hjones4841 Posted May 28, 2005 Share Posted May 28, 2005 Parrot: Actually a better idea would be lead sheathed cable to protect the precious little electrons from all the radiation that escapes the microwave oven. (My kid did his science fair project this year on microwave oven leakage. After reading several "sky is falling" web articles, we measured 10 residential ovens made from 1978 to 1999. The only one that exceeded federal industry leakage limits was one with a broken door seal.) Oh, on wire break-in, I forgot about the time it takes for electrons to wake up and get up to speed - those lazy little buggers! About a year ago I went into a local Best Buy to pick up a component video cable. I had in my hand a $20 AR cable that appeared to be well made (Parts Express sells these now for $10). This sales guy walks up and tells me that I really should put that cheap cable back and get this $100+ Mon$ter Cable. I assured him that I knew what I was doing and that I had been in home audio since well before he was born. He said that's not possible, to which I replied, "gee, you don't look to be 45." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parrot Posted May 28, 2005 Share Posted May 28, 2005 ---------------- On 5/28/2005 7:09:42 PM hjones4841 wrote: Oh, on wire break-in, I forgot about the time it takes for electrons to wake up and get up to speed - those lazy little buggers! ---------------- That's the reason we buy aftermarket superclocks for our CD players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r.cherry Posted May 28, 2005 Share Posted May 28, 2005 give them a real listem max and then let us know what you think. is there a difference or not? i can assure wouldn't know even if i listened, but some other folks want to know if they are missing out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Disc Posted May 29, 2005 Share Posted May 29, 2005 For me, a better power cable for the SACD player does indeed make a big difference in my setup. I've also found that the power cables I've purchasd do sound better after 100-200 hours of use. I don't know why. I'll pass the buck for someone else to explain why. No Disc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxg Posted May 29, 2005 Author Share Posted May 29, 2005 OK - 3 cables for comparison is one too many for me. I decided to forego the purple $1000 cable for now and leave the $100 cable in place. Switcing between this and the $3 computer power cable yields no appreciable difference for short term listening, however: After about an hour of switching back and forth I got bored with the process and left the $100 cable in place. I listened to a range of music - forgetting about the cable altogether till about 2 am. At the end of the session I felt that most of the pieces played, some very famliar and some relatively new to me, were better than I remembered or expected them too be - in a fairly minor, but possibly important way. Drums cut in with more drama than I remembered, highs were sweeter - less grating smoother presentation and overall there was a greater sense of "being there" than usual. Now the problem is that I cannot immediately ascribe these perceived changes to the cable. Sometimes I feel my system performs better and sometimes worse without a cable change. Of course - this may not actually reflect and change in the system at all - merely changes in my mood. Thus far therefore I can say that an A/B test - blind or otherwise would fail with a fair degree of certainty - but I cannot say the cable has not made an appreciable difference to the sound due to the above observations. It could simply be coincidence that my mood was good (Saturday night - married man, daughter went to bed early - do the math) and the listening experience therefore that much more enjoyable. Or it could be the cable. I will leave this cable in place till Tuesday night and then swap for the purple one. I should, with a little luck, get at least one listening session each evening till Saturday when I have to return the cable (actually I dont - but lets not abuse the loan). It is unlikely that my mood will be that good (in music listening appreciation terms) for the whole week so by Saturday I should, at least, be in a position to say whether or not I like the change to the sound - if indeed there was any. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael hurd Posted May 29, 2005 Share Posted May 29, 2005 Paul: It does seem reasonable if a more expensive cord installed on a microwave oven will make food taste better, that over a number of years it might well be worth it. Perhaps wiring it to 240V and using stove wire? Would I have to downconvert all the cooking times? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edwinr Posted May 29, 2005 Share Posted May 29, 2005 My brother works in a hi-fi store in Sydney. He freely admits to me that the real profit when he sells a complete mid market audio system, is in the cables and other audio accessories. The mark up is stupendous. He buys the so-called audio cable in big rolls for say, $300. He then sells the cable in cut lengths, 3 to 5 metres long, affixed with 'high quality' gold plated plugs, for around $150 to those that have no idea. Even if my brother was selling genuine high quality cable, I can't see how this stuff would have such a positive impact on the sound. I could be wrong though. Maybe I've never had a proper demonstration of the virtues of high end cable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Speedball Posted May 29, 2005 Share Posted May 29, 2005 Hello Max, It isnt a rip off at all......that cable was probably designed to go with a million dollars worth of gear. Besides the packaging can be used as a trash can for the wrinkled cash in your pocket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrMcGoo Posted May 29, 2005 Share Posted May 29, 2005 I have an after market power cable that made quite a difference. It completes the circuit, i.e., it does not fall out of the IEC socket like the old one did. The difference is night and day. Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dodger Posted May 29, 2005 Share Posted May 29, 2005 Did you try spreading the connectors? It seems that in the 1980s cable burn in, Interconnect burn in, tube burn in became the rage. I don't know how people were able to listen to all the distortion, poor sound, no warmth, no sound of excessive amounts of money falling into cash register tills in the 1950s - 1970s. One Company I know of suggests $5.00 per foot for their heavy gauge Speaker Cable. When you Buy a Spool of it the cost including shipping (Dealers) is a whole $.60 per foot. This seems to rival the drug companies. Maybe you should be on bad drugs when buying. Max: if you were up until 0200 hours, could mental fatigue be a factor? