soundbound Posted June 22, 2006 Share Posted June 22, 2006 I read here the first thing an owner of old Heritage speakers should do is replace the caps or even the crossovers. I agree with this completely as long as you listen to them for a period before this upgrade for reference. I say why not replace all that old wire with new wire while at it. What about the old aged K-33 woofers and diaphragms? I realize that the K-33 can last a very long time and still operate well, but doesn't its suspension system of spider, paper cone, and even cloth surround degrade some with those many years of hard stretching use and aged being exposed to those ever changing natural elements? I opened my diaphragms which operated OK and did they ever look their old age! The woofers and diaphragms do not cost all that much. Bob Crites sells them all at a very low cost. For not all that much money and one can even spread these updates out over time for budget reasons, one can have updated crossovers and all new drivers too making your old Heritage speakers as new. It is great that we can get these woofers and diaphragms at such a low cost. I've seen much higher cost for drivers of other speaker systems. We get off very cheap. My opinion is that new woofers and diaphragms will make the speakers sound better. Opinions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Spinner Posted June 22, 2006 Share Posted June 22, 2006 Whhhhhaaaa .......?? the Diaphrams ....Look Old .....?? where does that "vintage " sound we love .... come from ..?? New Stuf...??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-MAN Posted June 22, 2006 Share Posted June 22, 2006 ...not to mention the dreaded cone-sag. How many times (or how often) have you opened up your Khorns and rotated the driver mount? Let me guess: Never? and neither did the previous owner, and so on. Let's face it - they are big so they get put in the corner and they tend to stay there. But some maintenence is required. Any old speaker is going to have problems that are age related. First thing I'd do with an old pair of speakers is bring them up to factory condition, and that means new drivers and especially networks. DM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndyKlipschFan Posted June 22, 2006 Share Posted June 22, 2006 soundbound not out of disrespect but why change anything unless you hear something wrong. I would never "upgraditus" wise blindly go to get this and that just because?? Look have what you have checked out if you feel it is out of whack.. Upgrade it to specs first live with it a while... THEN and ONLY THEN go the try this try that route.. PWK Roy Delgado all the others have said over n over again.... at klipsch designed it pretty darn good.. Leve it alone!!!! BTW, it always amazes me why people wanna change it all the time without living with it a while too?? Go figure!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-MAN Posted June 22, 2006 Share Posted June 22, 2006 Ah! the old vs. new controversy. Well, you all know my opinion, but since I'm typing already, I'll continue to hammer this one into the ground... If its old - IT IS OUT OF WHACK! Listening won't do a thing about it, either. Without a reference to compare it to, even a Bose setup would sound good, until you compare it to something that is actually good. Listening to it may make you happy as long as you don't realize (or hear others that are "good") that it could be better. So new - or - old : which one sounds better? I prefer new, if given my druthers, and that without even listening to it. All that would do is help me to decide whether I could "live" with it without upgrading for long or not, a financial decision only, not a musical one. DM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Spinner Posted June 22, 2006 Share Posted June 22, 2006 .., and that means new drivers Soooooo....Dana .... Eminence now produces the Exact Same Speaker..... bobbin, wire, paper, varnish, glue........... that PWK used to voice the KH...??? i would submit, then ... that you do not have the speaker... that PWK designed ...... and them new diaphrams for the ... well, whatever version of the K-77 same VC wire, bobbin , varnish, weight, etc ... as PWk ... used to voice the speaker ...??? hey ... it's only Vintage ...Once Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEC Posted June 22, 2006 Share Posted June 22, 2006 Yeah, some people buy an old car and immediately change the old tires, brake pads, fuel and oil filters and even the spark plugs. Then it isn't vintage any more. Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest " " Posted June 22, 2006 Share Posted June 22, 2006 Yeah, some people buy an old car and immediately change the old tires, brake pads, fuel and oil filters and even the spark plugs. Then it isn't vintage any more. Bob yeah Bob, I confess. I bought my son a 1996 z28 camaro last week. The car has 31,000 original miles on it. It had been parked for 2 years in a garage. When I asked about maintenance records, I was viewed as i had two heads. I took the car to a full service facility and had them change out all filters and fluids, battery included. The car ran fine, but hey, 350 bucks was a small price to pay for piece of mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soundbound Posted June 22, 2006 Author Share Posted June 22, 2006 IndyKlipschFan, No disrespect taken. I appreciate your input. I waited two years before updating. I thought my speakers sounded OK. I didn't have new ones to reference them, because I don't know of a store here to go hear a new set of Klipschorns. Let me just say, they sound so much better now! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverSport Posted June 22, 2006 Share Posted June 22, 2006 Yeah, some people buy an old car and immediately change the old tires, brake pads, fuel and oil filters and even the spark plugs. Then it isn't vintage any more. Bob Yup...just safe...[] Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnyholiday Posted June 22, 2006 Share Posted June 22, 2006 Expedite units upon failure,OEM will be the same, upon break in *includes all above&below mentioned parts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seti Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 My Belles were made in 1980 so I doubt there is anything wrong with the drivers. If I were going to update the drivers I would want to keep the original but have them reconed and reedged. Where do you get this done and what is the approximate cost. Also I would think that direct drivers would need to be rebuilt before the horn loaded drivers due to more exposure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEC Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 The problem with having the K-33E woofers reconed is knowing what parts the recone place will use. There are generic kits that will fit, but the actual kit to recone these is made by Eminence and only sold to Klipsch. The price of the kit is about $40.00 from Klipsch and I doubt that any of the recone places use the Klipsch kit. I know that some of the people who have had the K-33E reconed ended up with 8 ohm rather than the 4 ohm voice coil the woofer should have. Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seti Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 The problem with having the K-33E woofers reconed is knowing what parts the recone place will use. There are generic kits that will fit, but the actual kit to recone these is made by Eminence and only sold to Klipsch. The price of the kit is about $40.00 from Klipsch and I doubt that any of the recone places use the Klipsch kit. I know that some of the people who have had the K-33E reconed ended up with 8 ohm rather than the 4 ohm voice coil the woofer should have. Bob Thanks for the info Bob. I guess that is $40 per woofer. At what age would a K-33-E likely need to be rebuilt? Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
popbumper Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 My "old" Fortes and "old" Academy sound FAR BETTER than they did after network upgrades - as do my "old" Cornwalls - so why would I want to bother with changing out drivers? If they started crummy, and still sounded crummy after upgrades, I'd probably start considering driver changeouts. The purpose here is not to RESTORE these speakers, but improve upon what is there originally. If you want to restore them, change out drivers, add new networks, and build new cabinets. You then have a "facsimile" of the original, but NOT the original. There are hobbies for which restoration is desireable - say cars, or pinball machines - but this is not one of those hobbies....I am being nice here, please don't misconstrue my meaning. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEC Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 I don't know that there is an age that can be figured to say when they will fail. Probably has a lot to do with the atmosphere around the speakers. I sell replacement woofers and sell more to people whose speakers are 30 years old than to people whose speakers are 20 years old. Most of the bad ones I have had in here to examine had developed voice coil rubs from deterioration of the coil former. Most also still looked good as far as the cone and all other visible parts are concerned. Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seti Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 I hope I speak correctly here but the bass bins for the Belle, La Scala, and Khorn were built with drivers that operate within a certain range of parameters. I am not sure there is much that can be improved upon as far as drivers are concerned. I am not looking to upgrade or change but if I were to do anything to drivers it would be to keep as close to original spec as possible. If they have drifted out of spec that should be dealt with. When I upgraded my crossovers the only thing Bob changed was the wiring and caps which made them sound more like they did the day they rolled off the factory floor. I am not changing the "Klipsch sound" but rather getting them as close to their original sound as possible which is my goal for these Belles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seti Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 I don't know that there is an age that can be figured to say when they will fail. Probably has a lot to do with the atmosphere around the speakers. I sell replacement woofers and sell more to people whose speakers are 30 years old than to people whose speakers are 20 years old. Most of the bad ones I have had in here to examine had developed voice coil rubs from deterioration of the coil former. Most also still looked good as far as the cone and all other visible parts are concerned. Bob Thanks Bob I'll give them a few more years [] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndyKlipschFan Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 BEC said... Yeah, some people buy an old car and immediately change the old tires, brake pads, fuel and oil filters and even the spark plugs. Then it isn't vintage any more. ===================== Now bob... jesus.. you know exactly what I mean, and I have sent you business to check if they are within specs, and IF they wanted to look into going the upgrade route.. you alk dean have always been suggestions.. (So why the slamm???) I met you last weekend, you seemed like a nice guy, I thought the comment was a slam.. As far as the vintage car is concerned, of course you would do that... but with parts designed FOR THAT CAR if it meant something to you to keep it a classic.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 Bob didn't mean it like that -- there isn't a mean bone in his body. He was just trying to say that performing routine maintenance on things that wear out over time shouldn't be seen as work that is optional. We should also probably refrain from referring to that kind of work as "upgrading". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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