff.

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