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hjones4841 Posted May 29, 2005 Share Posted May 29, 2005 PWK would have had a field day passing out the BS buttons to those who believe in esoteric cables and cable burn-in Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dodger Posted May 29, 2005 Share Posted May 29, 2005 ---------------- On 5/29/2005 4:22:31 PM hjones4841 wrote: PWK would have had a field day passing out the BS buttons to those who believe in esoteric cables and cable burn-in ---------------- Heavens, would he have enough? Would there be a break in time for wearing them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hjones4841 Posted May 29, 2005 Share Posted May 29, 2005 Ummmm.... Proper break-in time would be two trips to esoteric audio salons -with the button in plain view, of course.... you know the type of dealer I am talking about... the one who cups his hands around his mouth and demonstrates that HORRID HORN sound. And as soon and the new shipment of BS buttons came into Hope, Monster would come out with a $75 pin alignment tool for them... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dodger Posted May 29, 2005 Share Posted May 29, 2005 ---------------- On 5/29/2005 5:26:09 PM hjones4841 wrote: Ummmm.... Proper break-in time would be two trips to esoteric audio salons -with the button in plain view, of course.... you know the type of dealer I am talking about... the one who cups his hands around his mouth and demonstrates that HORRID HORN sound. And as soon and the new shipment of BS buttons came into Hope, Monster would come out with a $75 pin alignment tool for them... ---------------- Welcome to the Forum! It's nice to read knowledge with humour injected. A definite plus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kev313 Posted May 30, 2005 Share Posted May 30, 2005 hjones - Thanks! I think that you're swell too. Obviously you have a lot to add to a discussion of this issue, given your background. But I'm confused...lost in your "esoterics". Did you read my post to be pro aftermarket powers cords. Because it wasn't. I thought that was clear when I said, "I'm not a power cord guy." Or do you mean to say that you don't think that a product like the power plant does anything other than pass through what comes from the wall? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxg Posted May 30, 2005 Author Share Posted May 30, 2005 Well chortle if you like - but I am really starting to believe this cable is doing something - and we are still talking about the cheaper of the 2. Last night's listening experience was astounding with another varied mix of stuff. Still continuing the testing - with as open a mind as I can muster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hjones4841 Posted May 30, 2005 Share Posted May 30, 2005 kev313: I did indeed misread your post - sorry about that. On the power center question, I have mixed feelings. As far as noise on the power lines, I gotta believe that the power supply capacitors in our audio equipment do an adequate job of filtering. Surge protection is another matter and I strongly encourage the use it - mainly for lightning protection. Surges caused by the power system itself are very rare, regardless of what seems to be "common knowledge." Believe me, the power companies are blamed for far more problems than they actually cause. Brown-outs are a another matter that will become more of a factor as our power generation and transmission equipment gets older and as utility expenditures for maintenance and equipment replacement shrink. A UPS (battery backup) is a good idea for hard drive based HT equipment, like TIVOs, as well as projectors with expensive bulbs (the UPS allows the bulb to cool when the power goes out). There are other factors such as ground loops that can cause noise, mostly hum. Fixes for ground loops include removing the grounding pin from a 3 prong power cord and making sure that all your outlets in the HT are on the same "leg" of the house power box. In the US, the house power box is 2-wire 230V with neutral; we get 115V by connecting between one of the power wires and neutral. A lot of times, the connection between one leg of the 230V to ground is at a slightly different voltage than the connection between the other leg and ground due to unbalances in the voltages to and from the pole transformer. Making sure that everything in the HT is connected to the same side of the 230V line may make a slight difference. I would not re-wire your outlets due to the small potential difference, but this can be easily done during room construction. One of the most difficult ground loops to diagnose, yet the easiest to fix, comes from cable TV connections. The hum appears when the cable is connected, and is gone when the cable is disconnected. The easy fix is to take two 75 to 300 ohm matching transformers (like used on an outside TV antenna) and connect the 300 ohm sides together. Then connect one 75 ohm side to the cable TV and the other 75 ohm side to your equipment. Ok, enough rambling... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRBILL Posted May 30, 2005 Share Posted May 30, 2005 This is "yellow button time". Gee, I miss Paul. DR BILL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisK Posted May 30, 2005 Share Posted May 30, 2005 There's a guy here in the Southern California area that owns a shop where he manufacturers high end audio cables of all kinds. He makes interconnects, power cables, speaker wire and anything else you'd like. He makes some stuff for sale under his own brand along with some "in-house" brands sold at ultra high-end audio "salons" and even does some work for a few of the well known high-end cable companies. What I've learned from him is that the high-end cable business is just about the slimiest part of audio there is. I have some powercords he made for me that I've seen at a local retailer listed at $900 that he sold me for $65. They look really cool and sound great in my system. Trouble is, my system sounded just as great with the original power cords. Once again, I do like the way they look. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hjones4841 Posted May 30, 2005 Share Posted May 30, 2005 What about this power cord that enhances "toe tapping rhythm"? http://www.audioadvisor.com/store/productdetail.asp?sku=KKPK10G10&product_name=PK%2010%20Gold%20High-Current%20AC%20Power%20Cord Or perhaps these for which "The dark or black backgrounds, against which musical notes stand out in relief, have seemingly now gone beyond black," http://www.audioadvisor.com/store/productdetail.asp?sku=KKPK10P12&product_name=Palladian%20PK10%20Power%20Cable The secret? It "incorporates a special copper optimized for 120 volt AC wall voltage, as well as a special conductor dielectric that is devoid of performance robbing color doping" (oh no, not the hideous color doping!) All this for only $1,120.00 ! And don't forget to intall the "premium Wattgate Audio Grade 350 IEC and 330 US wall plug". Funny, that does not appear to be on their website, but here is another one that promises "Stronger Music and Blacker Silence" http://www.audioadvisor.com/store/productdetail.asp?sku=PSAPP Gee, where is truth in advertising when ya need it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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